cold start problem

[phill]

I don't know where this should be posted but since I'm a new member I could only post here. (how do I become a proven member anyway?)

when I go to start my car after it has been sitting for an extended period of time it'll start up just fine and die instantly. One thing I did notice is that it only hits about 1000 rpms before it cuts out.

I recently replaced my IAC and later had a problem with the radiator fans not coming on and causing it to over heat. Somehow, I don't know how exactly, the fans work now and she stays cool just fine. This might have something to do with it because my dad and I both thought it was something electrical.

I have fuel, I have spark and its only on cold starts. if I start it and give it some gas for a second or two it'll run just fine.

any ideas?

 

[phill]

When I first searched I only looked in the 420a forum, but I saw one guy with a gst is having the same problem.

they were talking about a coolant temp sensor? Where is this located on a N/T and what does it look like?

 

[DSMcrazy3]

Does it maintain idle at all? Or once it revs upon ignition does it fall down to 0 and shut off?

 

[96TurboGS]

I'm willing to bet it's the CLT. You have pointed out all the failures, its obvious. Change it and tell us what happens during the next 5-10 power cycles after you reset the ecu. Your on the right track. The sensor is located under your radiator hose. Its the biggest sensor with a wire harness.

 

[rstare]

First of all, yes this is the right place to post. 50 posts makes you a proven memeber.
I agree with Shadow on the CLT, it often causes funky stuff like this.

 

[phill]

The goofy thing is there is no check engine light. But that probably broken as well

I'll run by the checker today and see if they carry it.


and DSMcrazy3, It just has that initial rev and then shuts off. The only way it holds an idle is if its warm or I give it a little gas

 

[phill]

Ok I bought the sensor. I'm installing it tomorrow. Is there anything I should know before install? should I seal the threads with anything?

 

[phill]

I replaced the plug this morning and it still wont start cold. The CEL is for an EVAP purge solenoid, what does that do and could it be causing my problem?

 

[tegster1]

Well I know its against the rules and all but "I believe" that the purge solenoid will send any excess fumes, which it gets from the canister(which in turn comes from your fuel tank), back into the intake manifold to be burned. Kind of like a recirculation not to waste ANY excess gas.

Mods correct or delete this if its wrong but I read it in my Chiltons and cant quite remember how it went.


In short answer...No it will not cause your problem as I dont even have mine hooked up I think thats what my CEL was on to begin with anyway.

 

[DSMcrazy3]

Try turning the key to the on position and leaving it there for a second or two, then starting the car. Let me know if that changes anything.

 

[phill]

no it didn't change anything. Should I just replace the other sensor there as well, the little one?


here were my codes:

P0455 - EVAP large leak detected.

P0340 - PCM has detected that a malfunction exits in the electrical circuit for camshaft position sensor "A".

P1490 - low speed radiator fan control relay.

 

[DSMcrazy3]

The little sensor? On the thermostat housing? If that's what you're talking about, then no. That little sensor is just a sender for the temperature gauge(which I assume is working fine).

P0455 - Shouldn't cause the car not to run. This might be a leak in a hose for the evap, or the valve on the front right of the engine could be bad. It's tough to pinpoint this one. Even the gas cap could be faulty.

P0340 - This is most likely the cause of your no start issues. The car will not run without the cam sensor or the crank sensor. Check to see if it's loose or anything. Check the wiring as well.

P1490 - When air isn't being forced into your radiator (high speed) the fan kicks on to make up for the lack of air being forced. Without this you're subject to overheating. Check/replace relay.

 

[phill]

thats all I thought the sensor did but I'm still learning so I just wanted to check.

with the cam sensor i thought it wouldn't run at all, I don't see how its just on cold starts

 

[DSMcrazy3]

The sensor could be on its way out, causing it to function differently at different temperatures. Regardless of whether it should or shouldn't run, there is something wrong with the sensor which needs inspection.

 

[VelocitàPaola]

P0340 - This is most likely the cause of your no start issues. The car will not run without the cam sensor or the crank sensor. Check to see if it's loose or anything. Check the wiring as well.

The car will actually run without the cam sensor, but it cranks for a little while before starting. When my cam sensor died, it would take equally long for the car to start when it was hot or cold.

 

[DSMcrazy3]

The car will actually run without the cam sensor, but it cranks for a little while before starting. When my cam sensor died, it would take equally long for the car to start when it was hot or cold.

So, are you ruling it out then?

 

[VelocitàPaola]

So, are you ruling it out then?

No. I was just clarifying what you said.

OP, I would take a look at the wiring leading to the camshaft position sensor. Perhaps it's melted against the EGR tube?

Barring that, definitely replace the sensor itself. Like Josh said, the other codes shouldn't create a no start condition.

 

[phill]

I took a look at the wires and everything looked god so I took off the loom around them and everything still looked good.

After about an hour and a half at the junk yard and almost 20 cars later I'm just getting one off ebay.

is there a gasket or anything that goes bet wen the head and the sensor that i'd need?

 

[VelocitàPaola]

Yes, there is an O-ring that seals the sensor against the head. Oil will leak from this location without that O-ring.

If you want to give the junkyards a second shot, remember that some Dodge Avengers used the same 2.0L 420A engine, and I believe the Neon CPS's are identical.

 

[phill]

Yeah and some of the cloud cars too I guess. I looked in them all. It was my luck that in every car there was a full engine tranny wire harness but no sensor


But listen to this, I took my IAC out because it wasn't doing this before I swapped them out. the book said do it when its cold so i just set an ice cube on the temp sensor and pushed the pin like thing all the way in and reinstalled it and it started beautifully. I'm going to let it sit until after work because it will really be cold and I'll let you know what happens.

when it started up the rpms hit 2000. Is that normal? its been so long since its idled right I cant remember

 

[DSMcrazy3]

Your car should not be idling at 2000. That problem most likely has to do with the EVAP code, meaning you have a vacuum leak.

 

[phill]

no no no only the initial start up hits 2000, it idles right about 800rpm

 

[DSMcrazy3]

The initial rev is normal. As long as it's a smooth idle at 800 it sounds fine.

Re-pull the codes, still be sure to fix the problems causing them. Be sure not to write them off just because the car runs now!

 

[phill]

Is there a way to adjust the IAC? or do you just shove it in and go?
I think that is where the problem lies. Thanks so much for all of your guys' help.

 

[96TurboGS]

Nope, unless you want to block it off and set the throttle plate screw on the TB. It is plug and play.