Supercharger? [Merged 11-8] NOT electric superchargers

[14.5 drift]

yes, but a mustang has no problem with getting off the line, a little turbo lag on a v8 would be fine.

Fort me? I dont care about efficiency, I want a kenne belle blasting 30 psi into my gsx from 2k to 9k. Can you say WOW!

So what if i lose some on the top, guess what? I picked it back up on the bottom.

Your 20g wont hit til 4k, my super should hit before 2k. That is more important to me.

Try and think, more responsive than a t25 but more flow capability of a 20g (assuming 20g can't pull 30 psi, then I retract my statement)

 

[Ðawg]

Try and think, more responsive than a t25 but more flow capability of a 20g (assuming 20g can't pull 30 psi, then I retract my statement)

Which it can, with the right supporting mods.

--Scott

 

[psychlow]

So what if i lose some on the top, guess what? I picked it back up on the bottom.

So, when you're racing, do you rev to 3000RPM and shift? No, you push the car to redline. On an AWD platform, do you only rev to 3000RPM when you launch? So if you're racing someone, who cares if you have more power at 3K? Not the person who's passing you because they have more usable high-RPM power.

Your 20g wont hit til 4k, my super should hit before 2k. That is more important to me.

This is why our cars have more than one gear - it's called DOWNSHIFTING.

It sounds like you've read threads about this before, and they turned into turbo vs. chager threads. There is a reason for this - we're just trying to keep you from wasting your money and your time. If you still want to be the guinea pig... by all means.

 

[14.5 drift]

I have an automatic, I need all I can get down low. It's funny how guys act like it would be slow, or a waste of time, when really it would just all out hall balls. To each there own, and I encourage all of you to start your own threads about personel opinions on supercharging. I dont need to be educated, but if you feel the need to educate you should definatly do a write up else where explaining your points. It's like democrat's and republicans, I have made up my mind that I like superchargers, I dont or havn't or wouldn't denounced turbo charging in any way, but today, right now that's not what I'm interested in. I just hope this thread can stay open long enough for the needle in the haystack to pop out and tell me his friend of a friend of his aunts uncles dog supercharged his 4g once. Where are you damn it!!!!!!

 

[sphillips91]

I have an automatic, I need all I can get down low. It's funny how guys act like it would be slow, or a waste of time, when really it would just all out hall balls. To each there own, and I encourage all of you to start your own threads about personel opinions on supercharging. I dont need to be educated, but if you feel the need to educate you should definatly do a write up else where explaining your points. It's like democrat's and republicans, I have made up my mind that I like superchargers, I dont or havn't or wouldn't denounced turbo charging in any way, but today, right now that's not what I'm interested in. I just hope this thread can stay open long enough for the needle in the haystack to pop out and tell me his friend of a friend of his aunts uncles dog supercharged his 4g once. Where are you damn it!!!!!!

It wouldnt be slow just people are trying to explain there is absolutely no benefit to doing it over sticking with the turbo and the only reason to do it is that you want too. If you want to do it and be different fine. Thats more than enough reason for most people but the simple fact is turbos are better in this application and if superchargers were badass enough to be worthwhile alot more people would be doing it instead upgrading the turbo w/ supporting mods.

"Fort me? I dont care about efficiency, I want a kenne belle blasting 30 psi into my gsx from 2k to 9k. Can you say WOW! "

Go for it, its going to cost you ALOT of money in more ways than one. Do it right and than you can say you have one of the FEW supercharged dsms. Its possible, pretty much anything is.

 

[midnght]

Yes, anything is possible with the right amount of money.

Take a few pages of this article for what you can.

 

[damax03]

If you want a kenne belle blasting 30 psi from 2k to 9k you should get a mustang with a kenne belle, because thats what they are made for! Dont you think if that was the best way of doing things you wouldn't be searching all over to find out if anyone has. These engines have been out for over a decade, and I think the people that have been working on them for that long know what they are doing.

 

[14.5 drift]

If you want a kenne belle blasting 30 psi from 2k to 9k you should get a mustang with a kenne belle, because thats what they are made for! Dont you think if that was the best way of doing things you wouldn't be searching all over to find out if anyone has. These engines have been out for over a decade, and I think the people that have been working on them for that long know what they are doing.

I really dont mean to get rude, but what was it that made you think I care? I think that quite frankly I have stated that I didn't, and at no point did I want to talk about or compare turbo's to superchargers. Thanks for your ten cents I do realize what you are saying though....I have decided I would still rather look up the supercharging route anyway. Chances are it will simply cost more than I personally can afford but so far there has been no type of information to proove or disproove cause there hasn't been any information, haha.

On a related topic, does any one know any good fabricators in the so cal area, I have been thinkin it's almost time to give ol jessie james a call and see what his people can do . Any one know any prooven tuners in so cal that are unafraid to take on projects as daring as this?

 

[psychlow]

I really dont mean to get rude, but what was it that made you think I care?

I don't mean to be rude, but you're posting disinformation. Your thread or not, when you post disinformation, you're going to be called on it. The reason being, we don't want some poor fool who doesn't know any better from searching up your post thinking as naively as you do because he thinks you can slap a supercharger on his 4G63 and it'll get him in the 8's because he has mad low end power, yo.

To answer your questions:

is a supercharger possible?

Yes. In fact your car already has a supercharger, but one that is driven by exhaust gasses rather than a belt. Originally called "turbo-superchargers", but later simplified to "turbochargers."

I mean really? Big power with no lag?

Won't happen on a small displacement engine. To get big power, you're going to have to run a supercharger insanely fast. The results? Slipping belts. Maybe, and this is a big maybe, if you have forged internals and a chain/cog drive setup will you'll be able to transfer enough power to the supercharger (without snapping a rod) to cram enough air down the engine to make even 350-400HP. From there, you have to worry about how much low-end parasitic loss you'll have from a supercharger with a .25'' pulley on your little 4-banger, unless you're boosting at idle to keep the damned thing from stalling.

Isn't it worth the try?

No! And that's what we're trying to tell you.

There's a reason, when the racing team that went to the flats in Utah built their setup, they didn't retain a supercharger setup on their 2.0L Ecotec. They switched to a turbo that would support 1100HP.

 

[14.5 drift]

I don't mean to be rude, but you're posting disinformation. Your thread or not, when you post disinformation, you're going to be called on it. The reason being, we don't want some poor fool who doesn't know any better from searching up your post thinking as naively as you do because he thinks you can slap a supercharger on his 4G63 and it'll get him in the 8's because he has mad low end power, yo.

I havn't posted any information, simply that I'm looking for it, please refrain from putting words in my mouth or removing them from context

Won't happen on a small displacement engine. To get big power, you're going to have to run a supercharger insanely fast. The results? Slipping belts. Maybe, and this is a big maybe, if you have forged internals and a chain/cog drive setup will you'll be able to transfer enough power to the supercharger (without snapping a rod) to cram enough air down the engine to make even 350-400HP. From there, you have to worry about how much low-end parasitic loss you'll have from a supercharger with a .25'' pulley on your little 4-banger, unless you're boosting at idle to keep the damned thing from stalling.

The mustang guys aren't having any problems spinning there blowers up to 25 psi, no stalling minor slipping, considering that I will be using a supercharger half the size of there's I see no reason why it would act differently on a motor half the size. I actually know a guy who supercharged his sr20 and has no problems making 350 whp, it has been done on small motors and none of the problems you have mentioned were an issue

No! And that's what we're trying to tell you.

Keep trying, maybe you'll come up with a good point, that comes from real world tests other than your theoretical situations

There's a reason, when the racing team that went to the flats in Utah built their setup, they didn't retain a supercharger setup on their 2.0L Ecotec. They switched to a turbo that would support 1100HP.

If I was building a car for all out top end runs at the flats of course I would go turbo, I on the other hand am just trying to refine the drivability of a high hp small displacement motor. With a supercharger (to be clear not all superchargers act the same so when I refer to a supercharger in this thread I am only referring to kenne belle's and whipple's wich are twin screw) you can recieve maximum boost as low as 2k, and the flow capabilities are very high. In my specific application considering the stock tc is geared to grab at 2.5k that means I would have maximum available boost from off the line to redline. this would make daily driving, passing, autoxing, drag racing, any thing really other than all out high revving top speed road courses more tollerable, refined, and in my case pleasurable. Any amount of debate about top end, efficiency or what ever can not take that away from supercharging. With a turbo the more powerful turbo you use, the more you sacrifice daily driving. This simply is not the same with a supercharger (remember twin screw only). A twin screw is good for 30 psi, the same super charger is good for 2 psi, the same super charger has the same response from around 2k to redline at both psi levels. That is what I WANT and may not be important to many others and i dont care what other people want. Basically as i said before, finances willing I would like to find out about putting a supercharger on my car.

 

[psychlow]

Blah, blah, blah.

I'm done. I don't think I'd find a problem refuting your arugment, but I don't care to because:
1) It's pointless because you've pretty much admitted that you're hard headed and won't be swayed one way or another,
2) It's your money... if you'd like to waste it, feel free to do so however you like,
3) I'm at work, and don't have that much time on my hands.

I will say this, though: there will be no end-all-be-all Holy Grail solution for no lag and big power on a FI small displacement engine, period.

If it were so great, it'd have been done and perfected by companies in much more financially and technically equipped positions than yourself. You're not the only one with ideas.

If you do end up embarking on this, I'm pretty sure you're not going to find much on the subject matter. Those that have thought about this in the past have realized that the cost/benefit ratio just isn't there, and the others that have tried haven't gotten much of anywhere.

Good luck! If you've got it, prove me wrong! I'd be happy to eat my words if you do.

 

[14.5 drift]

Originally Posted by 14.5 drift
Blah, blah, blah.


Really, I think were done. You want to argue points that dont mean any thing to me, you are not accepting that. Hp is important, and as small of lag as possible, if you have a better solution, I am all ears. Again I'd like to remind you, you havn't brought forth any facts that a supercharger would as you put it "suck", Just speculation. So until you know, dont talk like you do, thanks. It also seems like you are more interested in expressiing your opinion than respecting other members on the board, if your rude attitude continues you will just go on the ignore list. Thanks.

 

[sphillips91]

"The mustang guys aren't having any problems spinning there blowers up to 25 psi"

Just make sure you upgrade the internals...like they do.

 

[psychlow]

Really, I think were done.

Wasn't that... what I just... said?

You want to argue points that dont mean any thing to me, you are not accepting that.

I had no problem accepting that... look back and reread.

Hp is important, and as small of lag as possible, if you have a better solution, I am all ears.

The way I would go about it is different - whether or not it'd be better is debatable. You can make 375HP on a tuned engine with a 16G. But then again, I don't mind waiting until 3200RPM for spool - that, to me, is low lag. That's coming from person with a Mustang (285ft-lbs stock) and the previous owner of two 300+ cubic inch engined cars who's used to off-the-line acceleration.

Again I'd like to remind you, you havn't brought forth any facts that a supercharger would as you put it "suck",

I'm sorry? Where did I say that word? You're using quotes on something that was never said. Try using CTRL+F.

Just speculation. So until you know, dont talk like you do, thanks. It also seems like you are more interested in expressiing your opinion than respecting other members on the board, if your rude attitude continues you will just go on the ignore list. Thanks.

Okay, wait a second. You seem to know everything, and sure talk like you do (even for someone who thought that a 20G wouldn't hit 30PSI, until he was corrected). If that's the case, though - if you know everything... why were you asking for help?

You seem to make it out like I am being "disrespectful" to more people than just you - which is the whole reason I chose to post in the first place - your attitude toward the other people who tried to answer you. I feel at no point have I gotten even the slightest bit more rude to you than you were to them.

Ignore me, or not, that's your decision - but that doesn't contribute to a good discussion. Later on down the line, I just might be in a position to help you out.

 

[14.5 drift]

and until you know some factual information on supercharging a dsm you are simply flamatory letters on my screen.

 

[Defiant]

Like Martin Luther King, I also have a dream. That one day, a thread on DSMtuners will contain true information, seasoned with reasoned opinion and verfiable fact.

Sadly, this one ain't that dream.

 

[mikek18]

What are the ups and downs of adding a supercharger to a 92 laser. if its even possible. Also Should I get strut bars or are they a waste of money. I have upgraded exhaust, 16 in racing rims and toyo directional tiers. Ive hacked the air can nd put in a kn filter. If no on the super charger what should I do next. i plan to do new plugs and wires but dont know what kind yet. Any help will be greatly appreciated.

 

[Ghost1984]

I dont really think they make a supercharger kit for our cars, i think they have an electronic supercharger or something like that but its hardly worth the money, plus a turbo is much more efficient because its free hp, a supercharger takes hp to make hp since it runs off a belt, your better off dropping in a turbo engine, or buying a turbo dsm. IMO

 

[mikek18]

Thanks thats what I though but I waned to make sure.

 

[FunkMasterChipZ]

whats up with ppl wanting superchargers? SC's are pretty womanly plus why talk abou thtat electronic one unless ur crazy?

 

[GSGoinFast]

i dunno why people keep wanting SC, maybe to have something different? but i dont think thaey make one for your car

 

[Defiant]

They don't. As a search would have revealed.

And NO, the eBay "electric superchargers" don't work either.

 

[98RedGs]

They don't. As a search would have revealed.
And NO, the eBay "electric superchargers" don't work either.

Nope.
Is yours a 1.8 or a 2.0 non-turbo?

 

[Initial DSM]

Team R.I.P.P. would be the closest you could find that would make a SC for our cars. They have them for the 3G's , but havent had any customers come to them with interest of making one for a 2G. They did state that they would have no problem doing it, just need to see the car in person to fab out the design.

 

[BumpinTitaniums]

Superchargers have advantages over turbos, depending on the design
either way throttle response is way better then on a turbocharged car. Centrifugals apparently make the most power of all power adders (they have the heaviest weight penalties in pro domestic racing) since they don't impede the exhaust at all, less backpressure = more power, and there is more potential out of a header design then a manifold design anyways
Screw type superchargers, like on most AMG benz cars, make huge (like 580lb-ft massive) torque. Turbos don't.