Align honing.. OEM tty's or Arp studs.

[looseboost]

So before I begin I will mention that I have read all threads posted related to this subject, I am however looking for opinions specific to my situation. My block has been at the machine shop for almost 3weeks were I have had everything performed that is typical procedure, I'm expecting to pick up the block mon/tue, I already have everything that I'm using for this build in my possession, weisco 8:3's and eagle h beams and arp fasteners. The engine ran fine but needed rings so I opted for a full rebuild. Sooooooo through my continued research I ran into the subject of align honing when using arp main studs, I have several questions pertaining to this.

1. Is align honing or boring required hands down regardless of the condition of the block or crank?
2. What are the limits of the OEM bolts? (I would buy new if I have to)
3. If all of my tolerances are correct can I use the arps without align honing/ boring(torquing down and checking clearances)
4. Has any one experienced failure from not align honing with Arps?
5. Should I just use OEM bolts so can finally put this thing together?

As always thank you all in advance.

 

[Tyeler18]

So before I begin I will mention that I have read all threads posted related to this subject, I am however looking for opinions specific to my situation. My block has been at the machine shop for almost 3weeks were I have had everything performed that is typical procedure, I'm expecting to pick up the block mon/tue, I already have everything that I'm using for this build in my possession, weisco 8:3's and eagle h beams and arp fasteners. The engine ran fine but needed rings so I opted for a full rebuild. Sooooooo through my continued research I ran into the subject of align honing when using arp main studs, I have several questions pertaining to this.

1. Is align honing or boring required hands down regardless of the condition of the block or crank?
2. What are the limits of the OEM bolts? (I would buy new if I have to)
3. If all of my tolerances are correct can I use the arps without align honing/ boring(torquing down and checking clearances)
4. Has any one experienced failure from not align honing with Arps?
5. Should I just use OEM bolts so can finally put this thing together?

As always thank you all in advance.

If you're using ARP's it's going to have to be align honed. It WILL deform differently than if you're using OEM bolts.

If you're using OEM, you could get by without, although I'd definitely recommend it.

You've made it this far into your build, I'd spend the $150 (or whatever it is) to have it done and just ensure it's done properly. I ended up having to scrap the align hone on one build due to hitting a very serious time and money restraint. Now I wish I had it done. Everything in my engine is ARP minus the mains, pretty sad in my opinion I spent all that money to have the mains be the weak point, but I literally would've been screwed at the time had I had it done.

 

[looseboost]

I'm in a similar situation, I gotta move plus I opted to return to school so really gotta get this thing buttoned up, this just threw another monkey wrench in my build, if I was aware of this from the beginning then I would not have been such a big deal.

 

[Tyeler18]

I'm in a similar situation, I gotta move plus I opted to return to school so really gotta get this thing buttoned up, this just threw another monkey wrench in my build, if I was aware of this from the beginning then I would not have been such a big deal.

That was exactly what happened to me, I was moving for school.

I would do it if you can, I definitely regret not doing it. It's a bit more money, but that's about it. Time-wise a good machine shop should be able to knock it out real quick.

 

[My1GLaser]

I replaced my mains with new OEM bolts when I built my motor 6 years ago. It has 20k miles on it now. I had the main caps off 2-3 years ago and again last year and they look great! 35-38 psi on an HX35 at 58ish lb/min which is probably about 550whp. I don't think I am anywhere near the power that I would have to worry about them!

Hmmmm, I didn't think the OEM mains were TTY...

 

[looseboost]

My options at this point are OEM bolts with no align hone which I would have to buy the OEM bolts, or use the Arp's that I already have, take them to the shop the day I'm supposed to pick up the block tell them to install them and re check the clearances. The local machine shop does good work in my opinion however there pretty high volume so this may add another week or so.... Not sure what to do. @ My1glaser I'm not quite sure if the OEM bolts are tty's either.

 

[NHerron]

There's plenty of info on this and that's just on tuners, but it all comes down to what the machinist finds. Sometimes yes sometimes no, if it's out of spec-align hone as needed.

 

[dot45]

Don't wait until the day your supposed to pick it up. Unless that's Monday.
Call them and get the arp's over there as soon as you can. Giving them a heads-up, might give them some wiggle in getting your block done sooner. Be honest as to why your on a time constraint.

 

[BogusSVO]

With a 6 bolt or 7 bolt block with ARP mains, Install the ARP torque to speck and check main more.

If with in spec, remove caps, then install bearings. check the bearing ID then subtract crank journal size

(this will give you oil clearance spec)

If the main bore is out of spec when torqued, then line bore/hone as needed.


6 bolts at times need to be aligned honed/bored

7 bolts a bit more often.

Commonly, the blocks that need lined honed with ARP, still need it with the factory main bolts

6 bolts have a torque spec for the mains

7 bolts have a TTY spec for the mains

 

[Tyeler18]

^^ Agreed. My machine shop was about a week to 2 weeks out when I first came in. They wanted to know how soon I need everything done and told them as soon as I possibly could. I was spending so much money with them they were more than happy to push some work back a bit to hammer out my stuff. My head I actually dropped off on a Wednesday and picked it up on Friday. I've had similar luck with other machine shops I've used.

 

[looseboost]

First I'd like to thank you all for your responses. My plan is to take them the arp's that I have first thing monday and let them check the clearances, regardless of what happens i got to much invested in this build to cheap out now, once I get some info from the machine shop I'll report back here with it.

 

[looseboost]

So I got the bolts to the machine shop, and I was told by the lead machinist that he rarely runs into main cap distortion on 6 bolt 4g63's however he stated that he would take my bolts torque them down and check for out of roundness, if he ran into it he would align hone/bore for $120. So got that part sorted ..now to the ?uckery...I had already purchased std bore weisco 8:3's from a friend, however the machine shop left a message on my phone Friday (didn't check voicemail) that the bores were worn enough to demand a .020 over bore piston and that the weisco's and new rings I had wouldn't work ( so I put them on ebay) did as much additional research that I could on pistons in an hour as I needed to get them overnighted and choose Ross 8:3's, the machine shop is aware of my time crunch and said once he got the pistons he would do everything in his power to get back to me by Friday. Sooooo ready to put this thing together I will start a thread on my dsm experiences.

 

[Tyeler18]

So I got the bolts to the machine shop, and I was told by the lead machinist that he rarely runs into main cap distortion on 6 bolt 4g63's however he stated that he would take my bolts torque them down and check for out of roundness, if he ran into it he would align hone/bore for $120. So got that part sorted ..now to the ?uckery...I had already purchased std bore weisco 8:3's from a friend, however the machine shop left a message on my phone Friday (didn't check voicemail) that the bores were worn enough to demand a .020 over bore piston and that the weisco's and new rings I had wouldn't work ( so I put them on ebay) did as much additional research that I could on pistons in an hour as I needed to get them overnighted and choose Ross 8:3's, the machine shop is aware of my time crunch and said once he got the pistons he would do everything in his power to get back to me by Friday. Sooooo ready to put this thing together I will start a thread on my dsm experiences.

They didn't punch your block out yet have they? They're going to need the pistons to properly bore and hone the cylinder. I suppose they could bore them now, but they'll hone them out to the piston for each cylinder to ensure proper clearance.

 

[looseboost]

@tyeler18 he was goin in to set my ptw and realized it would be far to much clearance between the piston and wall, that's why I put a rush on the pistons he also needs them for balancing, I personally thought they were a little further along than this, but he said he would do his best to accommodate my time crunch.

 

[looseboost]

Little late guys but I got my block back last week everything checked out great no need to align hone, almost got everthying bolted up will post pics in my new thread thanks for the help. (Resolved)

 

[Ghost_92TSi]

With a 6 bolt or 7 bolt block with ARP mains, Install the ARP torque to speck and check main more.

If with in spec, remove caps, then install bearings. check the bearing ID then subtract crank journal size

(this will give you oil clearance spec)

If the main bore is out of spec when torqued, then line bore/hone as needed.


6 bolts at times need to be aligned honed/bored

7 bolts a bit more often.

Commonly, the blocks that need lined honed with ARP, still need it with the factory main bolts

6 bolts have a torque spec for the mains

7 bolts have a TTY spec for the mains

So what you are saying is it may not be necessary? I was reading through this and it made me nervous. I just switch machinist after finding out the last one belt sanded my head. I asked the new one about the align hone on my 6 bolt and he said if I didn't have a problem before then it would be fine. Had the studs in place still. It was never done the first time due to not knowing. Good work is hard to find. Bogus move out to Texas.