turbo or not to turbo

[carmiencke]

So heres the deal. I have a 90 gs with 203xxx miles on the original motor. The tranny has been replaced along with the cylinder head from the looks of it. I have a friend that picked up an awd tsi recently and has started replacing stuff so he has been giving me stock turbo parts. My question is can i turbo my car without having to worry about it blowing up on me in 5k miles. If i do i will run a 14b with just a couple extra pounds of boost and e85 with a way to tune all of it. I know its not the best option considering the miles but hey the parts are mostly free. Im only worried about the bottem end. I have done a ton of matience to it. So i would like to just get some insight on this and not critism. Thank you.

 

[donniekak]

You're going to want to run a turbo ecu as well. If you get an eprom you can burn a chip with a timing map to run those 9 to 1 pistons on 91 octane.

 

[carmiencke]

You're going to want to run a turbo ecu as well. If you get an eprom you can burn a chip with a timing map to run those 9 to 1 pistons on 91 octane.

I know about the ecu and id be running e85. My question is would it still be reliable. Also your on 3si.org huh?

 

[cdm_sd02]

I know about the ecu and id be running e85. My question is would it still be reliable. Also your on 3si.org huh?

What work did you do on the bottom end?
There's a few "stock bottom end" car's out there doing 10 sec runs

 

[donniekak]

As long as you run e-85 it should be fine. I've run some aftermarket 9:1 pistons on e-85. The timing didn't quite match the agressive stock map, but the boost was also higher, so you should be ok. Being up north, you are going to find out how e-85 acts when it's cold out. Hard starts, and your heater won't work for 10 minutes. Oh yes i'm on 3si also.

 

[nyTalonTsi]

I'd just run real low boost on that motor. Ditch the e-85. Then after the motor is done build a 4g63.

 

[1990AWD]

As long as you run e-85 it should be fine. I've run some aftermarket 9:1 pistons on e-85. The timing didn't quite match the agressive stock map, but the boost was also higher, so you should be ok. Being up north, you are going to find out how e-85 acts when it's cold out. Hard starts, and your heater won't work for 10 minutes. Oh yes i'm on 3si also.

I don't care where in Arizona you are, it ain't cold there.

 

[tjbiker031]

If you are aware of what your motor needs to put a turbo on it....they i would say yeah, go ahead. stick with pump gas with a 14b and you should be ok as long as you dont go above 9psi. I believe anything higher then that will make you sad when you see the fist-sized hole on your block.

 

[carmiencke]

What work did you do on the bottom end?
There's a few "stock bottom end" car's out there doing 10 sec runs

The bottem end is stock and untoched. Thats were my main concern is. I live in scottsdale, not up north now so i wont have to worry about the cold starts as much. I also heard they change the mixture on e85 during different seasons so it doest equal out to exactly e85. I could be wrong though. I want to run about 10 to 14 psi depending and thats why i want to run e85 and not pump gas due to it being easier to tune with it.

 

[fstfcs]

turbo, but with e85 im almost postive you need some pretty hefty injectors to move it correctly

 

[rEclipserGST]

turbo, but with e85 im almost positive you need some pretty hefty injectors to move it correctly

Yes you will need injectors that are big to use e85. Needs 30%-40% more fuel than gasoline. So your going to need at least 850 injectors. You might want to search harder, just because your running e85, does not mean you can run more boost automatically. You need MORE fuel to run MORE boost. Regular gas vs e85 means your actually getting less gas but at a higher octane rating which in turn would mean less knock.

Plenty of threads on e85 and even MORE threads on turbocharging a N/T car. Search it up bro.

 

[carmiencke]

Read my original post. Im not asking on how to turbo my car or run e85. I know running e85 means you cant autimaticaly run more boost. I just want it for extra protection considering its a higher compression motor and has alot of miles on it. Thank you to everyone that has posted.

 

[southrneclipser]

with that many miles you are better off finding a turbo bottom end or at least put the turbo pistons in your motor. Ideally you would want to rebuild your bottom completely. You asked if it would be reliable as it.-No it would not be reliable at all. Your Best bet is to find a decent turbo motor and throw your free turbo stuff on it. Your going to have to pull the engine anyways, might as well swap it with one that will hold up to boost.

 

[donniekak]

I don't care where in Arizona you are, it ain't cold there.

I was in Flagstaff last winter, they had 3 feet of snow in 12 hours. My awd stealth was owning 4x4 trucks.
Some 680's are plenty for e-85 at 14 psi. That is also a pretty safe tune for e-85, 9:1 compression, and a stock timing curve. You are going to kill your clutch and transmission. Personally i would leave it stock. I find awd turbo 1g's for $1500 all the time out here.

 

[MadBeachDSM]

Just don't expect anything more than 8psi. The stock N/T clutch will never hold any more power than that, especially if it has some miles on it. Just run wastegate pressure and you will be safe provided you don't end up with boost creep. On a motor with that many miles I still wouldn't do it just due to the work involved and that you may be pulling the motor in 5,000 miles or less anyway whether you turbo it now or not. If I was you, I'd just find a 4g63t block and head, that's either in ok condition and useable without too many miles, or do a stock rebuild. If you look around a bit, you can find a complete motor for pretty cheap. Then you'll be ready when your n/t motor does go.

Irregardless, take my advice, a stock N/T clutch will never hold turbo power. The tranny will for some time provided it is in decent shape now.

 

[rEclipserGST]

The bottem end is stock and untoched. Thats were my main concern is. I live in scottsdale, not up north now so i wont have to worry about the cold starts as much. I also heard they change the mixture on e85 during different seasons so it doest equal out to exactly e85. I could be wrong though. I want to run about 10 to 14 psi depending and thats why i want to run e85 and not pump gas due to it being easier to tune with it.

Your not asking? What are you asking then, I clearly see you claiming that e85 is easier to tune with. You have not searched... there's no way you have if you claim that statement is true. If e85 was so easy to tune on, EVERYONE would be using it. Stock turbo cars are having problems pushing 14 lbs, and you want to run that on a higher compression, high mileage car???WTF

I think I read your original post just fine. I'm not being a dick, I just get to the point. So I'm sorry if your upset about what I said, but everything I post is the TRUTH.

So I think you should search and you will be more equip to deal with your goals. You want to turbo a 200,xxx mile N/T car

Get a 14b turbo and go for 8 lbs, get a boost gauge, ecu, tuning tools, an mbc, walbro 190 fuel pump, and 450 injectors and try to tune that up on e85. Let me know how it goes.

Good luck bud. I gave you the right info, skip it or use it.

 

[carmiencke]

Your not asking? What are you asking then, I clearly see you claiming that e85 is easier to tune with. You have not searched... there's no way you have if you claim that statement is true. If e85 was so easy to tune on, EVERYONE would be using it. Stock turbo cars are having problems pushing 14 lbs, and you want to run that on a higher compression, high mileage car???WTF

I think I read your original post just fine. I'm not being a dick, I just get to the point. So I'm sorry if your upset about what I said, but everything I post is the TRUTH.

So I think you should search and you will be more equip to deal with your goals. You want to turbo a 200,xxx mile N/T car

Get a 14b turbo and go for 8 lbs, get a boost gauge, ecu, tuning tools, an mbc, walbro 190 fuel pump, and 450 injectors and try to tune that up on e85. Let me know how it goes.

Good luck bud. I gave you the right info, skip it or use it.

I never said you were wrong. I was asking people if that setup would be reliable. The only reason i want to turbo it is because im being handed parts for free to do it. For the boost range i just want it in between and i know people get farther than 14 psi with a 14b. I have searched and i cant find anything about people in my sitution with the goals i have in mind. I know its not a common thing to do with the miles on my car but i like i said the parts are free so if i can do it why not.

 

[MadBeachDSM]

I never said you were wrong. I was asking people if that setup would be reliable. The only reason i want to turbo it is because im being handed parts for free to do it. For the boost range i just want it in between and i know people get farther than 14 psi with a 14b. I have searched and i cant find anything about people in my sitution with the goals i have in mind. I know its not a common thing to do with the miles on my car but i like i said the parts are free so if i can do it why not.

I think the biggest problem with the equation is that you want to run E85. Mileage aside, and taking E85 out of the picture, yes, you can turbo your car. Yes, there are people that run 14 psi safely with a 14b, hell, I run 19psi creeping to 21 at times, but on a 4G63 turbo motor with 2g 8.5:1 compression pistons (stock 1g compression ratio is 7.8:1), that is the limit for running high boost levels safely and you still need a way to monitor knock and tune timing out at that. You have an N/T motor with 9.0:1 compression which is a recipe for knock at even mild boost levels, especially with a side mount intercooler. If you insist on turboing the high mileage N/T motor, it is entirely doable, but whatever you do, stick to 8 psi or less, the motor will probably hold up, but what still isn't going to hold up is your clutch even at 8 psi from the 14b.

So to answer your original question, yes, it can be done, yes, I'm sure you can do it, but no, in all probability it will not be reliable unless you baby it and stay out of boost, which entirely defeats the purpose anyway.

 

[donniekak]

Don't listen to any of these people. I have experience with e-85 and high compression pistons. You will not knock under 14lbs and stock timing, no matter what. I have run e-85 in a 9:1 aftermarket piston engine at 38 psi, not some guy i heard of on the interwebs. These people have no first hand experience with high compression (9:1 really isn't high) boosted, alcohol engines. People run e-85 in turbo cars with no intercooler. It is extremly knock resistant, more so than most of the race fuels out there. There is a guy on this forum running a turbo on an 11:1 engine with e-85, without problems. If you get a halfway decent tune your only problems will be in the driveline. I still would keep it stock and buy a gsx/tsi.

 

[carmiencke]

Thank you for your responses. Im just worried of my motor to start having lots of problems. I was going to keep it stock but the parts are free so its tempting. If i had the money i would already own a gsx.

 

[400hp93talon]

Just buy a tsi,tsi awd or gst,gsx its alot easier in the long run. Plus e85 really hurts gas mileage!! Well in my case and all the cars owners ive talked to it does?

 

[carmiencke]

Just buy a tsi,tsi awd or gst,gsx its alot easier in the long run. Plus e85 really hurts gas mileage!! Well in my case and all the cars owners ive talked to it does?

The point isnt to buy a new car. I have free parts for my car. Ive heard from every body that it hurts gas milage but im not worried about that.

 

[400hp93talon]

The point isnt to buy a new car. I have free parts for my car. Ive heard from every body that it hurts gas milage but im not worried about that.

I doubt that motor will hold any boost if you could find a turbo short motor at least that would be worth it, If your just experimenting thats cool man im not sayin not to if its free its free i just hope you have another daily driver.

 

[MadBeachDSM]

The point isnt to buy a new car. I have free parts for my car. Ive heard from every body that it hurts gas milage but im not worried about that.

If the parts are free, sell them and you'll have money towards a turbo car. In the end you'll have a reliable daily driver and a turbo car, that may not be so reliable, but that's ok because you will still have something to drive when the other is down for weeks.