Who has the highest WHP for a T/C'd 420A?

[DarkOne]

Are you suggesting he is running 110 psi of fuel pressure?

He most likely is. Only two ways to increase fuel flow - bigger injector, or more pressure. There is a very finite limit to what a stock 2gnt ECU can control and still maintian closed loop idle operation, so more fuel pressure is the logical answer for us. Don't compare our methods to yours, because there is very little correlation between your mod path and ours.

 

[Malenko]

perhaps my point eluded you.

if a GST/X owner post he made a high HP rating that was boarderline questionable, this site would accept it, not have a 4 page long thread of bashing,defending, and demanding of proof and what not.

I agree with your point about n00bs and all that jazz, but its obvious hes put the time and money into his car. Whats the point of all this anyway? Just the ability for one of you to say "I told you so" ?

As for 400HP not being impressive for a DSM.... hes taking it from 140 to 400, not 210 to 400. Mentioning a 3G eclipse should be a bannable offense imo.

EDIT: Leaky just browse the site long enough, you'll find it

 

[2fast420a]

Are you suggesting he is running 110 psi of fuel pressure?

Show me one post where someone disrespected the 420A.

What we ARE saying is that this one guy isn't making it on 440cc injectors. This is definetly NOT a 4g63 vs 420A thread. I thought most people learned to read in kindergarden.

I think Melenko is just wanting to make sure this does not turn into a 420a hate session. Your right though this has nothing to do with motor A vs motor B. Just one guy, one lie, and no proof

 

[2fast420a]

perhaps my point eluded you.

if a GST/X owner post he made a high HP rating that was boarderline questionable, this site would accept it, not have a 4 page long thread of bashing,defending, and demanding of proof and what not.

I agree with your point about n00bs and all that jazz, but its obvious hes put the time and money into his car. Whats the point of all this anyway? Just the ability for one of you to say "I told you so" ?

As for 400HP not being impressive for a DSM.... hes taking it from 140 to 400, not 210 to 400. Mentioning a 3G eclipse should be a bannable offense imo.

EDIT: Leaky just browse the site long enough, you'll find it

My thing is that I called him out a year ago when he started lying. He eluded having to put up any proof. Now here we are a year later and still no proof. It's not about "I told you so". It's about exposing a fake for what it is. Seriously how can you keep claiming to be fast when you have no proof? It's not like anyone is asking him to drive out here and show us. A simple scan or video would suffice. I'm calling him out so he can prove me wrong once and for all. If he posts up the dyno sheet with the numbers he claims at the psi he claims then I'll gladly eat my words.

 

[DarkOne]

Ah hem.

Can we go back to posting real dyno sheets and discussing them, please? All the back and forth is making my head hurt.

 

[turbo8u]

Ah hem.

Can we go back to posting real dyno sheets and discussing them, please? All the back and forth is making my head hurt.

dinowned

 

[Malenko]

Im unsubscribing now anyway. first time I posted here inmonths and I get like 13 emails from dsmtuners notifying me of a reply.

PS, its mAlenko not mElenko I hate that.

 

[leakyfaucet]

if a GST/X owner post he made a high HP rating that was boarderline questionable, this site would accept it, not have a 4 page long thread of bashing,defending, and demanding of proof and what not.

EDIT: Actually, they would do the same thing.
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=87062&highlight=daily+driver

Okay, seriously, are we really supposed to believe a guy who claims to have run a perfect 9.000 flat in the 1/8 but fails to post a MPH? (or a time sheet for that matter)

im not here to convince one disturbed sole on the internet that i ran a 9 flat. i have friends that were there with me and i dont need to prove this to you, nor will i bother trying simply because it happened last summer.

And then says this:

as far as duty cycle. i have no clue because i dont use any electric fuel controller

In case you don't know, there's no way his car would be running worth a crap or at all after putting 440cc injectors in but no way to control them.

 

[DarkOne]

In case you don't know, there's no way his car would be running worth a crap or at all after putting 440cc injectors in but no way to control them.

You're making comparisons that are not valid. 4g63 cars can use electronics such as the SAFC to control larger injectors because of the much wider range of airflow that their MAS/MAF can read when compared to the 2gnt's 1Bar map sensor. An SAFC can only do so much for us due to our air meter's limited ability. Because of this, 2gnt owners will generally use a rising rate regulator to control (read: reduce at idle, increase while under boost) fuel pressure which in turn will reduce flow at the injector nozzle. a 440cc/min injector can be made to idle in a closed loop situation (eg, withing the bounds of our ECU's control) at about 13-15psi of idle fuel pressure. if we were to do the same with an SAFC, the vast change in our air meter's output to the ECU would throw off the % load calculations, which monkeys up timing advance calculations among other things. It works, but it'll eventually break things. 4g63 cars can use fuel pressure in the same manner (any EFI car can) but in practice they don't have much need until running an injector above a 680cc/min or so (from what i have seen.)

For what its worth, the 420A ECU does not report injector duty cycle or pulsewidth to a readable interface. There is no way he could know without taking his max fuel pressure, injector open time, and duration of available firing time for the injector at the RPM of peak torque and blah blah blah you get the point.

Back to your regularly scheduled discussion in 3.. 2.. 1...

 

[turbo8u]

im actually surpised dino is giving this thread the time of day,

 

[boostedinaz]

I think its funny that all this guys friends say we are going to get owned and take time to make useless threats but cant take 30 seconds to post a sheet of paper that would end this all. Most people that make big numbers in there particular sect will have alot of proof and a good setup. Dre had all kinds of proof and posted it up before even making the claims. This guy is supposedly running a 110 psi fuel pressure to make use of to small injectors. That is a bandaid and likely that his car will live a short life. If he truly is making that power you would think he would have a better setup.

Michael

 

[DarkOne]

This guy is supposedly running a 110 psi fuel pressure to make use of to small injectors. That is a bandaid and likely that his car will live a short life. If he truly is making that power you would think he would have a better setup.

See my other post. There is a reason behind it and despite the fact that is is not an ideal setup, it works well, for many people, and has for a long time.

Regardless, i could give two shits about siu's claims. Come ShootOut time, i will see it myself and can make my own judgement. I'm just here because someone was asking about turbo 420A dyno sheets and i happen to have a few. I also like to have semi intelligent discussion. Sometimes its nice to post somewhere other than 2gnt.com.

 

[tim97rs]

since we are on dynos... here is my ratty ass dyno. critisize and critique all ya like, cause you wont say anythinig i havent already said about it.
i know its a shitty dyno, but thats what ya get with an untuned system, un-adjusted cam gears, and a pain in the ass new boost controller that requires a quantum physics degree just to figure out, that gives you a lot of little boost spikes...

287 whp and 282 tq on 15ish psi 92 octane

 

[boostedinaz]

See my other post. There is a reason behind it and despite the fact that is is not an ideal setup, it works well, for many people, and has for a long time.

I understand that your ECU is not as tunable as ours or others in the car market, but that just seems like a better reason to go to a stand alone or some other piggy back. Like I said earlier when you get to the top you most likely need better equipment than those below you. Most that are making lowrer numbers could probably use that setup no problem, but he is "making" almost 400 at the wheels with just an FMU and a shit load of fuel pressure. Still seems cheasy and doesnt add up.

Michael

 

[DarkOne]

I'm not saying it adds up to siu's power output either. I'm simply explaining why it is done this way and staing that the overwhelming evidence backs up the fact that the methods work, even if they are not technically "correct".

What will a 440cc/min injector flow at 110psi and 100% duty cycle, anyway?

 

[uberingram]

BTW try to keep the childish remarks to a minimum grownups are talking in here

Then why are you still posting? Go throw your e-dick around in PM's or email. If his numbers are fake and doesn't post dyno's then let it become some forgotten foot note on page # 132856254. For some weird reason I feel like you actually have something more important in your life then to dig up threads and fake giving a damn. God damn man, let it go. If his numbers are real and I were him then I wouldn't be giving the time of day to you either. You wouldn't be "damn man those are nice numbers." Please. You'd find some other minuscule detail to whine about becuase that's what you do best. Your story is the oldest ever recorded, Thomas.

Drink a beer, get laid, go see a movie...hell I dunno. Do something productive, god forbid.

 

[turboed420A]

I think I know where James got the 382whp from.... Hahn has a new fuel system setup that pulls... guess what 380whp! http://www.hahnracecraft.com/auto/engine/fuel injectors.htm

He will probably install this new 8 injector setup from hahn and tell us to shove it up our ass. but anywayz, I'm sooo pissed that Hahn finally released this after I spent thousands on the AEM box and big ass injectors... Oh well. I guess we will see what happens when my new one of a kind ecu setup is done. It will take two days of dynoing to just tune drivability. Talk about a pain in the ass moving the stock PCM wiring harness to the Honda AEM box behind the glove box inside the passenger compartment.

What is up with all the swearing and threats to beat eachother up like 12 year olds?
I know I started this thread but come on now No more drama!!!!

 

[uberingram]

He will probably install this new 8 injector setup from hahn and tell us to shove it up our ass. but anywayz, I'm sooo pissed that Hahn finally released this after I spent thousands on the AEM box and big ass injectors... Oh well. I guess we will see what happens when my new one of a kind ecu setup is done. It will take two days of dynoing to just tune drivability. Talk about a pain in the ass moving the stock PCM wiring harness to the Honda AEM box behind the glove box inside the passenger compartment.

http://forums.2gnt.com/dcboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=8&topic_id=74514&mesg_id=74514&page=

2GNT is the place to be for happening information on the 420A platform.

 

[2fast420a]

I have just as much right to post my doubts as you do to complain about them. James said he has the 382hp now, not after the Hahn fuel setup. He says that after the Hahn setup he should be putting down over 400hp. Like Darkone said, the shootout will end this BS once and for all. Then when he shows up he can prove me wrong and I will gladly apologize and give proper credit where it is due. Hell, I'll do it now if he just post proof of the numbers . Just remember siueclipse, all eyes are on you at Norwalk so it better be a good show.

Oh yeah :thumbdown

 

[RHui_BC]

Secret my ass? That's corbins fuel setup!

 

[turbo8u]

Secret my ass? That's corbins fuel setup!

yea pretty much i personally think the new "fuel system" is retarded. mainly because it took them WAY TO ####ING LONG to actually come out with it after being all
"secret" about it for a long ass time and never coming out with anything. they just used the search on 2gnt imfo. found a good combo for high boost (1:1 reg, 8 inj) and marketed it.

id be willing to bet they got 99.9% of idea from corbin though, and then thought hey...might as well re-locate the injectors to the ports instead of on the runners! corbin proved it works, so why cant we use it to? :thumbdown

now chillfactory's or mrslicks fuel system blows the HRC "poopfooler" straight out of the water

 

[siueclipse]

jesus, you guys are still going on about this?

and before you ask.. no i dont have the video converted. i just got home from being out of town for the weekend. (went to pickup a trailer for the car) Now, Im going to bed because I have to be up at 5am for a meeting at 7.

And yes.. I said 382 before the hrc fuel setup. Anyone on 2gnt knows that I posted my dyno run at least a week or two before friday when I purcahsed the hrc kit.

Ok.. Continue for a few days till I come back again.

 

[2fast420a]

jesus, you guys are still going on about this?

and before you ask.. no i dont have the video converted. i just got home from being out of town for the weekend. (went to pickup a trailer for the car) Now, Im going to bed because I have to be up at 5am for a meeting at 7.

And yes.. I said 382 before the hrc fuel setup. Anyone on 2gnt knows that I posted my dyno run at least a week or two before friday when I purcahsed the hrc kit.

Ok.. Continue for a few days till I come back again.

Were not going to debate this anymore. We just wait for the video from the shootout. Then all questions will be answered.

Does this mean that you will be towing your car to the shootout?

 

[siueclipse]

actually, i just noticed that the indy bash car show (indianapolis) was on the same weekend as the dsm shootout.

i already have plans to go to indybash with friends from the area. I thought the dsm shootout was the following weekend.

I doubt I will have my car together by this weekend anyway. Bill Hahn says that hopefully my fuel system will be here on thursday. That doesn't give me much time to get the motor back in the car and running again.

If it is running by this weekend, Im going to indybash with it.

However, the following weekend I will be going to HAHN Racecraft for a professional tune. I will of course post a dyno sheet (or ask Bill to)j when Im up there if I haven't converted the video by then.

james

 

[2fast420a]

actually, i just noticed that the indy bash car show (indianapolis) was on the same weekend as the dsm shootout.

i already have plans to go to indybash with friends from the area. I thought the dsm shootout was the following weekend.

I doubt I will have my car together by this weekend anyway. Bill Hahn says that hopefully my fuel system will be here on thursday. That doesn't give me much time to get the motor back in the car and running again.

If it is running by this weekend, Im going to indybash with it.

However, the following weekend I will be going to HAHN Racecraft for a professional tune. I will of course post a dyno sheet (or ask Bill to)j when Im up there if I haven't converted the video by then.

james

Alriiiiighty then. I look forward to the 400hp dyno sheet in two weeks