Another 'no start' when its cold outside

[Eclipsionz23]

hey all..i wanted to post my 'no start' problem because believe it or not, it seems a bit unique. Ive searched and found some issues that were similar to mine, but not enough to convince me yet of what might be wrong with my car. I have a 97 NT that will NOT start when its very cold outside....very cold as in low 20s and below. (thats pretty cold to me) The car will NOT turn over. The lights on the dash come on as normal but im having to turn the key on and off about 465 times and then it might start. EXAMPLE: I get up to leave for work this morning and its pretty cold outside....car will not start/crank over. My GF takes me to work. I get home from work 4:30 - 5pm and its warmer outside, i turn the key only about 5-6 times and it fires right on up. When it cranks over, it starts every single time. no hesitation when it cranks over...itll start. its just on very cold starts is when it will not crank over. I did notice on saturday when it wouldnt start that the positive post on the battery had a little corrosion on it. So i cleaned it up pretty good on sunday, and after a few turns on the key, BAM, it fires up. I drive it to work on monday when it wasnt all that cold, no problems, and as i said earlier, this morning, no start. I get home tuesday from work, after a few turns of the key, fires up. I dont understand. I did notice that my thermostat housing is leaking a little and dripping onto those two sensors that sit right below...I know thats not any good and ill fix that this weekend, but would that cause the problem im having? Could it be something as simple as a battery/ starter wire? Maybe something in the ignition?? ANY help/advice would be much appreciated. Thank you in advance

 

[cisco818]

What'd up man. Looks like your having the same problem I did. It could be a few things but first try the thing that worked for me. Remove the cablesfrom the batterry grab a limon and bakiing sooda. Clean the part where the cables connect to the battery starting with the limon first. Then add the baking powder and scrub with a WIRE brush. The baking soda should cause a chemical reaction and start bubbleling up and clean it right up. Then after you wipe it make sure you put the cables back real tight so movement wont move your cables. Hope it helps

If you already cleaned it then it could be the bbatyery. I had a duralast and it would never want to start in the cold. Burrow a battery from another car for a few minutes and confirm tha its the battery before you go out and buy a new battery

 

[bullettdsm]

You guys are both on the right path. This situation is indicative of a bad connection that's generated by the cold contracting the metal/wire........... somewhere . And that's the rub; where is the bad connection?

I would start with the battery cables (both positive and negative) by cleaning them off (baking soda is fine) and giving them a quick sandpaper/emery cloth so the connections are good. Do a visual of the cables to see if there is a possible break or wear spot in the wires that would produce a poor connection. Do the same for the wires at the starter.

MB

 

[Eclipsionz23]

Thank you guys for the replies! My car started this morning on the first try as well as when I left work...and the gym. Ill mess with the cables this friday for sure and clean them up the best I can. I just hope thats what it is. Should I rule out that it could be an ignition switch problem? What are some symptoms of those things going out? Some info that Id left out before: my CEL is ON and has been for the past 5 years or so. I was going in every so often to have the codes pulled to see if anything major came up, but I cant anymore. For some reason or another, I cant get a reading from my OBDII port. I was told and have read that its my cigarette lighter fuse thats blown, but thats not it! I use that every single day for my phone to charge. I dont know why it would crap out all of a sudden. Im having other issues with the car aside from the one that i posted a yesterday and cant get any readings. Anyways, thanks again greatly and if anyone else has any ideas, please share them

 

[willwonderlama]

This might be a long shot but if the battery has low CCA's and also older possibly weaker could have an effect on it , liked said long shot. Ran into that issue with a WRX I owned.

Another thing that could be a factor coupled with weak battery and low CCA's is oil viscosity, the thicker she is the slower it will crank especially when it's colder.

But more then likely it's something else like one of the sensors, can't remember which on off the top of my head, that tells the ecu to "cold start" I believe it's called

Hope this helps and good luck

 

[bullettdsm]

This might be a long shot but if the battery has low CCA's and also older possibly weaker could have an effect on it , liked said long shot. Ran into that issue with a WRX I owned.

Another thing that could be a factor coupled with weak battery and low CCA's is oil viscosity, the thicker she is the slower it will crank especially when it's colder.

But more then likely it's something else like one of the sensors, can't remember which on off the top of my head, that tells the ecu to "cold start" I believe it's called

Hope this helps and good luck

Don't guess

The ECU uses info from the intake air temp sensor and the coolant temp sensor to know what temps are. There is no "cold start" sensor on a 420a.

Its obviously not oil viscosity because once it starts to crank, it starts the car right up. Plus it does it when the car is already warmed up.

Its obviously not cold cranking amps, because again, when it starts to spin, it fires right up. In addition the car is already warmed up........nevermind. Op disregard willwonderlama's post.

Op, could it be a problem with the ignition switch? Meh, slightly possible. Remember what we are looking for is a break in the electrical system that doesn't allows the car to turn over. When you turn that key to start the car, there is a wire that tells the starter to turn over. The "meh" in my answer is because you say you are hearing a "click" I'm guessing that's a click at the solenoid of the starter. Meaning that the power is making it out from the switch to the starter. The thought is that there is a bad connection that doesn't allow full power to go to the solenoid. Hence the reason to check the connections from the battery to the starter.

Now could it also be a starter problem? Yes, that's possible. A poor connection between within the solenoid. But from your description, I'm not leaning that way.....yet

MB

Oh yeah, for your cel's, you can do the "keydance" to see what they are. Look on this link and you can see how to do and understand the keydance; http://www.2gnt.com/index.php?d=PCM_Error_Codes

 

[willwonderlama]

Ouch def for burned on that one I apologize, I was on my 18th hour of no sleep at work and completly miss show how 420a I am uneducated in the 420a I was just taken to school.

In my defense though I said long shot for oil viscosity and battery.
Lesson learned no more zombie replies sorry Op.

 

[bullettdsm]

Ouch def for burned on that one I apologize....sorry Op.

No problem, its happenned to most (yes, even I have gotton a couple of warnings, . That was of course back in "Defiant" days). I'm just glad you manned up and didn't whine it out. Just work on posting up helpful information and this will all go away

MB

 

[greydelta38]

Just a suggestion, if you're driving manual, I would disable the clutch safety switch under the dash. It's a lot easier on the crank to start it without having to push the clutch in during the cold weather.

As for the no start, I'd be tempted to say you have no contact to the battery. Maybe it's a low quality battery, or the cold affects the contact, etc. My GST really doesn't like starting in the morning either.

 

[Eclipsionz23]

Again, thank you ALL for the suggestions. I just got home and have not had any problems starting my car today....but its been warmer the last 2 days. Correct me if im wrong, please, but if there is corrosion happening at the end of the cable (pos+) that connects to the battery, theres a good chance that theres corrosion throughout the entire cable? And if thats true, that build up on the inside of the cable WOULD interfere with making a complete connection interrupting a successful start? Remember: when it wont start, im meaning that there is no cranking over whatsoever, and when it does crank over, it starts. However, i did have a problem with my car stalling on me with no warning whatsoever about 2-3 months ago...FUN STUFF. Something was getting too hott and the car would not start WITH it cranking over...but thats a whole other story...

Anyways, i have plans to change out the pos+ and neg- cables tomorrow. Im just hoping that its not all that expensive!!?!! With Christmas just around the corner, im strapped for cash. Thanks again guys, and thank you, Bullett, for the KEYDANCE info. Ill definitely be checking that out for sure
Take care guys and ill check back in very soon!

well i just performed the key dance and came up with this:

12-direct power input to the PCM has been disconnected within the last 50 key-on cycles

32-EGR System Failure-Harness and connector / Electric EGR transducer solenoid / EGR valve / EGR tube clogged / Vacuum hoses

31-Evaporative purge flow monitor failure -Evaporative purge solenoid / Clogged purge line / Vacuum hose / Evaporative emission canister clogged / You're Turbo with a 97, 98, or 99 2GNT

55-end of error messages

Now, if my memory is correct, i do remember the codes 32 and 33 from a while back and ive had this fault for quite sometime. these are minor issues, correct? And could someone go into depth about the code#12 please? im guessing its just saying that the port is not functioning, basically.

ill be leaving here in a bit to go to the parts store and getting cables. Hope my car starts!

 

[starfish]

I'm not sure what kind of terminals you have,but you can save yourself some money by gettin some baking soda and some water and make a paste.take apart your cables and terms and scrub with the bakingsoda real good.Best to let it soak for awhile,then rinse real good with water.If you allready bought new terms,you should clean the cables before hooking it all up.Hope this helps you out.Check the fridge for baking soda!

 

[Eclipsionz23]

yea, i cleaned everything up really good on saturday. I held off on buying new cables because i wanted to thoroughly inspect everything before I went and bought new parts. I took the starter out, cleaned it up to where it looks brand new, cleaned all connections...everything. Cleanded the battery posts up along with the terminals. Put everthing back together and it still took a couple turns of the key before I could get it to turn over. Im beginning to think it could be the solenoid in the starter about to go or the ignition switch? Question: if it is the ignition switch and I go buy a new one, will I have to replace the cylinder too? Never changed one out before, so I dont know. Im not giving up on this because its gotta be something really simple.

Thanks guys!

Eric