2g with Evo X pistons and rods..

[suprasalas]

Well to day I'm taking my block apart since I blew a rod on my 7bolt. I order brand new piston and rods from a 2010 evo x.. I don't know very much about evos but I do know they are very similar especially because most evos use the 4g63 engine block.. But I haven't seen no threads of anyone using the new evo x pistons on there 4g63 other then the dsm graveyard. I do know that there piston is 1mm (.040over) bigger then my 7 bolt 4g63 block. So I am taking my block to get bore this weekend but im not getting it back in till next Thursday because they are so busy not to mention that the piston don't arrive in till this Wednesday.. I will be posting update's and pic's as my project comes along.. I would really like some advice or hits if anyone know a lot of the new evos pistons and the things I would need to complete my project or should I say my daily driver.. thanks

 

[jtmcinder]

Most Evos might use a 4G63, but the Evo X does not. We have 4B11s. Aluminum block.

 

[marineeagle28]

I would wait to Bore the block until you had the pistons IN HAND to take to the machine shop, so that they get the oversize EXACTLY right instead of a ball park estimate. You could also ASK the graveyard what it is that they do to get our 7 bolt rods to accept the 4b11 pistons. Also, I would diagnose why the motor "blew" a rod, and correct that issue as well.

 

[suprasalas]

jtmcinder: thats turth i been reading on that thats why i said most evos
and marineeagle28 as well that's truth to I should wait to take the exact measurement of the pistons and about why my engine threw a rod was that I over boost it I was pushing 23-24psi to much heat i guess, I knew it was to much for the engine that already had a lil more then 100,000 miles when i bought it.. plus I work at a college as a tech and go there to, that's how me and my instructor diagnose it..

 

[Awdspyderman]

well im doing the same thing also man! i've talked to DSMGRAVEYARD already and they said to get it to work you must have the machine shop bore the rod to a full floating wrist pin, the 2g wrist pin is 22mm and the EVO X piston is 23mm. They also say the PTW should be somewere from 1 1/2 thousandths to 2 thousandths piston to wall clearence(That's what they told me) also the evo x pistons are hyperuthetic pistons not forged like the evo 8 & 9 are. I really am looking foward to running this set-up so post some info when you get yours done. Also can some one who knows maybe answer this for me, If the rod design is close to the 2g design and the evo x big end is 149.23mm and the 2g is 150.00mm could'nt we use an oversized rod bearings to make up for the differnce? DISCLAIMER this is a question so please some one with real world experiance chime in about this. I'm not an expert either that's why he and I are asking. Sorry man don't mean to thread jack=) Good luck to you too!!

 

[Aproductions]

I think if I was you I would think twice about going .040 over. Why not go .020 over and then that way if you ever have a problem again you can then go up to .40 over stock? I just feel that you will have to get a new block if you have to bore again.

Either way definitely take pictures and maybe even do a build thread We are missing those here on tuners.

 

[Awdspyderman]

the reason he has to go .040 over becuase thats the standard size they come in, when i was looking at bore, the DSMGRAVEYARD said they only come 86mm 86.5mm 87mm bore that is what is shows on there web site. I've heard of guys going .060 over without a problem? I never met them but the person who told me is a high ranking DSMer in colorado(mirage) i'm not discrediting you or saying anything bad this is all just what i was told

 

[suprasalas]

Well guys I got good and bad news. The bad is that the evo x rods wont fit my 7 bolt crankshaft. The big rod end of the evo is too big to fit the crank. The good news is that I can modify my 7 bolt rods to fit the evo pistons. I been taking measurements of the evo rods and my 7 bolt rods and it looks like the only thing I need to really modify is the small rod end of my 7 bolt to fit the piston and the wrist pins. For that I need to shave the small end of the rod to a smaller size and bore it out to 1mm so the evo wrist pins can fit the rod. I got a deal on craigslist for the 7bolt rods for all four of them for about $50 they look in pretty good condition, no signs of wear form any where or heat cracks so I bought them now I only need my block back from the machine shop. Ill keep posting updates as I complete my project. Thanks for the info u guys. Much is appreciated, later ill post up some pic's how I had to modify my rods to fit the piston..

 

[donniekak]

With all the time, headache, and money you'll have wrapped up in this, you could buy an off the shelf eagle/wiseco combo, and be back on the road.

 

[suprasalas]

With all the time, headache, and money you'll have wrapped up in this, you could buy an off the shelf eagle/wiseco combo, and be back on the road.

Well not exactly, working at a college has a lot of advantages like having to pay the machine shop $30 for all the work. I know the owners son and plus the owner knows me pretty well, that’s why he is taking a long time to finish my block (customers come first) for all I only I’m coming out to pay about $300. I really don’t think u can get a piston and rod combo for that cheap and plus what’s wrong with experimenting with what no one has done or have in there engines?

 

[96awd16g]

Reason most haven't done it is the extra work for a weaker piston isn't worth it. Hyperutectic is what approximately 30-40% stronger than cast depending on the alloy, brand, etc. Forged is significantly stronger than this. Im surprised to learn evo x's didn't have forged pistons, bit of a step in the wrong direction in my opinion.

Based on my experience building sbc's for our race truck and other people id never run a hyperutectic piston over 6-8 psi, 100-125 shot of nitrous, or 7000 rpm let alone the boost you were running and 7000+ rpm combined. Id run an awfully conservative tune.

 

[dsmusmc]

Of course it will work DSM Graveyard said it would...

They also said these pistons would make the block a 2.2L. Where the hell did they get that? A 2.2 is a different stroke and rod ratio. If your going to cheap out atleast use EVO8-9 pistons and rods knowing that they actually fit. While your at it pick up EVO springs and Delta cams and you will be fine for what 90% of this community is shooting for. Good luck...

 

[BogusSVO]

At first they also said these pistons would make the block a 2.2L. Where the hell did they get that? A 2.2 is a different stroke and rod ratio.

Well you are close on this, It is Bore and stroke that make up the Cubic inch displacement.

Rod ratio has no effect on engine displacement.

The formula for engine displacement is

(since I do not have the fancy letters for writing foumulas, Ill spell it out)

Pi x R squared x stroke x # of cylinders = CID

Pi = 3.141

R (radius) squared = 1/2 bore squared

Stroke = stroke of crank used

# of cylinders = How many cylinder bores in the block

Convertions

from mm to inches multiply by .03937

so on a 4g63

Std bore = 85mm x .03937 =3.346

Stroke = 88 mm x .03937 = 3.465

so Std bore of 3.346 + .040 = 3.386
R= 1.693
R squared = 2.866

Pi = 3.141

# of cyl = 4

3.141 x 2.866 x 3.465 x 4 = 124.769 CID

to convert from cubic inches to cubic centimeters multiply by 16.3872
so 124.769 x 16.3872 = 2044.6145 CC

Now after running the math, I would call it a best of 2.1L


Rod ratio is rod length divided by stroke

Stock rod length is 156mm (?) x .03937 = 6.142
Stroke is 88mm x .03937 = 3.465

so 6.142/3.465 = 1.773
or 1.773:1 ratio

Now if you plan on building this engine,and run a decent boost level,(18-20+ psi) I would advise the block sonic tested, to make sure there us ample cylinder wall after the bore.

 

[JusMX141]

I order brand new piston and rods from a 2010 evo x..

Should have just ordered them for the Evo IX....they would have dropped right in and fit your crank.

 

[96awd16g]

Now if you plan on building this engine,and run a decent boost level,(18-20+ psi) I would advise the block sonic tested, to make sure there us ample cylinder wall after the bore.

Don't think that's really necessary considering pistons themselves shouldn't be ran consistently at those boost levels. Just my opinion tho!

 

[jtmcinder]

And what a lovely opinion it is. Kind of loses some luster when you learn what stock boost is on an Evo X (hint: it's over 20), but it's still a lovely opinion and you should keep it forever. In fact, you should probably avoid sharing it again, so no-one steals it.

 

[suprasalas]

Well I don’t know if my measurements are exact (my caliper was low on batteries) but this is the reasons why I can’t use the evo x rod there is not a lot of difference between the 2g rod and the evo x rod but the main one is because the big rod end is to wide for the 7bolt crank with to much play so I have to modify the 2g rod to fit the evo x piston and wrist pins. This is the photo of my measurements that I drew to show what I’m taking about. I’m no artist, this is just show what I’m taking about.. <a href="http://s179.photobucket.com/albums/w313/Marios_bucket/?action=view&amp;current=rods.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w313/Marios_bucket/rods.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

 

[black91awdturbo]

You know thedsmgraveyard.com does this piston conversion right?

 

[suprasalas]

Yeah but why pay double when I can do it my self and help to inform other that want to do the same thing???

 

[black91awdturbo]

Because if you fail by just a few thousandths and you will have huge problems would be a good one for starters.

 

[suprasalas]

Well I can't really fail when I'm not doing the machining. I'm having a machine shop do that for me.

 

[suprasalas]

haha well my project is done ill be uploading some pic later on this week.. the pistons are great they spoon up my turbo very quikly alot faster then my stock pistons i love the piston

 

[Alex7747]

haha well my project is done ill be uploading some pic later on this week.. the pistons are great they spoon up my turbo very quikly alot faster then my stock pistons i love the piston

interesting..

 

[Awdspyderman]

PLEASE upload the pics man, I can't wait till mine is done!!! It's great to see you get yours done. Let me know if you run into any hiccups or things i should watch out for.=)

 

[suprasalas]

no problem Awdspyderman ill upload them as asoon as i can..