How far can you push it with meth injection?

[turboglenn]

Just wonering how far you can push eh boost with water/meth mix being injected at teh throttle body elbow. I hear of people taking them to 34 on average it seems. But this summer i'm hoping to be doing over 400 on pump gsd 24PSI or so, and if it's possible on pump gas + meth i may even turn it up to 28 where i made my peak numbers before. i'm just skeptical of it's capabilities as compared to some good ol C16 or 118 leaded fuel.

How far do some of you push you DD's on pump + meth injection on a big turbo ( some where near a to4e/57trim, with good size front mount.

 

[Burnett03]

Just wonering how far you can push eh boost with water/meth mix being injected at teh throttle body elbow. I hear of people taking them to 34 on average it seems. But this summer i'm hoping to be doing over 400 on pump gsd 24PSI or so, and if it's possible on pump gas + meth i may even turn it up to 28 where i made my peak numbers before. i'm just skeptical of it's capabilities as compared to some good ol C16 or 118 leaded fuel.

How far do some of you push you DD's on pump + meth injection on a big turbo ( some where near a to4e/57trim, with good size front mount.

You live in the corn state.. Why not run e-85? Race gas daily for like 1.99 a gallon.

 

[turboglenn]

Well, the upgrade in fuel setup is too much for me in teh "off season" of my work. Plus E-85 isn't as common here as you'd think, only very few stations have it. ( i just found ut that tehre was at least more than one with the 85) Mainly, i cna fill up on pump gas anywhere, and then i would like to see what meth/water mix could do. I know a lot of people that are runing pure race fuel in their DD's because they are too built, or they don't want to give up boost on teh street. If meth injection is as good as it sounds and can really be pushed, i'd like to test bed it myself and maybe start offering it on cars i install and tune management systems for.

 

[turboglenn]

Damn, does no one want to offer up what boost they run on water/meth injection?

 

[TurboTJ]

I installed a water/meth setup on my turbocharged Jeep. Since methanol is so cheap, I ran straight methanol with no water. Before the install, I was pulling 1.5 degrees of timing per pound of boost. After the install, I had the meth kick in at 5 PSI. I had to pull no timing and had no knock. I haven't got around to installing a setup on my dsm yet but have heard they work wonders. Its basically race gas when you need it.

Hope this helps!

 

[sbcxtreme]

I was able to run around 22-23 on 93 pump with 16-17* peak timing with no meth. After meth(50/50), I was able to run 26psi and 23* timing. It is definately worth it in my opinion. I noticed a huge difference after I upped the timing. This was with a SCM3431rle(Ball bearing 57trim).
If you decide to go with it and want to use a mix of meth/water, make sure you use distilled water from any grocery store. Some guys really like 100% meth, some like a mixture, that is just something you will have to decide what works best for you.
Someone correct me if im wrong, but the more efficient your intercooler is, the less water you will need to run in the mixture. The water will cool the intake charge, and the methanol will raise the octane.
I purchased my kit from Water Injection - Alcohol & Methanol - Stop Knock (Powered by CubeCart) and couldnt have asked for better service from Greg. If you go on that site, it explains it quite a bit more. Hope that helps man.

 

[sbiggi]

A local STI was running 91 octane + 100% meth with a gt35r.
If you run 100% meth injection, it bumps the octane rating up alot.

He was running 130mph traps right up untill the meth injection failed and blew his motor.

 

[sbcxtreme]

If you run 100% meth injection, it bumps the octane rating up alot.

If you dont have a FMIC with good efficiency, then you need the water to cool the intake charge. This is a case by case thing. Just keep an eye on knock.

A good thing about dsmlink, you can set the engine light to come on with 'x' amount of knock. So hopefully if your injection quits working, your light will come on before you do any damage. If you have a wideband, just keep an eye on the afr's. A safety measure to make sure you aren't beating on the car without knowing that the meth is malfunctioning, you can run a light to come on with the solenoid(or whatever the kit includes). If the light is not lit when it should be, then you obviously have a problem somewhere.

 

[turboglenn]

I have no knock sensor ( stand alone with out knock capabilities) althouhg i plan on buying a J&S this spring when temps ride and i've got my meth kit and other things i'm planning done. I tune in the rather old fashioned way of stand alones where there's certain signs to watch for with knock or detonation

I'm hoping to push between 24 and 26 PSi through a posi diff on 26'' slicks using BP brand 92 octane + 100% meth or meth mix. I have a good front mount, but extra cooling never hurt. I was thinking about a 2 outlet kit with one nozzle before the IC and one right before the TB

 

[GORBS88]

I have no knock sensor ( stand alone with out knock capabilities) althouhg i plan on buying a J&S this spring when temps ride and i've got my meth kit and other things i'm planning done. I tune in the rather old fashioned way of stand alones where there's certain signs to watch for with knock or detonation

I'm hoping to push between 24 and 26 PSi through a posi diff on 26'' slicks using BP brand 92 octane + 100% meth or meth mix. I have a good front mount, but extra cooling never hurt. I was thinking about a 2 outlet kit with one nozzle before the IC and one right before the TB

I will let you know what i am running on the street with meth.


Mods are up to date in my profile
I am running 28-29 psi daily with 94 octane and 50/50 mix(blue juice)
M5 and M3 nozzels in the throttle body elbow, I get a max of 16 degrees timing and this is done on a holset hx-35 with BEP housing. I will be going up to the hx40 and then adding some more meth, going to a m15 nozzle.

 

[turboglenn]

Are you running both nozzles at the same time or changing them at certain times ( the M3 and M5 you mentioned ). How long have you been running like this at these boost levels?

Your post is the type of info i'm looking for, keep em coming people.

 

[GORBS88]

Both nozzles are T'd from the main line to run at the same time,and the same pressure.I am running a cooling mist 150psi pump.
Boost has been set at these levels for one full season so far!! No problems yet, it is tuned to 11.5 AFR with a few counts of knock here are there.
By the way the short block is stock with 240,000kms

 

[turboglenn]

So can you run the 10% ethenol (89 octane) blend in your tank to begin with when using meth injection and still get away with large amouns of boost like this? I've ALWAYS run teh 91 or 92 sonce day 1 of owning my car. The cheapest stuff at the pumps here, is the E-10 89 octane. It would be sweet to fill up on 89 octane ( e 10 ) and dump a few bottles of heat and some distilled water in teh tank and take off pushing 24+ psi of boost

Then go to the track and say "i'll even race and smoke you on pump gas"

 

[gsxtasy]

Hey glenn, im puttin a meth kit on my car too, so when it warms up and i can make it up there to omaha, we can see what we can get outta the 3052 on pump+meth! I should have my cams in by then too. O and my WB02.

 

[turboglenn]

Hey glenn, im puttin a meth kit on my car too, so when it warms up and i can make it up there to omaha, we can see what we can get outta the 3052 on pump+meth! I should have my cams in by then too. O and my WB02.

Sounds like a good time. Some tuning,a few beers, some more tuning, then probably wiring up some "extras" and then a few last beers before test running it in the morning the next day.

I should have my meth and cams in by about the same time. I've got a few more tricks up my sleeve with some of the features on the stand alone (antilag, flat shifting, meth control and possibly NOS control). Wooohooo I WILL break 11's this year, with no LSD and no cage and get booted from the track for lack of a cage, and be happier than i've ever been about my car. Even if i do spin through 2 gears, once i hit 3rd, i'm hitting the nitrous over ride, hitting the button for high boost while letting the meth do it's thing, and I'll pull 11's out of the 2nd half of the track

Or if wwe get done tuning and what not early, I'll take you to where all the "ricers" go and we can either hang and look at cars and mostly laugh (although my friend has a 4 door right drive skyline that is NICE, and nice to see in person). There is street racing if you like that sort of thing. Or i can bring my bike out and do wheelies and shit or just pull logs and tune all evening. either way it should be a blast!

 

[gsxtasy]

Sounds like a good time. Some tuning,a few beers, some more tuning, then probably wiring up some "extras" and then a few last beers before test running it in the morning the next day.

I should have my meth and cams in by about the same time. I've got a few more tricks up my sleeve with some of the features on the stand alone (antilag, flat shifting, meth control and possibly NOS control). Wooohooo I WILL break 11's this year, with no LSD and no cage and get booted from the track for lack of a cage, and be happier than i've ever been about my car. Even if i do spin through 2 gears, once i hit 3rd, i'm hitting the nitrous over ride, hitting the button for high boost while letting the meth do it's thing, and I'll pull 11's out of the 2nd half of the track

Or if wwe get done tuning and what not early, I'll take you to where all the "ricers" go and we can either hang and look at cars and mostly laugh (although my friend has a 4 door right drive skyline that is NICE, and nice to see in person). There is street racing if you like that sort of thing. Or i can bring my bike out and do wheelies and shit or just pull logs and tune all evening. either way it should be a blast!

Hell yeah man, sounds like fun! Hopefully we'll both be in the 11's I grew up about 25miles from kearney too, so if we go down there we can crash at my parents house or party in kearney. Good times ahead, i can see it now.

 

[GORBS88]

So can you run the 10% ethenol (89 octane) blend in your tank to begin with when using meth injection and still get away with large amouns of boost like this? I've ALWAYS run teh 91 or 92 sonce day 1 of owning my car. The cheapest stuff at the pumps here, is the E-10 89 octane. It would be sweet to fill up on 89 octane ( e 10 ) and dump a few bottles of heat and some distilled water in teh tank and take off pushing 24+ psi of boost

Then go to the track and say "i'll even race and smoke you on pump gas"

I wouldn't try to run these boost levels with 89 octane, i have never run anything less then 94 octane.
All you can do is try, keep turning the boost up until it starts to knock, but i doubt you will get anything over 24-25psi...

 

[daren_p]

I ran a 50/50 mix of water/meth injection last summer & it allows alot more on pump gas. Pre meth with my knock happy FP1X cams on pump 94 could only run 18-19 psi & maybe see 15 deg advance by redline if I was lucky. I'm running just a small M5 nozzle & this has allowed me to up the boost to 23-24psi & now see 17-18 deg advance by redline. I plan on swapping to a M7 or M10 nozzle for next summer to allow me to run abit more boost. This is all on my FP3052

There are a good number of guys around here runnning big boost on pump with meth injection. One local (IIRC) is running close to 30 psi on his evoIII (of course dropping as rpms increase) & runs 11.6-11.7's in the 1/4. Another local is running 30+ psi (last I heard was running 32 psi) on his FP3075, etc, etc.

 

[dsmulla]

Yeah, Daren is right. This guy here locally is a meth addict as he runs 30 psi Daily with his EVOIII 16G.

 

[turboglenn]

I"ll be happy with 24-26 honestly, my tubo makes the air for a tad over 430HP at that pressure level. I can't measure knock as the stand alone i run relies soley on the tune for it's control, although i would like knock feedback, i'm going to have to buy a J&S stand alone knock unit here come spring time

 

[Spln_Hrd]

I think your goals are reasonable for meth.

I'll come up there and see if I can talk you into an e-85 setup this summer.

Gotta finish up the install on my fuel pump and get a 5 bar map then I will be tinkering with it, logs from dsmlink make it look like fun.

 

[sbcxtreme]

I will let you know what i am running on the street with meth.


Mods are up to date in my profile
I am running 28-29 psi daily with 94 octane and 50/50 mix(blue juice)
M5 and M3 nozzels in the throttle body elbow, I get a max of 16 degrees timing and this is done on a holset hx-35 with BEP housing. I will be going up to the hx40 and then adding some more meth, going to a m15 nozzle.

Have you tried backing boost off a few psi and raising timing?

 

[Burnett03]

Don't get me wrong, water injection is a GREAT mod. I was just suggestion e-85 due to your location. Anyways, i love water injection, it allowed me to run over 23psi of boost on a 60-1 on pump gas. Im on a 16g on my new car and e-85 running 25psi of boost with 22degrees timing. I dont feel a need for water injection, but have thought about adding it just for extra safety. Plus it keeps your inside parts clean.

 

[turboglenn]

I think your goals are reasonable for meth.

I'll come up there and see if I can talk you into an e-85 setup this summer.

Gotta finish up the install on my fuel pump and get a 5 bar map then I will be tinkering with it, logs from dsmlink make it look like fun.

I'm gonna hold you to that when teh weather gets warm again, just warning you But really, yo9u're welcome to come up anytime. I'd love to check out your car and then we can hang (maybe have a few beers) and trade stories, tuning tricks and make fun of local ricers

 

[eclipsegsx1736]

Without meth on my smallish intercooler, 8.8 compression and 91 octane I can only run 19 or so psi and about 15-16* timing. With the 91 octane + meth injection, I'm currently running 30 psi and 18* timing...and that's with the meth pump pressure dialed down. I can't run more than 30 psi right now because my boost gauge is already maxed. I know I have even more room to expand. Flowing about 57-58 lb/min on my GT3076R and 2.3L. Definitely over 500 whp right now.

My meth injection setup consists of a Coolingmist 150 psi pump (set currently to about 120 psi), first stage as an M7 that kicks in at about 8 psi, 2nd stage is an M15 that kicks in at about 20. Past 20 psi they come on together. It's overkill which is why I've dialed down the injection pressure, but I have room to grow with this setup. I run 30 psi all the time, I never adjust my MBC. Way too much power for the street haha