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update 95 gst drag car: oil puddle in exhaust?? pictures inside

Posted by 95DsManiac, Mar 26, 2014

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  1. 95DsManiac

    95DsManiac Proven Member

    300
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    Joined Dec 5, 2012
    Bay Point, California
    Hey everyone,

    So this is kind of a update to the other thread, but more to it the reason for separate threads. Anyhow, today I decided to dig into it some more because I sit here at home and watch videos of everyone else racing and I am just sitting here with a car that wont start still.

    so for starters, I found oil coming out of the exhaust, turbo inlet, and o2 to downpipe gasket. Im running only a downpipe and it is leaking out of there. I can stick my finger in there and there is a puddle of it in there. It is green in color and I did use lucas assembly lube which is green.

    I also found the black particles on the tops of the pistons.
    DSCN1139_zpsee854e08.jpg
    DSCN1150_zps3a8b9f99.jpg

    So today I started with a compression test. Last time I tested it all was around 135-140 and I thought that was good due to the rings not being seated and the engine never being started. Well today I get 176-185 across the board. I was excited to see this because I thought maybe the rings went and that's the oil I was seeing in the exhaust.
    DSCN1131_zpsd4b6da62.jpg
    DSCN1132_zpsab6e7382.jpg

    I then take off the exhaust manifold and turbo. Now remember when I ported and polished my head, I hand polished the runners to a mirror finish 80-1200grit. well they were gunked up with black stuff. The hot side was also black and you can see liquid in there. Same with the manifold. I wiped the stuff off the runners on the head and it comes right off. it smells kind of like gas though??
    DSCN1156_zps857e43b0.jpg
    DSCN1158_zps77465e05.jpg

    What is causing this to happen? why would it kind of smell like gas? Also now the tops of the pistons are gunked up with black stuff even more now. I pulled the valve cover and cant really see anything in there that screams a problem.

    What should I be looking for? Would this stuff be the cause to why my car isn't starting?

    I also took off the COP set up and the dyna tek for now until we can figure this out. Please let me know what you think and what do I need to be looking at, what should I be testing, what things do I need to do to fix these problems??

    Thanks in advance and god bless you all,

    Anthony B.
     

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    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    11.850 @ 121.990 · 2G DSM

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    1990 Plymouth Laser RS Turbo
    manual · 1G DSM
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  2. 95DsManiac

    95DsManiac Proven Member

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    Joined Dec 5, 2012
    Bay Point, California
    I also pulled the injectors and fuel rail. I see little particles here and there. These are brand new injectors and all of the rest of the fuel components. Would this ring a bell to damaged injectors? should I send them off the be cleaned and tested?

    DSCN1166_zps2a9e738d.jpg
    DSCN1163_zpsdd34b77f.jpg
    DSCN1165_zps4cb22f7d.jpg
    DSCN1161_zps5c9da23c.jpg
     

    2K  0

    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    11.850 @ 121.990 · 2G DSM

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    1990 Plymouth Laser RS Turbo
    manual · 1G DSM
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  3. 1G Eclipse94928

    1G Eclipse94928 Proven Member

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    Joined Apr 3, 2013
    Rohnert Park, California
    I'm surprised by the really good compression. How are your gaskets looking? How old are they? I have a similar issue with the gas smelling black gunk, but I just swapped turbos and am doing other winter mods so i'm not sure if its fixed or not, but my head gasket and valve cover gasket had 140k miles on them.
    Subscribed
    E: if you can get them cleaned I would do that for starters
    Oh and how is your tune? What is your goal af/r and you have a wideband?
     

    998  0

    1990 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    manual · 1G DSM
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  4. 95DsManiac

    95DsManiac Proven Member

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    Joined Dec 5, 2012
    Bay Point, California
    I'm surprised too with the good compression. Everything on the car is new. The car has never been started. I can't get it to start. I've done this last build over the past 8-9 months and have been done and trying to get it started the last 2 months. I've done fuel upgrades this month and still can't get it to start. My modification list is up to date as of a few minutes ago so check it for what your looking for as far as info to help with what's going on and what I'm trying to figure out.

    Only thing that's different is I have a T4 twin scroll dnp with 44v tial, GT4202R T4 Twin scroll and 4" hood exit exhaust going on once I get it started. I've been having a difficult time to get it started and really need to figure this out. I need to find out with the help of you all what I need to do, so I can do it and race this season. I'm trying everything I can, so please help with what you, suggest what I need to buy/do/change/repair etc and I will do it.

    It's getting so bad that my wife includes my car in our prayers at the dinner table at night, asking god to help me figure things out with my car, to give me answers I'm seeking to get it to start and to give me strength if I can't and miss another season. So please don't hold back with suggestions, I'm open to everything and will do anything if your sure it will fix any of these problems in this thread and the other threads I have about my car and the problems I am facing.

    Thanks again and god bless you all,

    Anthony B.

    Oh and a quick foot note: I a doing all these tests a lone so some are harder, I also forgot to WOT with the compression test and I can't get it to operating temp so I don't know how accurate of an test it actually is????
     

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    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    11.850 @ 121.990 · 2G DSM

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  5. 1G Eclipse94928

    1G Eclipse94928 Proven Member

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    Rohnert Park, California
    I would start with making a list of things that aren't new/newish, check your oil pump and oil filter housing if you didn't use the 2 shorter bolts it could be pushing oil past there.
    How old is your wideband? Maybe you need a new sensor? Did you adjust idle and biss?
    and i would take the head off to check pistons if you cant find anything to help it.
     

    998  0

    1990 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    manual · 1G DSM
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  6. Spdfreak

    Spdfreak Proven Member

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    Joined Jul 12, 2009
    san diego, California
    Pull your upper intercooler pipe to check and see if there is oil residue in there. Sounds like you possibly have a blown seal on the turbo pushing oil into the motor.
     

    2K  24

    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    14.630 @ 104.000 · 2G DSM
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  7. 95DsManiac

    95DsManiac Proven Member

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    Bay Point, California
    I'm pretty confident the housing bolts and everything in that location is correctly installed. I will check to make sure. I need to check timing again so when I'm doing that I'll try to dig into that as well. Because the other day when I was trying to start I did hear this loud scraping sound. It will happen and then go away. But it would only happen when it was on the verge of finally starting.
    You must not have understood my last reply. Or maybe didn't check my profile. I have a q45 throttle body and dsmlink. All I have to do is press the throttle all the way to the ground and right click-TPS adjust-done.
    Wideband is maybe a year old tops. Sensor is newer, but I will buy one after I cross off other things that don't work. Also, you think I bad sensor would cause me to leak oil, or the car not starting?? I've started the car before with no o2 sensor and a unplugged wideband, it just ran like crap. There's something wrong here that I can't seem to figure out.

    Honestly, I think the gas smell and carbon build is from combustion and compression causing H2O and it being pushed along with carbon build up throughout the exhaust side into the ports, manifold and hot side. As far as the oil, I think it may be coming from the turbo seals, or maybe the valve stem seals, but they are new.

    And your suggesting to pull the head exactly for what? I want to make sure I completely understand before I do that. I have a inspection camera so I can see the piston tops, the car is got great compression, what else would I need to check on the pistons??

    Just make things a little simpler, I'm not new to this, I appreciate everything and all help given, but something's have already been mentioned in this thread. Please read it, I need to figure this out and do it in the best manner, not start pulling things that don't need to be pulled etc.

    Ok I'll check that today. Do you think it will be able to push oil that far? There is substantial amount of oil coming out of the exhaust pipe, but I'm more leaning to the this:

    Carbon build up in the exhaust ports, manifold and hot side is from h20 being built up from combustion and compression and the car not starting is allowing to escape through the exhaust unburnt, and thus the smell of gas I am getting. And the oil coming out of the o2-downpipe gasket, and the downpipe itself maybe is the shaft seal gone and causing the oil to be pushed through the pipes. And maybe the loud scraping noise is the turbine wheel scraping the housing??

    I'm checking all this today and will be back with what I find.

    Thanks again and god bless,

    Anthony B.
     

    2K  0

    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    11.850 @ 121.990 · 2G DSM

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    1990 Plymouth Laser RS Turbo
    manual · 1G DSM
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  8. Pipnorcali

    Pipnorcali Proven Member

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    Joined Oct 29, 2011
    Grass valley, California
    If oil is getting in the cyl. Your compression will go up...did you figure out the foam bits in your fuel system? I would say toss it on a trailer and have ted or dave look at it , seems like you got a few issuses going on here...gotta get it ready the next race is april 27th and after that is gets hot at sac
     

    2K  0

    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    12.636 @ 111.92 · 2G DSM
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  9. 95DsManiac

    95DsManiac Proven Member

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    Bay Point, California
    I know, but I'd doesn't seem to be oil in the cylinders, I'm going to try and make a long q-tip to get a sample of it. I t doesn't seem to be oil though. I'll confirm today. Also, I tried to email ted again a couple days ago to get help from him, but he didn't reply. And honestly if you look at his prices it is going to just ad up, what I'm saying is I can do most of it, like take turbo related parts off, and everything else off that he tells me to do so I don't end up with a 2,000 bill for a simple fix. But still, he didn't get back to me.

    Anthony B.
     

    2K  0

    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    11.850 @ 121.990 · 2G DSM

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    1990 Plymouth Laser RS Turbo
    manual · 1G DSM
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  10. Pipnorcali

    Pipnorcali Proven Member

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    Joined Oct 29, 2011
    Grass valley, California
    Yea I hear ya it could add up and you can do most of it yourself ....I would hate to see ya mess something up if it does fire up...did ya try to pm'n him on this forum

    It looks like its flooding n getting crazy carbon build up..so its never fired up? What did the spark plugs look like?
     

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    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    12.636 @ 111.92 · 2G DSM
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  11. 95DsManiac

    95DsManiac Proven Member

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    Bay Point, California
    Plugs looked ok, black, but I've changed them maybe three times and they have never been on the car when started. I will buy some more and out them to the side.

    I just ordered MTX wideband with one day shipping, should get it tomorrow, so I can just altogether cross that out of possible problems.

    Anthony B.
     

    2K  0

    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    11.850 @ 121.990 · 2G DSM

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    1990 Plymouth Laser RS Turbo
    manual · 1G DSM
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  12. 95DsManiac

    95DsManiac Proven Member

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    Bay Point, California
    Ok, so im working on the car as we speak and im going to try and upload pictures as I go and try to show you all what im doing. so far this is what I got, im going to be taking a break in a couple minutes and grab some food with my wife. I will be working on it when I get home. Should be home in a few hours and will probably work on it until 10-11 so hopefully I can get some good info for we can solve this.

    02 sensor was wet
    DSCN1170_zpsbde79def.jpg

    DSCN1171_zps1494f123.jpg

    Nothing in the upper intercooler pipe or throttle body
    DSCN1173_zpsc829c4fd.jpg
    DSCN1174_zps244750db.jpg

    down pipe, o2 housing and lower intercooler pipe
    DSCN1177_zpsf6b6fe9f.jpg
    DSCN1183_zps8bd53e82.jpg
    DSCN1182_zps74db202e.jpg
    DSCN1180_zps22c9372d.jpg

    Turbo
    DSCN1184_zpsea70a16c.jpg

    The exhaust ports cleaned up good?
    DSCN1175_zps9af79233.jpg

    Also a quick note, I already order another wideband, the Innovative MTX. I also ordered the gaskets and 44mm tial wastegate to put the GT4202R set up on the car to see if the turbo was part of the issue of it not starting.

    Thanks again and god bless,

    Anthony B.
     

    2K  0

    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    11.850 @ 121.990 · 2G DSM

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    1990 Plymouth Laser RS Turbo
    manual · 1G DSM
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  13. Rsawd95dsm

    Rsawd95dsm Proven Member

    765
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    Joined Feb 21, 2008
    Zeeland, Michigan
    I don't think your wideband was the problem. I don't think its the plugs either.

    What plugs are you running and what are they gapped to?

    What size injectors are you running? Are you sure that your global fuel and deadtime are set up right in link?

    Make sure you can confirm spark also.



    Seems to me that global fuel and deadtime isn't set up right and plugs are either gapped to far or not enough. Or you have no spark.

    Even tho the car wont start post up a log of how you have things set up so we can look it over.
     

    2K  1

    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    manual · 1G DSM
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  14. 97_4g63t

    97_4g63t Supporting VIP

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    I'm guessing you checked all of your basics? Spark, boost leaks, fuel leaks, fuel pressure? Maybe post a log of trying to start it with some dead log in it?
     

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    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    11.96 @ 124.83 · 2G DSM
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  15. Spdfreak

    Spdfreak Proven Member

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    Joined Jul 12, 2009
    san diego, California
    Ok so there was no oil in the upper intercooler pipe or throttle body good, So now I'm trying to figure out that picture of the compressor outlet was that oil running out of it? I also noticed you said your'e running a ball bearing gt42r how are you feeding this turbo from the head or the oil filter housing and are you using a restrictor? I wouldn't install new sensors until you find the leak because you will just oil foul the wideband. Did you check the compressor wheel for any shaft play, if the turbo checks out fine I would perform a cylinder leak down test that should be more helpful in this situation to diagnose blown valve seals or head gasket.
     

    2K  24

    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    14.630 @ 104.000 · 2G DSM
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  16. Archer Fabrications

    Archer Fabrications Proven Member

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    Valve stem seals
     

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    2006 Evo 9 MR
    awd · manual · Lancer Evolution
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  17. lasthope05

    lasthope05 Proven Member

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    Philadelphia, Pennsylvania
    Something has to be wrong with the motor and maybe a stuck injector. You have both oil and fluid in your exahust system. There should not be anything wrong with the turbo. Last I heard, oil doesnt travel up and coat the exhaust ports on the head.
     
  18. 95DsManiac

    95DsManiac Proven Member

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    Joined Dec 5, 2012
    Bay Point, California
    Rci2200cc are the injectors. Head gasket is good. Compression is good. Plugs are br8es gapped at .26. The turbo on the car right now is a hx40. And the one I have is a Jb gt42. I am visiting at my moths house and will be home shortly. I will be back in the garage to check the things you all are suggesting.

    I am feeding the turbo from the oil filter housing. I don't have balance shafts and I do have an inline restrictor. I also am hoping it just the valve stem seals as well. But there is something else going on because of the fuel. I think maybe the oil drain was kinked as well. I have ordered many things already to fix some of it hopefully.

    As far as fuel pressure I'm not 100% sure because I'm the only one working on the car. I don't have help and just got a tri pod for my camera so I can get some shots when I do get it back together. I will definitely be checking that once I get my wastegate to put on the gt42.

    As far as the fuel calibrations, I'm not sure on that either. I not found one thread on how to tune for the 2200s and have used that. I do have logs of trying to start it and I will upload them once I get home.

    I can't stress enough how appreciative I am for your help. I have nobody else but my Dsm family when it comes to my car and acquiring knowledge and a helping hand. So please don't hesitate to ask if any of you need something. I'm great fuel for the help given.

    Thanks again and god bless,

    Anthony B.
     

    2K  0

    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    11.850 @ 121.990 · 2G DSM

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    1990 Plymouth Laser RS Turbo
    manual · 1G DSM
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  19. Spdfreak

    Spdfreak Proven Member

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    Joined Jul 12, 2009
    san diego, California
    Do you have access to a smaller set of injectors or stock ones to try, cause if the settings for fuel are wrong you can just be dumping way to much fuel at start up flooding the motor causing it not to start with injectors that big or they can possibly be leaking.
     

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    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    14.630 @ 104.000 · 2G DSM
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  20. eagletalontsi90

    eagletalontsi90 Probationary Member

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    it is either blowby or looks to me lik the valve seals are leaking oil check those two things first
     

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    1993 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    · 1G DSM
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  21. 97_4g63t

    97_4g63t Supporting VIP

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    Turn your fuel pump on through link and go look at the gauge. You can do it that way by yourself and I've found it to be a lot easier and steadier than with the engine running. While the fp is on check all of your connections for leaks and or kinks. Another useful tip. When you put your plugs in don't just drop them in. Use a spark plug socket so you don't damage or mess the gap up. Since you just replaced the fuel injectors I would do another blt. Could have a bad seal.
     

    3K  7

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    11.96 @ 124.83 · 2G DSM
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  22. 95DsManiac

    95DsManiac Proven Member

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    Bay Point, California
    Ok great advice everyone. I will for sure be doing all of these things tomorrow for I am barely getting home and am watching a movie with my wife because my son is asleep. I am going to grab my note book and write these things down and just go through them one by one. Also, I'm not trying to tear the motor apart of take anything off that absolutely needs to be taken off right now without making sure the easy things are marked off as good to go.

    So, I some of these I won't be able to do until I get all the regular stuff done first.

    I have a few questions also, may seem like stupid question but I'm not affraid to ask :)

    1. Can I check the injector wires with an multiple meter to check them off as good? Along with the injectors themselves? If so how? What readings to look for, what settings on the multiple meter to use and how to test them?
    2. Can I check to make sure spark is good with a multiple meter? Can I check to make sure the COP is good with the multiple meter, can I check to make sure the Arc2 is good with the multiple meter? Is so how, what settings to use and what results to look for?
    3. What would make a pfffffffffff sound while cranking the engine? Like when I crank it for say 7-10 seconds I hear a loud pfffffffffffffff, like air being released. What would this be and what would cause it?

    Also I will do tests as I am able to. For example, I have the turbo, manifold, and Intercooler pipes off the car, so I can't do a boost leak test. So, what tests can I and should I do knowing these things are off the car? Also the fuel rail, injectors, cop, and arc2 are off/unplugged as well.

    Thanks again for your help everyone, you all are truly a blessing, god bless,

    Anthony B.
     

    2K  0

    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    11.850 @ 121.990 · 2G DSM

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    1990 Plymouth Laser RS Turbo
    manual · 1G DSM
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  23. 95DsManiac

    95DsManiac Proven Member

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    Joined Dec 5, 2012
    Bay Point, California
    Hey everyone,

    I was up all night researching and writing things down in my notebook on things to test and how to test them. I was just down in the garage doing some testing and these are my results.

    Timing was surprisingly perfect!!
    DSCN1193_zps30490285.jpg
    DSCN1192_zps8b99f879.jpg
    DSCN1191_zps642f5383.jpg
    DSCN1190_zpsc5911b2b.jpg

    This is how the CAS is mounted on the head. When I took it off it was a little off?
    DSCN1188_zpsb8bfc704.jpg
    DSCN1187_zps14cf8138.jpg
    DSCN1186_zps92b1d634.jpg

    I also did some testing with the multi meter. I was only able to do a few things due to things being off the car.

    1. Coil pack hi voltage terminals: 12.85 1-4 12.91 2-3Kohms (normal is 10.3-13.9Ohms)

    2. Coil pack connector sensor side: 0.8Ohms pins 1-3 0.7-0.8Ohms Pins 2-3 (normal is 0.77-0.95)

    3. CAS sensor side: 31.80Mohms pins 2-4 31.82 Mohms pins 2-3 4.92Kohms pins 3-4 1-2 pins I get no reading 1-3 pins I get 27.19 Mohms nothing happens if I was to turn the sensor.

    4. Coolant temperature sensor, sensor side: 2.712Kohms (normal is 2.1-2.7Kohms)

    So far things are looking good right? But what about the CAS readings> What about it being off a little bit, will that cause the car to be acting this way??

    Im going to be testing more things when I install parts and when I get the tial 44mm vband I will be able to slap the gt42 set up on. Also, I think the oil I was getting in the o2 housing and downpipe was from the turbo. I think the feed was doing its job, but the drain was routed not strait so it was backing it up instead of draining and going through the exhaust??

    Im also going to be slapping on my old bosch 1600cc injectors to see if that works. But honestly I think I am getting fuel, maybe just too much because I haven't dialed in the injectors correctly?? since I know how to set up the 1600s maybe I can get the fuel flowing correctly.

    I am starting to think maybe I have the CAS wires in wrong. It seems like im getting everything but correct spark. My old engine harness the shop wired in the CAS and I got a new harness for the rewire and wire tuck and maybe I wired it wrong? Ill be checking it today. Hopefully I can start cracking down on this.

    Thanks again for all your help and god bless,

    Anthony B.
     

    2K  0

    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    11.850 @ 121.990 · 2G DSM

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    1990 Plymouth Laser RS Turbo
    manual · 1G DSM
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  24. 95DsManiac

    95DsManiac Proven Member

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    GOT THE CAR TO START. CHECK OUT THE OTHER THREAD.

    Anthony B.
     

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    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    11.850 @ 121.990 · 2G DSM

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    1990 Plymouth Laser RS Turbo
    manual · 1G DSM
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  25. Archer Fabrications

    Archer Fabrications Proven Member

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    Scottsdale, Arizona
    Was it resistor pack??
     

    837  17

    2006 Evo 9 MR
    awd · manual · Lancer Evolution
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