DSMlink, why so much?

[Madcap]

We all know Dsmlink is the end all be all of all tuning options for our DSM's. Why is it so damn expensive? In reality all you are buying is a cable, an Eprom and software. You would think someone else would be able to come up with something cheaper. DSMchips is similar to a degree only there's no software to make your own changes.

 

[dsm-onster]

Didn't say your 2g solution wasn't economical. Just said it wasn't free. It costs about 1/2 as dsmlink for a 1995-1997 car.

 

[tkelly27]

The Evo ecu swap has Live Editing and DMA(Direct Memory Access)

Of course your not going to get hardware for free. But there is more then one tuning solution out there. Which is a good thing, competition breeds innovation.
If we didn't have DSMs constantly breaking each others records, we wouldn't have DSMs going as fast are they are today. And if you don't have competition in the tuning world you are going to be stuck with last years outdated software. I highly doubt if we didn't have the progress being made with the EcuFlash stuff lately, that there would be any need for something like Link Lite, people would buy the full version because they had no other option.


The 2Gs don't need eprom ecus and emulators anymore the 98/99 ecus are Flashable and all turbo 98/99s come with them stock, which makes for an economical solution for 2Gs.

People give the 98/99, and EVO ecu's away for a song compared to a 95 eprom too. I've seen EVO VIII units go for $50.

I think it's mostly that people have more $ than time to figure out the "mysteries" of the ecu and how to tune. To each their own, but there are always other options.

When you compare it to a volvo, yes, it's cheap, but when you compare it to a honda, 80's chevies, and fords, no, it's not cheap at all.

 

[SmalltownDSMer]

, I never questioned how great a product it was. I simply pondered where the costs went and I have been rudely informed. A simple case of curiousity.

Think for Yourself, Question Authority.

Sorry man, Wasn't trying to come off rude just giving my .02.

Jayson

 

[motomattxxx]

Wonder if the 98-99 4g64 has a flashable ecu? anyone know?

 

[nuclearr]

I would like to ask you (O.P.) what can you get for less than $600 that does half of what DSMlink does? As far as I know you can not. I was going to run Mega Squirt on my car. Until a small group of (10) us down here in Louisiana asked Tom Dorris to come down here and teach us a quick one day tuning class. After seeing what the program has to offer I like it. Has a ton of features and he has spent countless hours perfecting his product.

As soon as I get my car on the road this is one of my future upgrade plans. Just do not have the money for it right now.

Untill I can aford dsm link I will be running a 99 ecu with Ceddys software. Got an ecu on swap so I will only have to buy the cable.

 

[untouchablecc]

I feel you get what you pay for. I dunno if you guys have any experience with Honda software but i do. For those of you who know what hondata is, its not a bad system, CHROME on the other hand is a joke and its the knock off of hondata pretty much an costs half as much. If someone sold a watered down version of dsmlink for 200 an i payed for it because i was cheaper then the real deal i would be jacked. Your paying for someones invention hard earned work and thoughts. I wouldnt even know where to start making a tuning system but i can use dsmlink all day because someone knew how to make it an then dumb it down for people like me to use. Have you ever priced a AEM EMS dear god link is cheap compaired to that thing and so much easier to use. Beats head off keyboard!

 

[robbo185]

Did someone kick your dog?

Maybe that's it.... maybe they're facists. Any questioning of they're product and no time is wasted to silence the "non-believer."

you're the one who started the thread complaining......this thread needs to be closed

 

[Madcap]

you're the one who started the thread complaining......this thread needs to be closed

Are you serious??? Does anyone believe I have complained about anything? I questioned...... To Question is not to Complain. I even said right off bat that I was going to buy it because it is the most complete solution out there.

 

[tkelly27]

I would like to ask you (O.P.) what can you get for less than $600 that does half of what DSMlink does? As far as I know you can not. I was going to run Mega Squirt on my car. Until a small group of (10) us down here in Louisiana asked Tom Dorris to come down here and teach us a quick one day tuning class. After seeing what the program has to offer I like it. Has a ton of features and he has spent countless hours perfecting his product.

As soon as I get my car on the road this is one of my future upgrade plans. Just do not have the money for it right now.

Untill I can aford dsm link I will be running a 99 ecu with Ceddys software. Got an ecu on swap so I will only have to buy the cable.

A flashable ECU will do mostly everything link does for half the price. Megasquirt will do anything a stock ECU will do and more for $200. I'm not sure what else you want, but it exists.

It's the work you have to put into it that separates a $800 tuning option (link + eprom ecu) from a cheaper version. There are countless people running just fine with megasquirt, eprom editing, and flashable ECU that give a big middle finger to the pay only 'link forums. Other people need it, and they pay for it. "Direct access" and speed density was readily available to anyone who had an ostrich or could burn an eprom years before V3 was released for the 1g and Ceddy posted how to do it for the 2g more recently. It's not black art, it's computer science, and anyone who can read and has enough free time can do it.

There is, (clearly) a market for dsmlink. The circle of people I run with bash on link a lot, but it is something some people need, and I accept and condone it's presence in the market. I don't agree with the solution's they have come up with, but they are providing a service that nobody else is for the DSM community.

Yes there are options that cost as little as $40 to tune your car assuming you have an eprom ECU and know how to change the binary with tunerpro or hex edit. I choose to run one that is ~$200 with an ostrich. It is up to the consumer to decide what they need and how much they are willing to pay for a given tuning option.

If it's done right, you can go just as fast with a keydiver and SAFC as link or DSMap or a stand alone. It's also not that hard to understand what is going on with the code that you are modifying. A lot of people choose to ignore this with 'link, and I accept that, but I think they are missing out on using some brain cells that are interesting and engaging.

Anyway, educate yourself and choose the solution that fits your budget, capacity for understanding, and time frame, not the one that everyone else uses.

 

[robbo185]

Are you serious??? Does anyone believe I have complained about anything? I questioned...... To Question is not to Complain. I even said right off bat that I was going to buy it because it is the most complete solution out there.

maybe so, but the smart aleck comments dont help anything either

 

[Madcap]

maybe so, but the smart aleck comments dont help anything either

I do apologize

 

[1gDSM4g63]

maybe so, but the smart aleck comments dont help anything either

I agree with robbo185. Just because there's no question marking doesn't mean it's a disregarding comment.

Now on to the subject; it's consider cheap especially when the v3 was release compare to AEM EMS. You either need it for tuning your high modified car or you can just settle with an ECMLink v3lite or SAFC and/or a Keydiver chip.

If you have doubts about DSMLink and asking questions as to why a simple cable and an EPROM would cost so much then make it yourself and create economic competition with ECMLink. Mind you the the cable, EPROM and software to tuning the timing, fuel trims, speed density, etc... is very advanced.

 

[4g64fiero]

The value in DSMLINK lies within its user friendliness. I build megasquirts for myself and friends but I use dsmlink on my DDs. Its just too damn easy to use and install.

 

[Rob10_99]

Link has a VERY dedicated design team, a HUGE following, long term invested in programming as well as dedication to quality work. Where else do you find this? AEM & hondata (I know people from both mfg's), and level of detail and understanding of the systems in auto's far supersede 99% of people who work on the cars, regardless of make and model.
If you've bought link in the past they discount $100 for being a repeat customer, at least they did about two years ago last time I got my 2nd link setup.

What you pay for is a very well made product and countless hours of hitting keys, well worth skipping the programming yourself trust me!

 

[1gDSM4g63]

The value in DSMLINK lies within its user friendliness. I build megasquirts for myself and friends but I use dsmlink on my DDs. Its just too damn easy to use and install.

If you says it's so easy to use and install why do you defend the honor of own DSMLink?

It just sadden me when people don't know what they are loosing on.

 

[95gst16g]

I thought the same thing.Why is it so expensive?It's just a cable and eprom chip they sure as hell dont cost that much.But,Then think about Dsmlink its one of the best tuning devices out there for our cars.Think about all the time and money that was spent developing it,Constant updates,great customer service,Would you work for free?Anyways I would buy it again if I had toThey are also working on Ecmlink lite.That should be a little cheaper and it still has all the important features.

 

[Madcap]

Think about all the time and money that was spent developing it,Constant updates,great customer service,Would you work for free?

While I agree, that can also be said for just about every product ever developed.

 

[eazy2g]

We all know Dsmlink is the end all be all of all tuning options for our DSM's. Why is it so damn expensive? In reality all you are buying is a cable, an Eprom and software. You would think someone else would be able to come up with something cheaper. DSMchips is similar to a degree only there's no software to make your own changes.

this is kind of an f'd up thing to say...

A lot of time and R&D has been put into the efforts of creating such a thing that a lot of DSMers use. I personally don't have one but I understand what's put into this type of stuff. Almost like video games. Why the hell do those cost so much when after its all said and done it only cost about $5 to make!

Evo 8 ecu is probably your cheapest bet if you dont want to spend the money...

 

[Madcap]

this is kind of an f'd up thing to say...

A lot of time and R&D has been put into the efforts of creating such a thing that a lot of DSMers use. I personally don't have one but I understand what's put into this type of stuff. Almost like video games. Why the hell do those cost so much when after its all said and done it only cost about $5 to make!

Evo 8 ecu is probably your cheapest bet if you dont want to spend the money...

Good example, Video Games are $60

 

[robbo185]

Good example, Video Games are $60

not a good example.

Yes its a 5 cent dvd the game is on, but do you know how many people that are on a certain video game staff that needs to get paid for the time put in creating the game........just watch the credits after you beat the game.

I can see where you are coming from with the topic, but thats the way business works.

*edit* not trying to sound like a jerk.

 

[1gentalonfan]

That's a good question. In the z32 world (300zx) there really are no options for aftermarket ecus aside form stand alones, but pretty much one company. They do pretty much the same as dsmlink only a LOT better and for half the price. It's called nistune. They do the same thing taking the stock ecu and chipping it, you get a cable and the software and service for about 300 bucks. Link is that expensive because they're well known and like every other well known company, they ass rape people as much as they possibly can. Don't ever forget that modding is just that, Modifying. There is no end all solution for any mod, and half the fun of modding is not being a sheep and following what everyone else does just because "they do it so it must be good." Whatever you choose good luck.

 

[jm1080]

I have dsmlink and I personally think they should have a step by step guide on how to tune exactly. I say that would bring in more customers because I still don't know how to tune exactly. I know a couple things on tuning LTFT and airflow, but that is about it. Jeffsgst guide is very helpful as well, but it is not part of dsmlink. Dsmlink needs something like this otherwise customers won't know what to do with dsmlink...This is something that SHOULD be done in my opinion. Other than that it is a good product.

 

[1gDSM4g63]

I have dsmlink and I personally think they should have a step by step guide on how to tune exactly. I say that would bring in more customers because I still don't know how to tune exactly.

I'm just going to laugh at that. My god.... step by step guide on how to tune your car!

Hmmm... why do you think there isn't a step by step guide on tuning? Possibly... if ECMLink created a step by step instruction manual on how to tune it would hold them liable for how the car performs and if it will which most likely will go wrong.

If you're asking for comments and/or tuning guides post your log on ECMLink.

 

[->PrOjEcTGS<-]

We all know Dsmlink is the end all be all of all tuning options for our DSM's.

It is?

Why is it so damn expensive?

This happens when someone takes their hobby and transforms it in to a cash cow business. Then, they milk the sheep for all they're worth.

In reality all you are buying is a cable, an Eprom and software. You would think someone else would be able to come up with something cheaper.

Yes. You're right... There are cheaper options out there. There is a search feature at the top of this page that can help you find those.

DSMchips is similar to a degree only there's no software to make your own changes.

Similar. yes... And there is FREE software available to make your own changes... But like you said, you'll have to buy some hardware in order to run it. These are costs that would be associated with any EMS.



If you don't think the software is worth $595.00. Don't buy it... Look for an alternative.

 

[JayRolla]

IMO its worth every penny. Just the customer service and Forums are worth the extra cash. Most of the time with the other tuning options you have to pull your eprom everytime you want to make a change. ECMlink allows full tuning on the fly in your car while its running and moving unless using direct access which has to actually rewrite the ecu. Not to mention if anything goes wrong they will just replace or fix it. They are great guys.

Like stated ECMlite should be out soon and should be around $345 and gives you fuel/timing control and speed density. Thats a great price.