low psi turbo?

[weapon0x2]

I am thinking about turbocharging my laser rs, but i have heard that the NT 4g63 likes to breakdown alot once you add a turbo first of all is that true? and secondly i dont want to stress the engine too much so i was thinking of running only about 6psi of boost so what kind of turbo can run low boost efficiently?

maybe a t25

 

[Alex Bland]

I am thinking about turbocharging my laser rs, but i have heard that the NT 4g63 likes to breakdown alot once you add a turbo first of all is that true? and secondly i dont want to stress the engine too much so i was thinking of running only about 6psi of boost so what kind of turbo can run low boost efficiently?

maybe a t25

im not all to sure so if im wrong people will correct me i hope. N/T engine take some mod's to get them to be able to turbo them. But if you do the mods the engine can easly take 6psi

 

[TheGreatGSX]

im not all to sure so if im wrong people will correct me i hope. N/T engine take some mod's to get them to be able to turbo them. But if you do the mods the engine can easly take 6psi

They usually take a lot of mods and a lot of know how to get them running perfectly. One of my good friends turbocharged his 96 GS, and he ran into tons of issues, if you do go this route, I recommend actually getting a full turbo kit from a reputable vendor that will come with everything that you need. There's actually a few good kits on Ebay (CHECK FEEDBACK BEFORE YOU BUY) although I would probably not trust the turbo themselves that comes with these kits, but I have seen that usually the rest of the parts are good quality.

I have always heard (I may be wrong) that 6psi is a good base to start at when it comes to boost, especially for a DD. A lot of people will also say if you want a turbo, get a car that already has one and is built for one.

As long as you do your research and do it properly and only boost 6psi it shouldn't break down. I would personally go with a 14b turbo though, it'll leave you room to push it a little further than a T25 and I believe most of the turbo kits out there to turn a non-turbo car into a turbo-car are designed to hook up to a 14b and 16g variants.

 

[bastarddsm]

I've been running a turboed n/t for 7 years. I think I know a thing or two about it, so heed my advice.

If your engine is in good shape ~100k miles, ~150psi compression really even across the board, go for it.

I suggest just running a 14b on waist gate pressure, about 11psi.

Get these stock turbo parts: 14b with oil and water lines, ecu, 450cc injectors, injector resistor pack, sidemount intercooler, downpipe, 1g maf and snorkel, turbo oil pan, stock 1g bov, 1g m/t turbo fpr,

Get these after market parts: K&N air filter, Boost gauge, fp race manifold, hard upper intercooler pipe, walbro 190.

Do these mods, and maintanances: ballance shaft eliminator, new water pump, and timing parts, new plug wires, new cheap standard spark plugs, new fuel filter, run good oil (10w-40).

Follow that advice and you should have a relatively trouble free 190whp car, as long as you don't run the dog shit out of it.

Note 1: You will still have a n/t transmission. You will be at about the limit of how much power a stock n/t clutch will take. Mine used to slip at 15psi with a similar setup. You can either get a better clutch, or swap a turbo trans and stock clutch in. I would go the turbo trans route, it should be cheaper, and has better (taller) gear ratios.

Note 2: A n/t trans is weaker than a turbo trans, but you will never break it at these power levels. I didn't break mine at 300whp.

Note 3: You have 9:1 pistons, Everyone will claim they are weak. Not true. I have seen more turbo pistons with broken ring lands than n/t pistons. I have run mine into lean detonation conditions, that I could not believe my motor lived through. Run good gas 91+oct, keep your boost lower than 15, and you will be fine.

 

[TheGreatGSX]

Note 3: You have 9:1 pistons, Everyone will claim they are weak. Not true. I have seen more turbo pistons with broken ring lands than n/t pistons. I have run mine into lean detonation conditions, that I could not believe my motor lived through. Run good gas 91+oct, keep your boost lower than 15, and you will be fine.

So true, listen to this guy he knows what he's talking about

 

[1sttimedsmr]

Everything sound good with his advice except for the fpr, I would leave the stock N/A one on it. It runs a higher psi which will help you compensate a little for having high compression pistons. Some dsmers (including me) switch to N/A fpr to improve fuel pressure.


And about the turbo size , I would go with the t25. Since you are not gonna be running a lot of boost. And also it would spool quicker than a 14b. It could easily give you 12-14 psi. in a blink of an eye. Besides being a lot easier to get a hold of, not mentioning cheaper.

 

[bastarddsm]

Everything sound good with his advice except for the fpr, I would leave the stock N/A one on it. It runs a higher psi which will help you compensate a little for having high compression pistons. Some dsmers (including me) switch to N/A fpr to improve fuel pressure.

I can see your point..kind of, if you had a hacked maf. The dsm ecu fuel tables are extremely rich under boost conditions, like 9.8:1 rich. There's no need to add more fuel.

 

[rx7ttlm]

I have a silly question, How much does it cost to convert to turbo, vs buy a turbo car? stock turbo car can take 400hp... ??? Why not? I got a turbo 97 and haven't looked back .. (coming from rotory world this engine is bad ass) I detonated the piss out of my stock engine and it lived.. (tuning by audable knock is bad btw )

 

[bastarddsm]

I have a silly question, How much does it cost to convert to turbo, vs buy a turbo car? stock turbo car can take 400hp... ??? Why not? I got a turbo 97 and haven't looked back .. (coming from rotory world this engine is bad ass) I detonated the piss out of my stock engine and it lived.. (tuning by audable knock is bad btw )

It shouldn't really cost much at all anything. Most stockish dsm parts are throw away items, but it seems like everyone these days thinks that a 1g maf and 450's are gold.

 

[JusMX141]

i dont want to stress the engine too much so i was thinking of running only about 6psi of boost so what kind of turbo can run low boost efficiently?

maybe a t25

13G's and T25's are great low-boost turbos because they will both spool super-fast and make slightly more airflow in the low boost levels than a 14B or 16G would. Keep in mind none of these turbos are able to run as low as 6psi from the factory because of the spring tension in the wastegate actuator....you'll need an external wastegate or a different (custom) actuator to run very low boost.

Another option if you were going custom would be a straight Garrett T3, perhaps something like a Super 55....something with a small compressor wheel mated to the Stage 1 turbine in a .48 T3 housing. This won't bolt to a DSM manifold, but there are cheap T3-flanged, externally-gated manifolds available if you're on a budget.

 

[ramsack]

Note 3: You have 9:1 pistons, Everyone will claim they are weak. Not true. I have seen more turbo pistons with broken ring lands than n/t pistons. I have run mine into lean detonation conditions, that I could not believe my motor lived through. Run good gas 91+oct, keep your boost lower than 15, and you will be fine.

this is most likely due to the fact that very few people throw a turbo at the non-turbo pistons, and the people with turbo pistons are in fact turboed. i have an n/a block that was in my 91 tsi awd, and it is running like crap lately. my fuel pressure is wayy high, but i suspect my pistons are crap already, and the engine only has like 40k on it. and i only run wastegate boost on a 14b.

 

[bastarddsm]

13G's and T25's are great low-boost turbos because they will both spool super-fast and make slightly more airflow in the low boost levels than a 14B or 16G would. Keep in mind none of these turbos are able to run as low as 6psi from the factory because of the spring tension in the wastegate actuator....you'll need an external wastegate or a different (custom) actuator to run very low boost.

Another option if you were going custom would be a straight Garrett T3, perhaps something like a Super 55....something with a small compressor wheel mated to the Stage 1 turbine in a .48 T3 housing. This won't bolt to a DSM manifold, but there are cheap T3-flanged, externally-gated manifolds available if you're on a budget.

Ugg, why tho? A good 14b can be had for less than $100. t25 and 13g's have exhaust sides that are more restrictive than a 6cm housing. Also, the slower he builds boost the better. The earlier in the rpm range boost comes on the more possibility for detonation downlow.

Its like everyone has to swing dicks by contradicting everyone on everything.

 

[JusMX141]

Its like everyone has to swing dicks by contradicting everyone on everything.

Not trying to contradict, I'm just saying if it were my money that I were spending on turbocharging a non-turbo 1G I'd probably just find a good used T25 core with no wheel damage, rebuild it so that I'm guaranteed a good lifespan, and build my project around that. It's an excellent low-boost turbo that will bolt right on to a DSM turbo manifold and spools rather quickly, and doesn't require a j-pipe.

 

[weapon0x2]

i have a t25 with the corresponding turbo intake manifold and o2 senser/housing so i think i will go with a t25 since that will save me money to buy the rest of the stuff that bastarddsm said i need, and what is the stock wasted psi level of a t25 from a 2g eclipse?

 

[JusMX141]

I believe it's around 10psi if you run a line straight to the actuator head (no boost controller or boost control solenoid).

 

[weapon0x2]

also how will increasing my stock M/T injectors which i believe are 240's or somewhere around that to 450's affect my mpg right now i get about 18-19 mpg in city driving?

 

[ramsack]

without a turbo ecu they will run really rich. and 47 psi of fuel pressure vs. 37 turbo makes it even worse. i believe you need a turbo mas, the injector resistor pack, ecu, fpr, pump, knock sensor (has to be wired in), and probably cluster. if there is more needed then someone can chime in.

 

[TheGreatGSX]

I believe it's around 10psi if you run a line straight to the actuator head (no boost controller or boost control solenoid).

Yes it's around 10psi, I drove my GSX like this for a few days with no MBC or BCS hooked up, it boosted to 10 psi.

 

[atruepretense]

Turbo'ing a N/T car is like a fork in the road to me. One way you go, everything will go great, and the other, everything will fail.

My biggest suggestion is to do ALL your tune ups. Change that damn old timing belt and make sure your balance shaft is gone.

Just run wastegate pressure if you do it. I can't tell you how tempting it is to want to ram the boost up, but be patient on that. You need a lot of bottom end work to see anything over 12psi safely IMO.


Of course....what everyone will say, including me is:

Get a Turbo DSM! Lol. Just think about it this way....

Imagine all the parts you're gonna break, all the clutches, all the headaches from installing the damn turbo, blown transmissions, worst...blown engines, if you piece together all the possible and likely costs of doing this, you could have bought a AWD TSI or GSX and been romping at 15psi with no worries in your life, except for ####ing up what would normally with constant romping..


Good luck whatever way you go.

without a turbo ecu they will run really rich. and 47 psi of fuel pressure vs. 37 turbo makes it even worse. i believe you need a turbo mas, the injector resistor pack, ecu, fpr, pump, knock sensor (has to be wired in), and probably cluster. if there is more needed then someone can chime in.

Then again, he can get around this with some tuning on an AFC. Of course, that may not always be the most effective way around. He definitely won't be able to run that turbo @ decent on stock N/T injectors and pump.

 

[ramsack]

i don't think an afc could tune for injectors that are double the size.

 

[rEclipserGST]

i don't think an afc could tune for injectors that are double the size.

Double what size? I thought safc's were good for 680 injectors.

 

[jrohner]

Everything sound good with his advice except for the fpr, I would leave the stock N/A one on it. It runs a higher psi which will help you compensate a little for having high compression pistons. Some dsmers (including me) switch to N/A fpr to improve fuel pressure.

But that will just mess up his fuel trims unless he gets something to tune with.

 

[ramsack]

Double what size? I thought safc's were good for 680 injectors.

yes on a turbo ecu, that uses 450s stock, but the non turbo is 210, and you are trying to control 450s then, which is the bare minimum of size you need.