1997 Talon TSI Build

[wolfyslove]

Okay so i just got a 1997 Talon TSI FWD not to long ago. It is sadly an automatic BUT on a different not i have made quite a bit of progress if i do say so myself. Right now i have both the front and rear bumper and reinforcements off as well as all the plastics.

The top end of the motor nor the turbo was included with the car, but luckily i got a good deal on a complete top and bottom end. Bad new is that the bottom end on the motor i just got isn't in as good as shape as i would have hoped. The rings were fried and the cylinder walls aren't half bad but it is going to be completely rebuilt.

Please bear with me here this is my first 4g63 but NOT my first DSM. I'm new to the turbo life and new to actually tearing into the engine and rebuilding but a very fast learner.

Now my plans for the build are to just get a basic 350whp build. I have thought about swapping it to a 5 speed but do not think i'm going to follow through with it. I'm not here to ask you what i need to do the 350whp build because i spent my time doing my research on here

What i am here for is someone who would keep in contact with me that would be able to help me out when i have a question instead of me posting on here every time i have a problem. ( i haven't yet but lets hope if there is one it isn't horrible.)

Here is the information from the car:

It has 110,000 original miles
Torque converter is bad. ( was told by previous owner)
I have no turbo
Bottom end in the car is junk
Previous owner said they blew the head gasket, junked the torque converter, and took off with the head and the turbo.
Again like i said i have a complete different motor and it is a 7 bolt. it has 100,000 miles on it but its getting completely rebuilt.


My main questions are as follows:

What turbo should i use? ( I'm not going higher than a 16g just need a brand)
What size injectors should i use? ( I'm using a Walbro 255)
Should i get a stall converter?
Should i do an emissions and balance shaft delete?
What is a good brand of pistons and rings that is a decent price but not cheaply made?



I know i'm going to need to tune it and i know i have some options, but with someone that has done 350whp what worked best for you?

 

[PrimerPLus]

I can't answer all of your question but I will answer the ones I can.

1. Evo III 16g is a nice street turbo and can support 350 Hp, they are expensive new though. You can probably find a cheap one on the classifieds? Others will most likely suggest a bigger turbo but since you said you don't want to go bigger than a 16g I suggest this one.

2. I am using 680cc injectors and I have HP goals for 400hp+ bigger is better? But I think 650cc or 680cc will do nicely for you.

3. No suggestion as I have a manual not an A/T

4. The emissions delete is up to you and are you worried about emissions tests? I chose to keep all mine but that's just my personal preference. I will note that it makes your bay look nicer if you do the delete.

5. I have not done anything with my pistons or rings, but I believe a lot of people use eagle. I would do some checking on that just to be sure though.

6. Tuning ECMLINK, most people will recommend this, although there are other options. But I would just get ECMLINK, as I have and many others.


BTW congratulations on your new dsm!

 

[WizardTSi]

For 350 hours the stock internals will hold. I personally went with 2g pistons and 1g rods in my 6 bolt

 

[talon2gbuyer]

I can't answer all of your question but I will answer the ones I can.

1. Evo III 16g is a nice street turbo and can support 350 Hp, they are expensive new though. You can probably find a cheap one on the classifieds? Others will most likely suggest a bigger turbo but since you said you don't want to go bigger than a 16g I suggest this one.

2. I am using 680cc injectors and I have HP goals for 400hp+ bigger is better? But I think 650cc or 680cc will do nicely for you.

3. No suggestion as I have a manual not an A/T

4. The emissions delete is up to you and are you worried about emissions tests? I chose to keep all mine but that's just my personal preference. I will note that it makes your bay look nicer if you do the delete.

5. I have not done anything with my pistons or rings, but I believe a lot of people use eagle. I would do some checking on that just to be sure though.

6. Tuning ECMLINK, most people will recommend this, although there are other options. But I would just get ECMLINK, as I have and many others.


BTW congratulations on your new dsm!

+1 on DSMlink. That is the one all-inclusive EMS system that lets you tamper with just about anything that the computer controls. Its great for getting your timing and fuel maps right and is essential for a good tune. It is on the pricey side (about $650 shipped i think) but is well worth it.

 

[96awd16g]

I would personally delete emissions, but I delete everything.

With a 16g sized turbo, you DON'T need a higher stall converter. I've got a 16g on a stock converter and it has no problem leaving at full boost. Higher stall will just create more unnecessary heat.

 

[wolfyslove]

i appreciate the replies and emissions is no worry. i live in iowa and there is no tests. otherwise what i have written down so far is obviously the usual FMIC, walbro 255, 16g, and i do believe i am going to swap it to a 5 speed. i've got a good deal on one right now that has everything i need minus the harness. and if need be i can just pigtail what i don't need. Any kinds of links to good websites would be much appreciated

 

[WES_393]

My main questions are as follows:

What turbo should i use? ( I'm not going higher than a 16g just need a brand)
What size injectors should i use? ( I'm using a Walbro 255)
Should i get a stall converter?
Should i do an emissions and balance shaft delete?
What is a good brand of pistons and rings that is a decent price but not cheaply made?

1. If your not going bigger than a 16g, then the only "brand" you should go with is Mitsubishi. Stay away from any knock-off brands. It's also important to note there isn't one kind of 16g. There is actually 3: Small, Big, and Evo 3. The Evo 3 is insanely over priced and impossible to find used. So keep your eyes peeled for ANY 16g, not just an Evo 3.

2. If you don't have a tuning system, the answer is stock 450cc. If you seriously plan to get DSMLink, then go for 1000cc if not a bit bigger. There is no reason to limit your injectors and DSMLink can compensate for a bit over 1000cc injectors on pump gas. Then you could even switch to E85 in the future.

3. It depends on what you plan to do with the car. Installing a high-stall converter on a daily driven car is not a good idea.

4. Emissions delete helps clean up the engine bay and reduces the amount of parts that can break. Balance shaft delete is totally up to you. In all honesty, there is no reason to remove balance shafts other than peace of mind. The vibration can get very old very fast, you'll lose any bolt that isn't torqued to hell or covered in loc-tite, and other steps need to be taken to deal with the high oil pressure as a result. However, a balance shaft going AWOL can destroy the entire engine.

5. NPR is a great OEM piston and ring supplier. However, if the bottom end needs work then it might be time for an entire rebuild, not just rings. Pull the block and have it inspected by a shop. That will tell you what your options are for using that block and crank.

Lastly, is there any reason you can't live without a 5-speed? I seriously urge you to give the Auto a chance. Especially because you are FWD since the Auto will help with traction. Not to mention, HP for HP, they are typically faster.

 

[wolfyslove]

I am rebuilding the bottom end no matter what.
What is everyones opinion on doing a 2.3 stroker?

 

[Eagle96TalonTSi]

I am rebuilding the bottom end no matter what.
What is everyones opinion on doing a 2.3 stroker?

My older brother had 2.3 stroker motor in his 98 GSX and it ran like a scolded dog...

From what I hear, just make sure you have it done by an experienced DSM mechanic obv.

 

[WES_393]

I am rebuilding the bottom end no matter what.
What is everyones opinion on doing a 2.3 stroker?

2.3 stroker is a great engine. You will have great low end torque and spool the turbo faster. However, you'll need a completely new rotating assembly. You will also be seriously limited by a 16g with a 2.3, you need a bigger turbo to let that engine breathe.

 

[wolfyslove]

the original build that i had in mind was a 2.3 with a 20g turbo. i havent 100% decided what i want to do with the car yet i'm trying to get some ideas going and with what ever person gives me the best detail about their own personal build i would do whatever is most common because this is my first 4g63. do a light build on this one and a medium build on the next one and so on and so forth.

the original build that i had in mind was a 2.3 with a 20g turbo. i havent 100% decided what i want to do with the car yet i'm trying to get some ideas going and with what ever person gives me the best detail about their own personal build i would do whatever is most common because this is my first 4g63. do a light build on this one and a medium build on the next one and so on and so forth.

 

[oneslowwdsm]

20g, 1000cc's, e85, 25lbs of boost. There is a freelancer on here that will do a custom chip for you on any Eprom ECU and you wouldn't have to foot a $600 bill for dsmlink. IMO it's cheaper and hasn't let me down yet. This used to be my setup however I now have a small 16g because I'm getting my 20g rebuilt.

It is a very fun setup and I can tell you now the difference between the 16g and 20g is pretty immense, plus it would be perfect for a FWD car due to higher spool/top end power the 20g provides. Good luck with whatever you do though.

Also, at 300whp and higher I'd look into getting a catch can setup or dual catch can setup as these cars do not like crankcase pressure.

 

[dtmoke]

If 350 is your goal - keep it simple. Stock bore/build motor, Mitsu 16g, 1000cc injectors and DSMLink. Keep it auto for now. After you get the car running and have all the other issues worked out then you can think about a 5 speed swap. When you're rebuilding these cars for the first time things get complicated and expensive fast, I'd try and keep it as simple as possible. Good luck man, you'll have a blast!!