popping sound,almost red line,ran home,now dead?

[90gst_sean]

OK, here's what happened. I tore out of a parking lot after getting the finger from someone that cut me off, go figure. As I cleared first gear things were ok, grabbed second and made my way to red line. As I engaged the clutch to shift to third, there was a popping sound. Not a loud popping sound but good enough one that I was a little embarrassed with people standing on the street corner. I let off the gas to listen to my poor engine. The car still ran but I could tell some thing bad happened. I drove a block and turned around. I got stuck at the light, I was waiting for the RPM's to drop to zero and my car to die on me. As the light turned green, I was able to get up to speed but could give it much gas with out it acting funny. I drove straight home; only a mile. I was able to do 45 MPH but had no power. I parked the Eclipse and switched to my Honda . The car sat for a few days, I started it hoping to have avoided a major problem. It ran at idle for 5 to 10 min, then I turned it off. I didn't have the time to really look into it then. I came back a week later went to turn it over and it wouldn't start.

I took the down time to fix a broken bolt in my turbo. I changed the fuel filter, the old one was really bad. I was hoping that was the problem. I got the turbo back on today and went to start it up. It'll turn over but wont start. I checked two plugs to see if they were getting any gas but couldn't really tell. I would guess there's no gas getting to the plugs. I bot a fuel pressure tester kit but need something to attach to the rail. So can't test yet.

Just before this all happen, I put some cheep octane booster in the tank. Could that have played a part? I was thinking with the octane booster and a bad fuel filter, the was so much timing poled from the engine, that I broke something. I really don't know if thats even possible.

I hope that all I need are some fuel parts. I have a stock fuel set up so far. I just wanted to see if any of this sounds familiar. Thank and I will let you guy's know ether way.

Thanks again, Sean.

out side temp - 47-57F
16G turbo
stock fuel pump
170,00 miles
crap octane boost that I should have never ran. I don't run octane boost normally.
no engine light on dash when happened, and I don't think there's one on now.
I've looked all over engine, oil ok. water ok. 99% sure.

 

[elementalwindx]

I must have f*%#ed something up when I did the timing belt last summer. I bot the car with a blown head gasket and bad turbo for $650. I had the head in the shop for a cheapy fixer, 2 valves, seals, and a grind. There's only 17.000 miles on it sense then. When I did all that, I put a new timing belt, water pump, 16G, but didn't do the tensioner or any or the little belts. I think they're the balancer stuff. I did all gaskets and every thing else I could think of. After I did all that, was when I fell in love with DSM's. Later I asked my friend why he didn't say something about the stuff we skipped, he's supposed to be this supper mechanic. I'm learning from that mistake now...

I'll be sure and do it right this time, you can bet on that!

P.S. I would like to use better pictures, but I tried my hand at a tech write up and use all my space in that. As it is now, I had to remove 2 pic's from there just to put the picture seen above. Does that ever change? I see some members with mass amounts of pictures in file?

Ah I forgot 1g's do have that problem with the long bolt rubbing the belt yeah check up on that too. Also just find a free picture service and upload them to that and do a img link to it here. That belt looks way older than 17k miles, but its probably from that bolt rubbing it and many other things like oil leaks or liquids getting on the belt. Good luck man! Tell us how it goes!

 

[90gst_sean]

Hey guy's, I got some better info for ya. I picked up a 7 gal. air tank, attached it to my boost tester, it still wont hold pressure. My boost gauge doesn't leave the zero box on my vac/boost gauge. It moves a little but not much. I can put my finger on the valve cover vent fitting and feel air escaping. If I plug it, pressure starts to build.

This all tells me something... I just don't know what, it tells me .

Any thoughts?

 

[jott5555]

the fitting on the passanger side of the valve cover or the pcv valve?

 

[elementalwindx]

Hey guy's, I got some better info for ya. I picked up a 7 gal. air tank, attached it to my boost tester, it still wont hold pressure. My boost gauge doesn't leave the zero box on my vac/boost gauge. It moves a little but not much. I can put my finger on the valve cover vent fitting and feel air escaping. If I plug it, pressure starts to build.

This all tells me something... I just don't know what, it tells me .

Any thoughts?

That seems to be normal for 80% of the dsms out there. My 2g talon did that too but it shouldn't be enough to keep the guage from going past 0. Check ALL your IC pipes if thats happening. If anything take a bottle of soap and water and spray all the couplers to look for leaks.

Also, having good throttle body seals helps for 1-3psi or so. I remember the ones on my red gst got so bad that it made it impossible to start the damn thing during winter. It only takes a hour to replace them from beginning to end anyways, so do that too if you havn't.

P.S. Try testing the pipes in sections, block off the pipe that connects to the throttle body elbow and put the tester at the pipe connecting to the turbo or somewhere between and that will test your IC/BOV to see if either of those are leaking, or even just put the tester on the tb elbow and block off the turbo outlet and see if you have an intake manifold leak (probably seals or im gasket)

 

[90gst_sean]

(jott5555) I put my finger on the vent fitting. the PCV is still on in its stock position.

(elementalwindx) I tested with the boost tester attached at the turbos inlet. Then tried to pressurize; no good. So keeping the b-tester at the turbo, I plugged the inner-cooler out let; good pressure. Next, same spot w/ b-tester, I plugged the upper IC pipe just before the throttle body elbow; good pressure. Its got to be in the intake manifold or engine.

You gave me a good idea though. Put the boost tester at the throttle body elbow and try and pressurize the intake and engine from there. That will cut down on the air rush sound and help me locate the leak.

I'm narrowing it down. I cant help but think the problem is in the engine. The head gasket, bad valve or valves, a hole in my block, a hole in my head, a hole through my wallet were my $ was.

You think sense my problem started with a loud popping sound at high RPM's, it could have been my intake gasket giving out? That's seems a little wishful thinking. Maybe someone has herd of that happening before?

If i jumped timing what would be causing the pressure leak? The valves would be all out of whack, right. Would the air be flowing through the intake to the head and back out the tail pipe through open exhaust valves, or what?

What else could have happened? Anything in the lower end. If rings go bad, could it cause this. It wouldn't have happened suddenly though would it? It seems rings would come on slow, and just lack power. My car wasn't supper fast but I don't think I had supper bad rings for having 170,000 miles on it.

Its a learning experience. Soon I will be a master DSM'er. I'm starting to think you have to be to really own one of our cars.

 

[jott5555]

so basically the intake tract tested out ok? as i stated somewhere in this thread i said if you turn the enigne to i beleive 45deg btdc so that all the valve's are all closed, have you had a chance to do a compression test or maybe even a leak down test?

 

[90gst_sean]

The intake track is looking OK. All the way up to the intake mani. Jott5555, you mentioned something about turning the timing 45 degrees, so the intake valves are closed. Can you go into more detail about that for me. That would let me pressure test the intake manifold for leaks. That would be a good next step.

I did a compression test early in the thread, the numbers are listed, and real low. Thats with a cold engine though, keep in mine.

 

[elementalwindx]

(jott5555) I put my finger on the vent fitting. the PCV is still on in its stock position.

(elementalwindx) I tested with the boost tester attached at the turbos inlet. Then tried to pressurize; no good. So keeping the b-tester at the turbo, I plugged the inner-cooler out let; good pressure. Next, same spot w/ b-tester, I plugged the upper IC pipe just before the throttle body elbow; good pressure. Its got to be in the intake manifold or engine.

You gave me a good idea though. Put the boost tester at the throttle body elbow and try and pressurize the intake and engine from there. That will cut down on the air rush sound and help me locate the leak.

I'm narrowing it down. I cant help but think the problem is in the engine. The head gasket, bad valve or valves, a hole in my block, a hole in my head, a hole through my wallet were my $ was.

You think sense my problem started with a loud popping sound at high RPM's, it could have been my intake gasket giving out? That's seems a little wishful thinking. Maybe someone has herd of that happening before?

If i jumped timing what would be causing the pressure leak? The valves would be all out of whack, right. Would the air be flowing through the intake to the head and back out the tail pipe through open exhaust valves, or what?

What else could have happened? Anything in the lower end. If rings go bad, could it cause this. It wouldn't have happened suddenly though would it? It seems rings would come on slow, and just lack power. My car wasn't supper fast but I don't think I had supper bad rings for having 170,000 miles on it.

Its a learning experience. Soon I will be a master DSM'er. I'm starting to think you have to be to really own one of our cars.

You have to take the intake manifold off to get the head resurfaced so I guess if you just want to take the intake manifold off to check the gasket, do it. Its a PITA to do it with the head on the car but w/e.

 

[jott5555]

its not to bad pulling the intake manifold from under with a stubby ratchet... just make sure to tighten it back down nice and tight.. really those low compression numbers scare me a bit..

 

[elementalwindx]

its not to bad pulling the intake manifold from under with a stubby ratchet... just make sure to tighten it back down nice and tight.. really those low compression numbers scare me a bit..

Me too. lowest they should ever be is 130. especially never ever under 100. Which is why I have been saying remove the head from the first post.

 

[90gst_sean]

So I took some time off. I found a spark tester thing. The one that plugs onto the plug and then plugs into the wire and there is a little bulb in the middle. There is no spark when I turn it over.

This is what I am working on now. Any ideas?

#1 no spark at the end of any wire's. This spark tester is new and something I've never used before. To be sure, I unplugged one of the plugs off my Honda to test the spark tester, and sure as shit; the Honda has spark. Its sparked ever time the DSM wont. So its not a bad tester, its a...

#2 I was able to check the resistance between the secondary part of the coil. They check out, I think; 11.45 and 12.34 ish. The #'s are with in the book thats all I really remember. The only problem is the first resistance part, the wire going into the coil is hard to get a reading from. I think I will unbolt it. I'll post... OK the first resistance with the four little prongs (I think 1990's are only ones with 4) got tested. Only three of four prongs gave reading, I think thats OK. 1.1ohm's, 1.1 , & 2.0 . If I did the test rite, I don't think those numbers are in speck. Could this cause NO spark. Any thought on testing the coil pack? (Note: I have the pack totally out of the car)

#3 Wile the car has been laid-up for the past couple of months I had the cap's in the ECU replaced by some one in the Seattle area. There had been some leaking. The guy said he would clean it up, but I don't think he really did anything. When this all happened there was a popping sound, but I am sure it was from out side the car.

#4 The CAS, don't know about that yet. I will look it up and check it out, and post #'s later.

 

[BUCK]

I plugged the upper IC pipe just before the J bend to the th. body. Everything held pressure. That means the BOV is good, I think.

Next, I pulled the top timing belt cover. First I noticed a groove worn in the belts inner edge. I turn the cam's so the notches on them face inward at each other. It doesn't look like it jumped time to me.

What do you guy's think about the groove, what could be rubbing?

Do the cam's look in the rite spot. The notches are even with the cam sprockets center.

What should I look for if the head has to come off next.

Where's the Crank Mark at when you have the Cams in this position?

 

[90gst_sean]

Where's the Crank Mark at when you have the Cams in this position?

This may be a dumb question, but I don't care.

Do I have to take the crank pulley off to check the crank marks? Is there any way to check its positioning with the timing cover still on?

 

[jott5555]

with that groove in the elt your going to have to replace it just rip the thing apart and do it... at this point the thing im going to suggest is grab some local gury's and a 6 pack and bribe em to try to give ya a hand...

 

[BUCK]

This may be a dumb question, but I don't care.

1) Do I have to take the crank pulley off to check the crank marks? 2) Is there any way to check its positioning with the timing cover still on?

the Answers are 1) NO & 2) YES - & no "dumb questions" here - You'll be an EXPERT on Timing in a few weeks ....

From the Adjusting Ignition Timing Link off the ENGINE Section of the VFAQ: http://vfaq.com/index-main.html


Find the tab on the engine guard labeled TDC, 5, 10 so on. Clean all the oil and dirt so that it is visible.


Here is a spare pulley I had to show where to look for your mark (notch).
It is on the center ridge as shown by the arrow.

 

[90gst_sean]

Hey BUCK, I really appreciate the pictures you posted. I only wish I was able to give rep. points that weren't on hold until I get my wings.
Let me tell ya, that took a load off my mind. Looking down at the crank and seeing that little line strait dead on with the zero mark; just like in your pictures.

So that means I didn't jump time, right?

I really think its a problem with my ignition. Like I said earlier in the thread, I tested the coil, and the secondary looks OK. Its the first part that worries me. I'm not to good with the multi meter, but the readings didn't seem to be with in speck.

A new coil is a spendy piece. I have heard someone say to check the transistor maybe, I don't know, but there is something on the side of the coil that looks to be a separate piece. If anyone has half a clue what I talking about, let me know if that could be the problem and how I can test it.

Thanks everyone for the help. I don't think I've been able to drive the car and post here at the same time yet. Its going to be a holiday in my family... I'm marking the calender!

 

[90gst_sean]

So I don't have any spark... I'm working on that. I have a working coil on the way.

Now the other thing that gets me. Is the fact that I cant pressurize my intake manifold. I disconnected every thing up to the throttle body elbow.

The air is going some ware!
I have the cam's and crank at TDC.
What the hell am I doing wrong. I feel like it something I'm just not doing.

Here are some picture of my boost test. I hope you guys will see something that I'm not doing...

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[90gst_sean]

I just spent the last hour prepping the engine for a head removal.

I've tried it the lazy way, now I'll try it your's. I'm throwing in the White towel for a nice greasy one.

All the sensor lines and vacuum hose are off the head. Intakes out. Its ready to have the bolts out.

I'll start that tomorrow night after work, its getting late and I'll end up seeing the sun rise if I start now. Thats not a good thing when I have to open and close a 13 hour shift, that starts at 9:00 AM tomorrow morning.

I guess the above pictures of my attempts at a boost test will have to wait. I'll leave them there for looks until I get everything back together again.

I'm going to take a load of digital pictures this time. My last head gasket was done with a disposable camera. This time will be much better, and you'll all get to see. yaha!

 

[joe]

Dude with all this time you've spent posting on here, you could have had that head off and back on. It takes maybe two hours to take a head off if you have a friend help you lift it off. Its gotta be a blown head gasket or maybe worst case your piston shattered in your engine and took out everything.


All you need is a 10mm, 12mm, 14mm, 17mm, and a 12pt hex head socket, and a haynes manual, maybe a few socket extensions, a jack stand, a floor jack, a block of wood, and if you hate your timing belt, a pair of cutters, and if you dont hate it, just loosen the tensioner pulley and pull it off.

Believe me I've got that list of tools memorized as I just replaced my head and belts. *sigh* It was easy though. Just annoying.

And yes if it jumped timing you can put the car in gear and push it car til you see the cam gears lined up *maybe* and risk bending valves. Honestly, just remove the head. And post pics for us so we know if we're right or wrong

maybe if he checks the timing he'll get about a hundred more pounds of compression? maybe the tire belt is loose did you check that?

 

[LordDigi]

maybe if he checks the timing he'll get about a hundred more pounds of compression? maybe the tire belt is loose did you check that?

I needed that!! He really has a point ... Hopefully, the head will tell a tale, and if it doesn't ... well, you just learned something new If your valves aren't bent and there's no damage to your pistons then I would have to guess that you never aligned your valves correctly ... as in, turn your intake cam so that all your intake valves are closed at the given time you perform the boost leak test. But who knows, by the numbers you gave from the compression test only leans me towards your valves being bent, because blowing your head gasket would only show low numbers in one to two cylinders ... not all four

The pop could have been one of the cylinders right before the power stroke as the valve was bent, the combustion happened resulting in the sound coming out of the chamber into your intake ! You might want to check your injectors to see if they are damaged as well. Now, this is me just brain storming, I'm not saying that this could really be your problem but it is a possibility on a more extreme case.

It could also possibly be a burnt or stuck valve ... all these scenarios are educated guesses and will ultimately be told once you remove the head to investigate. Please post your results