1G Fan size help.. my coolant temp is out of control

[enriquez2000]

I dont have an fmic yet.. i have a koyo radiator with some 13" slim fan that was given to me with it.. no idea what cfm its pulling.i still have the ac fan in place so it comes on in an emergency as intended.

I drove home 2 nights ago(97* out) and check engine started going on and off after i got into atop and go traffic. Plugged in lap top and coolant temps were 240. My gauge in car never moved beyond halfway so since i needed to replace it i went ahead and got a new thermostat to put in while coolant was drained.

Well today it was 85... had laptop on the whole drive to monitor. Temps got to 223 once i hit stop and go again.

At this point i feel the fan isnt pulling enough so im wondering what i should get...

There is a 1710 cfm 13" spal, but that leaves little room for a second fan. I saw some 12" spal that are 1200cfm i think. 2 of thise would net me 2400cfm.

Ive heard bad things about the mishimoto kit with shroud but no personal experience.

Basically i want to buy only once and not do the trial and error thing so im looking for solid input. Ideally id like temps no higher than 205 after the fmic goes in. But definitely 240 with no fmic is bad news already.

 

[GST with PSI]

I've had fan woes in the past: http://www.dsmtuners.com/threads/running-hot-at-idle-stumped.479610/page-2#post-153559559

The one important thing I learned during my trials was that quality fans are superior to anything else. FAL of SPAL fans will actually move the air they're rated to move. 99% of the other slim fans (to include Mishimoto) won't.

If you have the space, I'd recommend the fan I'm running on my Galant in a puller configuration: 12" SPAL high performance puller fan (VA01-AP70/LL-36A)

Depending on how restrictive your air dam is, that fan alone will probably move enough air to keep your car cool at idle. However, I'm running that fan in conjunction with another SPAL 13" slim puller fan (VA13-AP9/C-3 5A). You can literally stand at the passenger door and feel the hot air being pushed out of the engine bay from under the car. Together, these fans move a massive amount of air. If I turn on my A/C and kick them on manually, they will pull the temp all the way down to 160* at idle.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/threads/gstwithpsis-galant-vr4-1837-2000.482807/page-4#post-153566709

 

[92AWDHX40]

I'm running 2 fans here's no issues before that one stock one.

 

[enriquez2000]

I've had fan woes in the past: http://www.dsmtuners.com/threads/running-hot-at-idle-stumped.479610/page-2#post-153559559

The one important thing I learned during my trials was that quality fans are superior to anything else. FAL of SPAL fans will actually move the air they're rated to move. 99% of the other slim fans (to include Mishimoto) won't.

If you have the space, I'd recommend the fan I'm running on my Galant in a puller configuration: 12" SPAL high performance puller fan (VA01-AP70/LL-36A)

Depending on how restrictive your air dam is, that fan alone will probably move enough air to keep your car cool at idle. However, I'm running that fan in conjunction with another SPAL 13" slim puller fan (VA13-AP9/C-3 5A). You can literally stand at the passenger door and feel the hot air being pushed out of the engine bay from under the car. Together, these fans move a massive amount of air. If I turn on my A/C and kick them on manually, they will pull the temp all the way down to 160* at idle.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/threads/gstwithpsis-galant-vr4-1837-2000.482807/page-4#post-153566709

Will those fans work with standard jpipe and fmic set up? Also did you kust attatch to fins or make a shroud?

 

[92AWDHX40]

Nope just slim fans no j pipe here .

 

[GST with PSI]

Will those fans work with standard jpipe and fmic set up? Also did you kust attatch to fins or make a shroud?

Did you not look at the last link I posted?

The 1G has tons more room than the Galant. If these fit on my car, chances are they will fit on yours. You should be able to look at the pictures I posted in the link and answer all your questions.

In addition, you can google the fan part # I posted and get the exact dimensions off of SPAL's website. Yet again, another reason to go with SPAL/FAL fans, as things like dimensions and flow rating are actually documented accurately.

There's literally no guess work here. You should be able to ensure fitment prior to clicking buy it now.

 

[enriquez2000]

Did you not look at the dimensions and flow rating are actually documented accurately.

There's literally no guess work here. You should be able to ensure fitment prior to clicking buy it now.

Sorry on the road... didnt go to the pictures yet. I will go check yours out

 

[ceedawg]

I recently had all of your issues and my cooling issue has been resolved as of these last two days.
I have two 12 inch spal fans(one pushes and one pulls) but that alone is not gonna solve your problem.
I gave in and decided to so ducting , sealing and an undertray for my car.
The undertray was simple as I took off my front bumper to make a template out of card board then used abs pastic to make the undertray which stops just behind the radiator fans to the front of the bumper.
I then seales ofd all the free air air spaces between the 3 cores and yes I still have my a/c and a big ass 4 inch ETS FMIC. The link shows 200 degrees in 99 degree weather stop and go traffic. Let me mention I also did the bumper cutouts which im sure helps since it now exposes the fans to pull in cool air up top like the Evo.
So you can do all this stuff with the fans and water wetter if you like but without ducting and an undertray you will go through the same crap I went
through.


Get the spal fans(did not have to add relays nor do any wire upgrading),use 50/50 prestone,180 degree thermostat

I followed a ton of threads on this issue and i cannot ztress the importance of ducting and how it relates to cooling. My alternator loves it 14.2 volts steady even with my nice high powered sound system. Link shows IATs at 96 degrees cruising sometimes lower. Stand still most i saw was 116 degrees. Im going to build a cold air intake to address that but before all the work i did IATs would hit 140 degrees.

So I would say that with air having no choice now but to go through my fmic condensor and radiator the cores are ru ning more efficiently as are the fans!!

Its been two days now and Incan say success. Next I will put a vent iin the hood to
release more hot air and the pressure increase under the hood from the ducting and undertray.
You may help yourself by just doing an undertray..
I took GSt psi's advice and used the spal fans one push one pull. Pm me for the fan part numbers.

 

[GST with PSI]

I agree that ducting will absolutely help. The problem is, most people aren't going to take the time to do the job well enough for it to have a noticeable effect. Or, in my case, ducting just isn't an option due to how the car is configured and laid out.

Also, ducting will have a negligible effect at idle...Unless that ducting is implemented in the form of a shroud around the fan itself. At idle, the only thing moving air through the radiator core is your fan, which is why it's important to get one that moves a sufficient amount of air. You can bump the efficiency of the fan with ducting/shrouding as ceedawg mentioned, but you'll still be at the mercy of the total amount of air that fan can move.

If anyone pairs up the two fans I currently have on my car in a puller configuration, I guarantee they alone will cool damn near any setup. I'm not using ducting, or shrouding...Just two fans that move a metric f***-ton of air.

 

[enriquez2000]

I want to get the setup of 2 pullers like you have, just not sure if i can fit that 12 high flow. There is a 1710cfm 13"and a 1250cfm 12" slim fan which nets 2960cfm... not sure if that woould work out as well


Also, would cutting the black bumper plastic out on top of bumper of a 1g help at all with air pulling?

 

[GST with PSI]

What would keep you from fitting the 12" high flow? Do you have some pictures of the area of your engine bay?

Like I said, the 1G has a ton more room there vs what my Galant does, and I also have a 4" intake snaking through that area. Unless you have some huge intake pipe, I don't see how that fan wouldn't fit.

 

[ceedawg]

I recently had all of your issues and my cooling issue has been resolved as of these last two days.
I have two 12 inch spal fans(one pushes and one pulls) but that alone is not gonna solve your problem.
I gave in and decided to so ducting , sealing and an undertray for my car.
The undertray was simple as I took off my front bumper to make a template out of card board then used abs pastic to make the undertray which stops just behind the radiator fans to the front of the bumper.
I then seales ofd all the free air air spaces between the 3 cores and yes I still have my a/c and a big ass 4 inch ETS FMIC. The link
shows 200 degrees in 99 degree weather stop and go traffic. Let me mention I also did the bumper cutouts which im sure helps since it now exposes the fans to pull in
cool air up top like the Evo.


So you can do all this stuff with the fans and water wetter if you
like but without ducting and an undertray you will go through the same crap I went through.

Get the spal fans(did not have to add relays nor do any wire upgrading),use 50/50
prestone,180 degree thermostat

I followed a ton of threads on this issue and i cannot stress the importance of ducting and how it relates to cooling. My alternator loves it 14.2 volts steady even with my nice high powered sound system. Link shows IATs at 96 degrees cruising sometimes lower. Stand still most i saw was 116 degrees. Im going to build a cold air intake to address that but before all the work i did IATs would hit 140 degrees.

So I would say that with air having no choice now but to go through my fmic condensor and radiator the cores are ru ning more efficiently as are the fans!!

Its been two days now and Incan say success. Next I will put a ve t i. The hood to release more hot air and the pressure increase under the hood from the ducting and undertray.
You may help yourself by just doing an undertray.

I agree that ducting will absolutely help. The problem is, most people aren't going to take the time to do the job well enough for it to have a noticeable effect. Or, in my case, ducting just isn't an option due to how the car is configured and laid out.

Also, ducting will have a negligible effect at idle...Unless that ducting is implemented in the form of a shroud around the fan itself. At idle, the only thing moving air through the radiator core is your fan, which is why it's important to get one that moves a sufficient amount of air. You can bump the efficiency of the fan with ducting/shrouding as ceedawg mentioned, but you'll still be at the mercy of the total amount of air that fan can move.

If anyone pairs up the two fans I currently have on my car in a puller configuration, I guarantee they alone will cool damn near any setup. I'm not using ducting, or shrouding...Just two fans that move a metric f***-ton of air.

i put the two fans you recommended on my car and at idle and stop and go traffic when it was just 70 plus degrees out side the temp went up,the check engine light on dsm link registering 215 degrees and climbing into the 220s I would put on the heat and shut the car off after pulling to the side of the road.
These are great fans but on my car they were not enough. NOW they work like beasts since I did the work. I'm telling you because I have been dealing with this for over a year now. And I have a 2g so it is going to be different than your gvr4.

I think making an under tray which is easy as hell,putting foam between the radiator support and the radiator may work sufficiently because I agree with you that these fans pull air. Especially with my 4 inch fmic and condenser on the car. I put a piece of paper to the front of my fmic and it stays stuck to the fmic.

Just came in from driving the car in rush hour traffic here in NYC highest temp reading was 206degrees with one fan on. I was experimenting with having the fans on all the time which you program with the link and also with leaving it blank with the fan working like normal with the 2nd fan (a/c fan off) . This setup works like factory. I suspect the bumper cutouts are helping a great deal too.

PS I have no shrouding whatsoever around my fan. One fan on the engine bay side passenger the other on the drivers side mounted front side on the condenser.

FACT nothing negligible about the fact that in 90 degree weather at idle my car temp reads 192 degrees!

GST I can credit you with the fan setup for sure ( I think it was essential to have the right fans thanks to you)and like I said my suspicions say that the bumper cutouts are probably helping the fans out a ton. Here the undertray will help as well if no one wants to do the whole ducting thing. It adds to keeping down the turbulence so that the cooling effect can take effect. They all work in combination. I'm sure you know what I'm saying but it's just for everyone's info.

I used to feel like I walked out of a sauna running the heat and leaving my car. Terrible! Lol

 

[donniekak]

I have 2 spal 30101504's pulling on a griffin radiator. Even with an ets race fmic I can sit in traffic with the ac on in 120* temps.

They must be wired with relays and heavier gauge wire than stock. It also helped my voltage drop when I switched to a galant vr4 alternator.

 

[ceedawg]

I will find the part#s of the two fans I have I believe both are either 11 or 12 inches in diameter. One is a pusher the other a puller. Pulling fans they say work better than pusher fans. My combo does work. Get the Spals like GST says.

 

[ceedawg]

I have 2 spal 30101504's pulling on a griffin radiator. Even with an ets race fmic I can sit in traffic with the ac on in 120* temps.

They must be wired with relays and heavier gauge wire than stock. It also helped my voltage drop when I switched to a galant vr4 alternator.

Yes that's it I saw that you were using those bro! Thanks to you also donniekak! Those are the exact ones I put on 63.00 a piece from either eBay or Amazon. I'm happy thanks to you two wise guys I mean wise men

GST recommended the Spals and you Donnie recommended which ones if I remember correctly. I just like to give credit where it's due thanks to you two guys

 

[enriquez2000]

With current setup id be fine running gsts idea for sure.. just want to be sure the punishment fmic piping wont interfere...

Like i said i only want to do this once

 

[ceedawg]

I have 2 spal 30101504's pulling on a griffin radiator. Even with an ets race fmic I can sit in traffic with the ac on in 120* temps.

They must be wired with relays and heavier gauge wire than stock. It also helped my voltage drop when I switched to a galant vr4 alternator.

I did not have to run relays nor do any wire upgrades. Perhaps because I have a 150amp H.O.alternator that I did upgrade the wires for. I get a constant 14.0 to 14.5 volts . loweest I saw was 14.0 withmy stereo on and the two fans running.

 

[92AWDHX40]

That sucks a lot of issues I have a large fic just running a mishmoto and one fal fan 50 50 mix 180 thermostat stock radiator for now I'm just below 200 .

 

[ceedawg]

That sucks a lot of issues I have a large fic just running a mishmoto and one fal fan 50 50 mix 180 thermostat stock radiator for now I'm just below 200 .

Do you have the condenser as well? That can make a world of a difference. An fmic thicker than 3 inches will,pose issues also.

 

[92AWDHX40]

No condenser 3 inch intercooler this may change looking to pick up a holset this fall. I'll need more cooling. definitely gonna get a mishmoto radiator to keep things in check.

 

[Lou98GSX]

Anytime you have an overheating condition you should always do a leak down test to rule out a blown head gasket . also when you replace the thermostat you should install it with the jiggle pin at 12.00 o clock . on my car when i went external waste gate on the o2 housing i started getting high temps . i noticed this problem when my fan kicked on and would never shut off . so with link i saw that my fan would come on at 212 and the temp would just sit there and never come down and that is why my fan would never shut off . i have the stock main fan and a slim fan mounted in front of the radiator as a pusher . i also wired the main fan to go on high instead of the low speed first . but what fixed my problem was to install a 180 thermostat .

 

[miguelmcv]

Having good fans and a good radiator is a must to have, you can run a 190 thermostat without a problem, a 180 will do no difference which the fans will kick at 190, OBVIOSLY if the fans BERLY KEEP UP, or the radiator is not that efficient then a 180 thermostat will help a lot.
Offcourse this is on a stock form (not hot wire fans).

Remember, dsms are known to run hotter then a regular car.

 

[enriquez2000]

Is there anywhere to just buy the aluminum shroud without the garbage mishimoto fans?

My fans seem to kick on around 200 and shut off at 196... id prefer if there was a way to get them on sooner as well. On my honda i set them to come on at 180 and never see temps above 200

 

[Dsmkauai]

Look on Amazon or eBay. There is a way in link but not sure if it works on 1g. I think it's only the 2g's that can do it. Why not just run then always on? That's how I run mine and have for over 10 years . My car has no issues getting to operating temp .

 

[enriquez2000]

Look on Amazon or eBay.

I put in an email to cxracing too.. shop is a vendor for them so if they sell just the shroud ill get vendor pricing... it lists shroud as a $75 option to the radiator but cant find it by itself

 

[taylork057]

Make sure your new fans are actually pulling the air and not pushing it back towards the front.