2.4L Secifics

[Steve Hebert]

I think I must have read every post on the 2.3/2.4 build and there are definite trade-offs to either. But what IAMTALL said seems to be a nice advantage. When you get done with the 2.4 you will still have your 2.0 block also. (as a back up or whatever) but it you do a 2.3 that's all you got.

As for me I am definitely doing one be it 2.3 or 2.4 I know I will be happy with either. Probably leaning 2.4

 

[snox135]

For me the biggest advantage of the 2.4 was I can go buy a 2.4 and build it while driving my 2.0. So when I do change them I will have considerably less downtime. Because the block will be all ready to drop in. Except any head work I will be getting done. Yes, I know I could also buy a 2.0 block then buy a 100mm crank and so forth. But the complete 2.4 was a lot easier and cheaper for me.

 

[poorboyj]

The marks are half a tooth off(I forget if its advanced or retarded) from the normal 2.0 gears. The reason almost no one remarks the old ones and uses new ones, is because they are 15-20 dollars. Its much easier to plop down $20 and get some cam gears that are 100% right, then fiddle around trying to mark your old cam gears and potentially have the timing off.

This makes my head hurt. It is NOT possible for valve timing to be correct on a 2.4L 4G63/4G64 "hybrid" without the use of the $20ea Galant cam gears (buy 2 exhaust gears) or aftermarket adjustable gears. The DSM cam gears have the dowel position in an incorrect location for this setup. This will advance or retard (I forget too) valve timing 4 degrees or so. The car will run, probably just fine, but it is not correct.

Jay

 

[Steve Hebert]

For me the biggest advantage of the 2.4 was I can go buy a 2.4 and build it while driving my 2.0. So when I do change them I will have considerably less downtime. Because the block will be all ready to drop in. Except any head work I will be getting done. Yes, I know I could also buy a 2.0 block then buy a 100mm crank and so forth. But the complete 2.4 was a lot easier and cheaper for me.

Yup that too

 

[bigjangin]

This makes my head hurt. It is NOT possible for valve timing to be correct on a 2.4L 4G63/4G64 "hybrid" without the use of the $20ea Galant cam gears (buy 2 exhaust gears) or aftermarket adjustable gears. The DSM cam gears have the dowel position in an incorrect location for this setup. This will advance or retard (I forget too) valve timing 4 degrees or so. The car will run, probably just fine, but it is not correct.

Jay

If you compare the 2.4 gears directly side by side to a 2.0 gear, with the dowels lined up and everything, the mark on the 2.0 is half a gear off. If you use 2.0 gears on a 2.4, and use the 2.0 marks, you valve timing WILL be off.

http://students.washington.edu/jlhobbs/car/incamgear.jpg
http://students.washington.edu/jlhobbs/car/excamgear.jpg

The problem isn't the dowels, its where the timing marks are. As far as I can tell comparing them side by side, the 2.0 and 2.4 gears are identical besides the timing marks. In theory, you could remark the 2.0 as they are identical besides the timing marks. In practice, don't be a dumbass/cheapass and just buy the damn right gears, they don't cost much at all.


So please don't flame me with your "head hurting" unless you have some factual evidence to back it up. Also unless you like to play with cam timing(on a dyno or the track), I would stick to the OEM mitsu gears, as the timing marks and base timing for aftermarket gears will be based on a 2.0 and NOT for a 2.4.

 

[98spydert]

bigjangin,
It looks like he was agreeing with you, not flaming you. The point of the timing mark being off is because the dowel is off. Afterall, the timing marks are there to align the cams (dowels are in a fixed position on the cams) right?

 

[poorboyj]

bigjangin,
It looks like he was agreeing with you, not flaming you. The point of the timing mark being off is because the dowel is off. Afterall, the timing marks are there to align the cams (dowels are in a fixed position on the cams) right?

Yes, we are agreeing. I just wanted to reiterate that since you cannot move the belt 1/2 tooth, you will need to buy the 2.4L DOHC cam gears for valve timing to be correct. Remarking the 2.0L gears doesn't correct this either.

Jay White

 

[snox135]

Yes, we are agreeing. I just wanted to reiterate that since you cannot move the belt 1/2 tooth, you will need to buy the 2.4L DOHC cam gears for valve timing to be correct. Remarking the 2.0L gears doesn't correct this either.

Jay White

Please explain how remarking the 2.0L gears doesn't correct his. A lot of people remark there gears and are having no problems and there cam timing is right were it is supposed to be.

 

[bigjangin]

Yes, we are agreeing. I just wanted to reiterate that since you cannot move the belt 1/2 tooth, you will need to buy the 2.4L DOHC cam gears for valve timing to be correct. Remarking the 2.0L gears doesn't correct this either.

Jay White

We are not agreeing.
Why can't you move the belt half a tooth? The two cam gears are physically identical. Do you not realize this, or disagree with this? Only the timing marks are different.

Since the gears are physically identical, if the 2.0 gears couldn't achieve correct timing, neither could the 2.4 gears.

 

[Injected]

Just to throw another question in this topic, what ecu/fms and injectors are you using for your specific builds? I can't imagine a simple piggyback could handle a stroker.

 

[poorboyj]

We are not agreeing.
Why can't you move the belt half a tooth? The two cam gears are physically identical. Do you not realize this, or disagree with this? Only the timing marks are different.

Since the gears are physically identical, if the 2.0 gears couldn't achieve correct timing, neither could the 2.4 gears.

Yeah, I am having a difficult time getting my point across. In this picture, http://students.washington.edu/jlhobbs/car/excamgear.jpg, if you line the dowel hole locations up, both gears will have their timing mark at the same spot, but the gear teeth will be offset 1/2 tooth.

So remarking the cam gears is just that, remarking them. The difference between the two is the dowel location in relation to the teeth.

Jay

 

[Steve Hebert]

Yeah, I am having a difficult time getting my point across. In this picture, http://students.washington.edu/jlhobbs/car/excamgear.jpg, if you line the dowel hole locations up, both gears will have their timing mark at the same spot, but the gear teeth will be offset 1/2 tooth.

So remarking the cam gears is just that, remarking them. The difference between the two is the dowel location in relation to the teeth.

Jay

And with the gears being 1/2 tooth off - I don't think you can slip the belt 1/2 tooth.

 

[stephenz]

here is pic of the block with the freeze plugs.


stephen.

 

[set3422]

We are not agreeing.
Why can't you move the belt half a tooth? The two cam gears are physically identical. Do you not realize this, or disagree with this? Only the timing marks are different.

Since the gears are physically identical, if the 2.0 gears couldn't achieve correct timing, neither could the 2.4 gears.

Yes, you're correct on this one. Infact if you could get more accurate results on the valve timing relative to the crank angle by using adjustable cam gears. Getting a pair of 4g64 cam gears won't necessary give you an accurate valve timing relative to the crank angle because 4g64 block is taller than 4g63 block. Plus if you're getting head/block decked, thicker or thinner HG, and aftermarket camshafts, I'm sure the timing mark will be more off. So to compensate for these factors, I recommend investing a pair of adjustable cam gears over 4g64 cam gears.

 

[gixrman]

read me
http://www.pinktemple.com/stroker.html

 

[1fastlaser]

Just to throw another question in this topic, what ecu/fms and injectors are you using for your specific builds? I can't imagine a simple piggyback could handle a stroker.

Im running your basic stuff any dsm would run.vpc/afr/680s/dsmchip......for now until i get the aem in...car runs normal,and can definatly handle bigger cams.I got around 18-19 vacuum with fp2s,and it idles at 850 (dsmchips idle) dosent surge nothing,and drives with alot of low end,and when the boost hits it hurts .I messed with my friends 04 gsxr 750,slip on and web cam,60-120 20psi on pump gas,3rd-somewhere in 4th he sat in front a car.....i was happy considering the car isnt tuned at all,pump gas 20psi..

 

[suicidal2af]

And with the gears being 1/2 tooth off - I don't think you can slip the belt 1/2 tooth.

Right -- so there's no possible way you could have the timing marks aligned with unmarked 63 gears. Keep in mind we're dealing with a 4G64 timing belt, NOT a 4g63 belt.

So you remark it so you can use a straightedge to make sure your timing is correct...or you buy the gears for a 4G64. Problem solved.

 

[RACER-X]

So which is it.. 64 cams or adjustables.. and will my 91 EPROM ECU on my G VR4 work?

All this has been a big help for me .. thank alot guys.

 

[peregrine]

So which is it.. 64 cams or adjustables.. and will my 91 EPROM ECU on my G VR4 work?

All this has been a big help for me .. thank alot guys.

shell out for the 64 gears. its like $42. your eprom should work. will it work on a 91 up eclipse/talon?