A few questions for the pros please help me

[DanThMan1983]

So I just finished my 4g63 motor for my 92 eclipse. I have everything put together and I am putting the finishing touches on it before I start it. My questions...

1. Before I start it I want to verifiy oil pressure, should I just pull the fuel pump relay and the #1 spark plug wire and crank until I see pressure?

2. I forgot the dust pan that goes between the trans and the engine. Will this cause a problem with the starter?(does it act as a shim?) or anything else?

Thanks guys. I want to start it tonight but I wont until someone makes me feel better about these two questions. So I will be on for a bit. Also if you have anything else to mention before I start it that would be great.

 

[cruisintalonawd]

I know you wanted the "pros" but no one has answered you yet so I'll help you out.That spacer isn't truely need I've went without it before. Do you have an aftermarket oil pressure gauge or stock one. I'd say that with just the starter turning the motor over it wont give you more then maybe 10 to 20 psi and what you could do is start it and if the needle doesn't move after you count to 5 then shut it down.

 

[marsh63]

another thing to do is recheck your timing and how tight your belt is just to be on the safe side.

 

[DanThMan1983]

I know you wanted the "pros" but no one has answered you yet so I'll help you out.That spacer isn't truely need I've went without it before. Do you have an aftermarket oil pressure gauge or stock one. I'd say that with just the starter turning the motor over it wont give you more then maybe 10 to 20 psi and what you could do is start it and if the needle doesn't move after you count to 5 then shut it down.

ok thanks man, I plan on putting the dust plate back in. I work at a dealership, I just want to get it running so I can drive it to work and put it up on a lift so putting the plate in will be much easier.

I have the stock oil pressure gauge, but I would atleast like to see the needle move before I start it. I didnt end up starting it tonight, I couldnt find the 2 bolts for the cam sensor. Tomorrows the night.

Timing is dead on, I made sure of that before I put the engine in. I have done timing belts for friends before and had issues being a tooth off, I know mine is on.

Thanks guys!

Still would like to know the best method of verifying oil pressure before I start it though.

 

[Lonnie gandee]

There really isnt a way to check the high end, unless you start it as stated.....

Crank it, and watch.... I've actually started a motor before with no oil in it....

I had a total brainfart...I'd say the engine ran for about 45 seconds, till i realized it.... oops.

No adverse effects yet.... And I've recently changed bearings( 5 days ago) and they looked like new still.

Thank god for aseembly lube...


On the other hand... I've been at full boost, when I've lost all the oil at once. (20 psi)

That motor didnt last long at all... I was at 6000 rpm, when i locked in the mirror ..
Then at my sw oil pressure gauge.

By the time the engine came down to 2000 rpm, it was knocking.

 

[cruisintalonawd]

Yeah I can't stress enough about having the timing exactly on, from my exsperience I will check it about 10 times before I start putting other stuff on

 

[DanThMan1983]

Okay I went ahead and re-checked my timing. I am having trouble understanding something that should be simple though. I line the cams up, dowel pins on cams @ 12 o`clock, crank sprocket lines up with arrow on block, how ever I put a long screw driver in the #1 piston hole and crank it over a little more and the piston moves up further? in theory this makes no sense to me since the piston should be all the way up when the crank sprocket lines up with the arrow on the block because thats TDC right?

 

[tqmx1]

Simple fix a bit time comsuming but simple. The tin plate between the ballance shaft sprocket and the cam/oil pump sprocket on the crankshaft has been reversed on assembly. Take it all apart reverce the plate and then try it.

I know that was somthing you realy did not want to here. You are not the first and surly wont be the last .

 

[DanThMan1983]

I have no balance shafts...

Oh snap I think I know what your talking about, your talking about the thin plate with the notch in it that lines up with the arrow on the black(on the crankshaft)?

 

[tqmx1]

Oh snap I think I know what your talking about, your talking about the thin plate with the notch in it that lines up with the arrow on the black(on the crankshaft)?

Yep thats the beast As i was saying not what you wanted to here.

Good luck.

 

[Locke]

Simple fix a bit time comsuming but simple. The tin plate between the ballance shaft sprocket and the cam/oil pump sprocket on the crankshaft has been reversed on assembly. Take it all apart reverce the plate and then try it.

I know that was somthing you realy did not want to here. You are not the first and surly wont be the last .

Good call.

PITA, but get this corrected before you fire the engine.

 

[DanThMan1983]

Dangit, gonna be a long night I wanted to start it, thanks for the info. I wanna punch you. Out to the garage I go.

 

[BoostedTalonTS]

Simple fix a bit time comsuming but simple. The tin plate between the ballance shaft sprocket and the cam/oil pump sprocket on the crankshaft has been reversed on assembly. Take it all apart reverce the plate and then try it.

I know that was somthing you realy did not want to here. You are not the first and surly wont be the last .

My thoughts exactly! You want the concave side of the timing plate to be facing towards the balance shaft drive gear.

Since you will redoing the timing belt anyways... you should take a 14mm socket + drill bit adapter, with cordless drill and manually spin up your oil pump to prime the oil system before you reinstall the timing belt, after fixing the timing tin. That way you will have already sent oil throughout the motor prior to it being started.

 

[Mr Peepers]

If you're going to have the timing belt off, you might as well prime it like this:

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/problem-diagnosis/124345-how-prime-oil-pump.html#14

EDIT: forgot to link to the specific post(#14)

 

[DanThMan1983]

My thoughts exactly! You want the concave side of the timing plate to be facing towards the balance shaft drive gear.

Since you will redoing the timing belt anyways... you should take a 14mm socket + drill bit adapter and manually spin up your oil pump to prime the oil system before you reinstall the timing belt, after fixing the timing tin. That way you will have already sent oil throughout the motor prior to it being started.

Thanks guys, I already have the timing belt off, unfortunately I dont have my air tools with me(didnt think I would need them tonight), there another way to get the crank bolt out? I also dont have my cordless drill with me to prime the oil system but I want to get the crank bolt out tonight and get it retimed. If I were to prime the oil system with my cordless drill on the oil pump sprocket would I see pressure on the stock oil pressure gauge?

If you're going to have the timing belt off, you might as well prime it like this:

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/problem-diagnosis/124345-how-prime-oil-pump.html#14

EDIT: forgot to link to the specific post

I read your link, thats great thanks!

 

[Mr Peepers]

If I were to prime the oil system with my cordless drill on the oil pump sprocket would I see pressure on the stock oil pressure gauge?

As long as your key is in the "ON" position, yes.

 

[BoostedTalonTS]

Thanks guys, I already have the timing belt off, unfortunately I dont have my air tools with me(didnt think I would need them tonight), there another way to get the crank bolt out? I also dont have my cordless drill with me to prime the oil system but I want to get the crank bolt out tonight and get it retimed. If I were to prime the oil system with my cordless drill on the oil pump sprocket would I see pressure on the stock oil pressure gauge?

No impact eh? -There is one way......... IT IS VERY DANGEROUS THOUGH!! -Requires a 22mm 1/2" drive impact socket and a 1/2" drive breaker bar. Align the breaker bar so that it is braced against the lower suspension with the 22mm socket attached to the crank bolt... HERE's THE DANGEROUS PART.... Bump the starter. Count all fingers & toes then proceed to backing the crank bolt out the rest of the way by hand.
Also, when priming the oil system, I wouldn't bother looking at the OEM guage... Just open the oil cap and look at the hole in one of the rockers... Keep spinning up the oil pump sprocket until you see oil peeing out of that hole.

 

[DanThMan1983]

No impact eh? -There is one way......... IT IS VERY DANGEROUS THOUGH!! -Requires a 32mm 1/2" drive impact socket and a 1/2" drive breaker bar. Align the breaker bar so that it is braced against the lower suspension with the 32mm socket attached to the crank bolt... HERE's THE DANGEROUS PART.... Bump the starter. Count all fingers & toes then proceed to backing the crank bolt out the rest of the way.
Also, when priming the oil system, I wouldn't bother looking at the OEM guage... Just open the oil cap and look at the hole in one of the rockers... Keep spinning up the oil pump sprocket until you see oil peeing out of that hole.

That is scary, I will wait until tomorrow. Thanks for everything guys, im glad I found the problem. I will get my impact and my cordless drill from work and bring em home tomorrow.

ps, 22mm not 32mm

 

[tqmx1]

I would not bleave the op guage, To slow acting. If you have a VOM handy put it on the ohms scale and hook it up to the OP switch and to ground. crank the pump until the switch opens and let it crank a few seconds more and you are done

Good luck and fingers crossed.

 

[BoostedTalonTS]

...ps, 22mm not 32mm

yah noticed that... damn typing w/ gloves on -Already edited in original post
BTW, that method WOULD have worked to get the crank bolt off... although you would then still be faced with finding a way to get it back on and torqued to spec. -Good call on waiting until tomorrow man.
Good luck

 

[DanThMan1983]

yah noticed that... damn typing w/ gloves on -Already edited in original post
BTW, that method WOULD have worked to get the crank bolt off... although you would then still be faced with finding a way to get it back on and torqued to spec. -Good call on waiting until tomorrow man.
Good luck

Torqued to spec? Hah I use German Torque Specifications.. "Guten Tight"

 

[DanThMan1983]

Just to let everyone know what happened with my car, I started it, it ran wonderful, I was expecting it to hiccup and miss atleast a little on first startup, but not one single problem. Oil pressure was there instantly, idled smooth as ever, thanks alot now lets see how it survives the winter

 

[Mr Peepers]

Always good to hear

Did you prime it by spinning the oil pump/cog with a drill first? Pray and turn the key?

Just curious

 

[turboglenn]

Always good to hear

Did you prime it by spinning the oil pump/cog with a drill first? Pray and turn the key?

Just curious

I always use the drill/socket technique toe get Oil pressure before starting teh engine if i've taken anything apart. When i do an il change, i disconnect teh ignitor and turn it over with teh key untill the oil light goes out. ( it's best to disable the injectors while doing this as well)