2G Cam timing

[lapointebrett]

Im currently trying to time my 4g63 that I just rebuilt. I'm at a point of confusion because when I took the motor apart originally the cam gear(adjustable cam) timing marks were not lined up exactly but the engine always ran smooth besides the slight cam chop. The timing marks line up perfectly now and the marks that I put on them when I disassembled are not lined up, should I use the timing marks on the cam gears or the ones that I marked, ( I also have to hold the intake cam into place for my marks to line up)

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[Dericsh]

Something was not right before. Do those cam gears have two slots for the dowel?

 

[lapointebrett]

Something was not right before. Do those cam gears have two slots for the dowel

I don't think so, but I'm not completely sure what you're talking about. this head was assembled by a local machine shop.

 

[chrysler kid]

Honest answer

I dont trust aftermarket cam gears, some are ment for the evo and are mismarked. Get a set of stock cam gears and line them to top dead center

The exhaust cam will slightly rotate with a belt off them, so they do need to be drawn back to dead center

 

[1990TSIAWDTALON]

The marks and dowels appear correct in the first picture.

 

[Justin DuBois]

What Cam's do you have?
Adjustable CAM gears are intended allow you to advance or retard the cam lobe timing, and some cam's won't even run unless the lobes have been "degreed" to properly set the open and close positions of the valves. This is not something you can do with the engine in the car.

IF (big if) you are running stock cams, reset the cam gears and align the marks like you would a stock gear.

 

[1990TSIAWDTALON]

Absolutely set them at dead up straight zero and leave them alone. I have yet to find any noticeable gains in a OEM stock or fresh aftermarket set of cams that require adjustable gears more than just for the looks, even on my own motors. Just trying to save you time and headaches.
Yes you can squeeze a bit more out and if I were running a 10.02, I'd play all night to get that 9.xxxx but its something I don't recommend other than for checking and learning purposes.

 

[Boomdeeze]

Interesting, my buddy just degrees his cams which fixed his varying idle issue along with the low vacuum. After he did his car with the engine in, I am debating degreeing my 280s to see if I can get a little more vacuum (-6inhg) along with starting a little easier. His car now starts right away and idles great even on a cold e85 start. Mine always takes some cranking and even sometimes some feathering of the throttle.

Absolutely set them at dead up straight zero and leave them alone. I have yet to find any noticeable gains in a OEM stock or fresh aftermarket set of cams that require adjustable gears more than just for the looks, even on my own motors. Just trying to save you time and headaches.
Yes you can squeeze a bit more out and if I were running a 10.02, I'd play all night to get that 9.xxxx but its something I don't recommend other than for checking and learning purposes.

 

[DSMPT]

OP have the right cam gears, it seems it's simply he has set the timing improperly.

Im currently trying to time my 4g63 that I just rebuilt. I'm at a point of confusion because when I took the motor apart originally the cam gear(adjustable cam) timing marks were not lined up exactly but the engine always ran smooth besides the slight cam chop. The timing marks line up perfectly now and the marks that I put on them when I disassembled are not lined up, should I use the timing marks on the cam gears or the ones that I marked, ( I also have to hold the intake cam into place for my marks to line up)

As for the 1st pic, this is a wrong way to show the timing. Don't force the horizontal marks on cam gear lined up. The valve timing is "ALWAYS" against the piston position, so what you have to do is make the timing mark on the crank plate set (and the marks for balance shaft if you still have them) and then take a pic of cam gear's position. Otherwise nobody can tell you if the timing is correct or not.
As for the 2nd pic, this is totally wrong.

the cam gear(adjustable cam) timing marks were not lined up exactly but the engine always ran smooth besides the slight cam chop.

The car runs even the timing is a bit off until you bend the valves.

should I use the timing marks on the cam gears

Yes, absolutely. Just take your time to set the timing, don't rush.

or the ones that I marked, ( I also have to hold the intake cam into place for my marks to line up)

No, don't even think about that.

I dont trust aftermarket cam gears, some are ment for the evo and are mismarked

They are not mismarked unless the gear is knock off. It's just EVO 4-9 has different timing mark from DSM and many people get confused by the EVO 4-9 timing mark when setting the timing on DSM (early 4g63).

 

[chrysler kid]

OP have the right cam gears, it seems it's simply he has set the timing improperly.



They are not mismarked unless the gear is knock off. It's just EVO 4-9 has different timing mark from DSM and many people get confused by the EVO 4-9 timing mark when setting the timing on DSM (early 4g63).

you honestly think some one who cant figure out how to line up timing marks should have adjustable cam gears?

He still hasnt verified which camshafts hes running

 

[DSMPT]

you honestly think some one who cant figure out how to line up timing marks should have adjustable cam gears?

If I have to say if he needs adjustable gears or not, then he doesn't really need adjustable gears, since the adjustable cam gears are to degree cams and change the valve timing to suit with your usage of the car.
But it doesn't really matter if he has the stock gear or adjustable gear. As long as if the adjustable gears are for the early 4g63 and are set at zero position, that's the same as the stock gears. In the pics I can see at least the intake gear's center hub position is at zero (Assuming the exhaust side is the same) and the gears are for the early 4g63, so I guess the OP just set the timing improperly in this case.

 

[Justin DuBois]

Interesting, my buddy just degrees his cams which fixed his varying idle issue along with the low vacuum. After he did his car with the engine in, I am debating degreeing my 280s to see if I can get a little more vacuum (-6inhg) along with starting a little easier. His car now starts right away and idles great even on a cold e85 start. Mine always takes some cranking and even sometimes some feathering of the throttle.

Yes - this
Would love to see the process on a 4G63 Video?

 

[Dericsh]

Yes - this
Would love to see the process on a 4G63 Video?

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[1990TSIAWDTALON]

If you want to squeeze everything out of it, degree them. If you are happy with your car at dead up, leave it alone. I am lucky, my cars fire right up, no idle issues or feathering ever. I hit the key from outside the window and they start. In my experiences, if you are following the cam card, the cams I have degree'd in were either right as is or 1 or 2* off on one cam but not both so I don't bother anymore. It is something I would mess with at the track or on a dyno.

 

[lapointebrett]

Thanks guys I appreciate all the answers, these cam gears and hks cams were already in the motor before Im just reusing them on the rebuild. I just went with the OEM timing marks and put the belt on, everything should be good but I'll give an update when I start it up