AFCII+660cc inj= too much timing advance?

[kazzam]

I been reading about people having problems using the afcII and 660cc or bigger injectors. I want some feedback and opinions from AFCII users with big injectors on how their setup is working out and how they handle things.
Is your timing advancing too much? (past 17 at redline, how far?)
How do you handle your timing issues with an AFC if you can't directly control it?
Do you have difficulty getting the car to idle well and how do you fix that?
Any other problems not mentioned above?

I am planning on running 660cc inj, 255lph rewired pump, and AFC with a pocketlogger.
I have 50trim, fmic, clutch, and other bolt-ons. Any suggestions or comments?

Any feedback is appreciated!

 

[project_tsi]

I currently run a 50trim, FMIC, 255 high pres. pump, no rewire kit. Aeromotive FPR, Maf Translator W/ GM 3" Maf, and S-AFC II. And honestly, I can't get the AFC to take away enough fuel! I just run Pig ass rich, all time. I have no boost leaks either. Fuel press is set to 42psi. I can hardly get the car to idle, barely, some times it will, others it will die, or just keep rising, then fall, etc. I am so frustraded that I am now looking for a eprom ecu and will be switching to the DSMLink setup, what I should have done in the first place, and youll be seeing my S-AFCII for sale on tuners shortly.

 

[CanadianTSi]

I run a 50 trim with some 650's and a 190, I get right around 19-20 degree's at 7500 which is just about perfect IMO.

 

[Burnett03]

I currently run a 50trim, FMIC, 255 high pres. pump, no rewire kit. Aeromotive FPR, Maf Translator W/ GM 3" Maf, and S-AFC II. And honestly, I can't get the AFC to take away enough fuel! I just run Pig ass rich, all time. I have no boost leaks either. Fuel press is set to 42psi. I can hardly get the car to idle, barely, some times it will, others it will die, or just keep rising, then fall, etc. I am so frustraded that I am now looking for a eprom ecu and will be switching to the DSMLink setup, what I should have done in the first place, and youll be seeing my S-AFCII for sale on tuners shortly.

bring the fuel pressure back down to 38psi base

 

[urcnjoe]

I been reading about people having problems using the afcII and 660cc or bigger injectors. I want some feedback and opinions from AFCII users with big injectors on how their setup is working out and how they handle things.
Is your timing advancing too much? (past 17 at redline, how far?)
How do you handle your timing issues with an AFC if you can't directly control it?
Do you have difficulty getting the car to idle well and how do you fix that?
Any other problems not mentioned above?

I am planning on running 660cc inj, 255lph rewired pump, and AFC with a pocketlogger.
I have 50trim, fmic, clutch, and other bolt-ons. Any suggestions or comments?

Any feedback is appreciated!

Learn from what project tsi said. If you don't have the proper fuel control and tuning tools that 50 trim and big injectors will not make you any faster than stock if you can't control your fuel. As was stated a eprom with dsm link is the best way to go, but can be costly ($600-$700). If you have or get an eprom ecu you can have a chip burned for your specific injector size. That combined with your AFC you should be able control your fuel very precisely. You might also think about an AFPR if you don't already have one. With that 255 lph you might over run you stock FPR.

 

[project_tsi]

bring the fuel pressure back down to 38psi base

I thought the stock base was 42 or 43 psi? I should set it to lower? Since boost and fuel pres. rise on a 1:1 ratio, I didn't think base pressure was really a key factor here, but I may be wrong.?

 

[urcnjoe]

I thought the stock base was 42 or 43 psi? I should set it to lower? Since boost and fuel pres. rise on a 1:1 ratio, I didn't think base pressure was really a key factor here, but I may be wrong.?

Your right there is a difference between 1g and 2g stock fuel pressure.

 

[project_tsi]

Your right there is a difference between 1g and 2g stock fuel pressure.

Yes, but Burnett has a 1G, so should i set it to 42, or 38psi?

 

[Staytuned]

38 is base for a 1G.

I have no problems with timing on my setup. The key is to get your airflow up there above 2000 hz that's where my timng came down to more normal numbers 16-17-18 at WOT. Trying to tune my car at 14psi was where I was seeing some crazy high timing.

 

[urcnjoe]

Yes, but Burnett has a 1G, so should i set it to 42, or 38psi?

38 is stock for a 1g and 42/43 is stock for 2g.

 

[project_tsi]

38 is stock for a 1g and 42/43 is stock for 2g.

Will it run better w/ 38psi? Will it be noticeable? Maybe enough so I wont have to buy DSMLink, and an eprom ecu?

 

[kazzam]

I currently run a 50trim, FMIC, 255 high pres. pump, no rewire kit. Aeromotive FPR, Maf Translator W/ GM 3" Maf, and S-AFC II. And honestly, I can't get the AFC to take away enough fuel! I just run Pig ass rich, all time. I have no boost leaks either. Fuel press is set to 42psi. I can hardly get the car to idle, barely, some times it will, others it will die, or just keep rising, then fall, etc. I am so frustraded that I am now looking for a eprom ecu and will be switching to the DSMLink setup, what I should have done in the first place, and youll be seeing my S-AFCII for sale on tuners shortly.

What kind of injectors do you have? Have u tried lowering down your fuel to 40psi?

 

[kazzam]

I run a 50 trim with some 650's and a 190, I get right around 19-20 degree's at 7500 which is just about perfect IMO.

do you have fpr? or with the 190pump you don't need one at all? What is your fuel pressure at?

 

[project_tsi]

What kind of injectors do you have? Have u tried lowering down your fuel to 40psi?

I have FIC (Denso) 650cc ball style injectors. No, I have not yet tried lowering the press. I will do it tomorow, its late now, midnight. Thats why i was asking first, if it would make any difference in it running better.

 

[urcnjoe]

Will it run better w/ 38psi? Will it be noticeable? Maybe enough so I wont have to buy DSMLink, and an eprom ecu?

It will help, but only a little. You still need that eprom with a dsm chip. DSMlink is very nice to have but not totally needed. You can get a lot of information from a good pocketlogger. You can usually find an eprom for around $200. Just make sure you change the caps and have the dsm chip installed before installing the ecu into your car.

 

[kazzam]

38 is base for a 1G.

I have no problems with timing on my setup. The key is to get your airflow up there above 2000 hz that's where my timng came down to more normal numbers 16-17-18 at WOT. Trying to tune my car at 14psi was where I was seeing some crazy high timing.

so do you always drive with your boost up there? I would imagine you run around 17-19psi to get that airflow. I dont' like boosting that high all the time, so tuning down to 12psi would be a problem you think? Or low boost and high timing work fine?

 

[olmytsi]

You shouldnt need an ecu. just set the fuel pressure to stock spec and go from there. I run 660s, a 255 high pressure and an afc and my car idles perfect, no chipped ecu.

 

[project_tsi]

It will help, but only a little. You still need that eprom with a dsm chip. DSMlink is very nice to have but not totally needed. You can get a lot of information from a good pocketlogger. You can usually find an eprom for around $200. Just make sure you change the caps and have the dsm chip installed before installing the ecu into your car.

Well Ill lower it tomorrow, and see where it goes from there. I do already have the Maf Translator, S-AFC II, and a datalogger, so.
IF YOU WERE ME THOUGH: would you.

A. Buy a Eprom Ecu, along w/ a Keydriver chip already compensated to 650's, and tune w/ the S-AFCII, Maf-T, and Datalogger.

B. Buy a Eprom Ecu, along w/ DSMLink. And sell my current S-AFCII and data logger, and go this route in tuning.

C. Don't buy a Eprom Ecu, Don't buy DSMLink. Lower the base fuel pressure, and try my damdest to tune it ok.

Thanks, Dan

 

[4gsx63]

Well Ill lower it tomorrow, and see where it goes from there. I do already have the Maf Translator, S-AFC II, and a datalogger, so.
IF YOU WERE ME THOUGH: would you.

A. Buy a Eprom Ecu, along w/ a Keydriver chip already compensated to 650's, and tune w/ the S-AFCII, Maf-T, and Datalogger.

B. Buy a Eprom Ecu, along w/ DSMLink. And sell my current S-AFCII and data logger, and go this route in tuning.

C. Don't buy a Eprom Ecu, Don't buy DSMLink. Lower the base fuel pressure, and try my damdest to tune it ok.

Thanks, Dan

Try C first!

 

[urcnjoe]

Well Ill lower it tomorrow, and see where it goes from there. I do already have the Maf Translator, S-AFC II, and a datalogger, so.
IF YOU WERE ME THOUGH: would you.

A. Buy a Eprom Ecu, along w/ a Keydriver chip already compensated to 650's, and tune w/ the S-AFCII, Maf-T, and Datalogger.

B. Buy a Eprom Ecu, along w/ DSMLink. And sell my current S-AFCII and data logger, and go this route in tuning.

C. Don't buy a Eprom Ecu, Don't buy DSMLink. Lower the base fuel pressure, and try my damdest to tune it ok.

Thanks, Dan

Depends on your budget. I personally would sell either the MAF-T or the S-AFCII to help purchase the computer and chip. If your on a budget I would stay away from DSMlink. You can get almost $200 for that SAFC on e-bay and if you have a blow thru set up I personally would keep the MAF-T because it provides more airflow and it sounds cool.

The MAF-T and SAFC are similar but the SAFC allows for more precise tunning, but lacks the extra bonus that comes along with the MAF-T.

You can first try lowering you fuel pressure and try tunning with what you have now. That may get you by for a while. It should help with your idle issue, but the car will more than likely be running rich still.

If it was me I would wake up tomorrow turn that fuel pressure back to base (38) sell the SAFC, and start looking for an eprom. I'd stay away from DSMlink for now and keep your pocketlogger.

 

[project_tsi]

If it was me I would wake up tomorrow turn that fuel pressure back to base (38) sell the SAFC, and start looking for an eprom. I'd stay away from DSMlink for now and keep your pocketlogger.

Sound like a good plan to me, Thanks. I think Ill keep the AFC though for more precise tuning. Ill probly end up getting a keydriver chip already compensated for 650's, and tune from there.

 

[Burnett03]

base pressure on a 2g is 43 and 38on a 1g. Lowering the base pressure will help if you are running rich. Here's why: if your pressure is at 43base and you boost 20lbs you are at 63psi pressure.. If you set it to 38 and boost 20lbs you are at 58psi pressure. That is a bit of a difference. Try lowering the base pressure. This will also help you if you are getting to much timing advance because you are adding fuel back in VIA safc if you must and it will tell the ecu to not advance timing to much.

 

[spyderturbo007]

I want some feedback and opinions from AFCII users with big injectors on how their setup is working out and how they handle things.
Is your timing advancing too much? (past 17 at redline, how far?)

You can check out one of my logs here (post #2)

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=191260

I am hitting the same timing as CanadianTSI, which I too feel is pretty much right on. Nothing excessive and very tunable. That may go up a little once it stops freakin' raining and I can get out there and make a couple of pulls.

Anyway, no complaints from me.

Do you have difficulty getting the car to idle well and how do you fix that?
Any other problems not mentioned above?

No problems with idle and my FT's are pretty much dead on.

I am planning on running 660cc inj, 255lph rewired pump, and AFC with a pocketlogger.
I have 50trim, fmic, clutch, and other bolt-ons. Any suggestions or comments?

Don't forget an AFPR with that 255 rewired. Other than that, you should have a nice setup.

 

[project_tsi]

Ok I lowered the base pres. to 38psi. i then wade a WOT run in 3rd to redline, and watched my timing advance. at redline I was a 28 degress, getting 0 counts of knock, and still runnning rich. What can I do lower the timing to around 17-18 degrees?

 

[kazzam]

Ok I lowered the base pres. to 38psi. i then wade a WOT run in 3rd to redline, and watched my timing advance. at redline I was a 28 degress, getting 0 counts of knock, and still runnning rich. What can I do lower the timing to around 17-18 degrees?

try lowering presure to 35 and then doing a log. If knocking, add more fuel in. Ecu should not advance timing so much if u do that. If it still advances that much, then look for a boost leak. There might be one. when was the last time u did a leak test?