Performance parts for n/a dsm's

[Damn 2nd Gear]

im still wondering what the differences between the modified translator and the regular one is...if any. in the history of DSMs has anyone jsut taken a regular translator and maft and put them on a NT?? time for me to search teh forumms.



lemme kow how the header performs in comparison to the pacesetter one. as much as i was pleased with the pacesetter one id like something better. sorry abot all my nit picking in this thread, im trying to justify paying more money on my NT DSM instead of swapping a 20v JDM motor into my MR2.

 

[Thunderskull]

Here's the deal. There is no real difference. The only difference is that they pretune it for a n/a car with a 3 inch GM MAF and they cut off the plug that connects to the stock MAS wiring. Other than that it's the same thing. They also include very good instructions on how to connect it to the stock wiring.

As for the header, I've never had a pacesetter one so I couldn't tell you the difference other than what I've heard from others. It's a lot sturdier than the pacesetter and it doesn't have the flex section that commonly breaks on the pacesetter header. The welds could be a little cleaner, but they'll hold well. I think they strengthened the welds at the expense of appearence.

 

[Damn 2nd Gear]

alright then all i need to do is get my hands on a copy of the instructions and im set. i wish i would have seen this before my new topic

anyways ill be doing the cheaper route getting a GM maft off ebay and then a translator off ebay and puttig the 130 or so im saving towards a logger cable for some more accurate tuning. punishment is doing a great job getting parts out there for us NA guys, im just cheap



just knoticed that tehy are sellign teh translator with instructions for 230$.....well they wll be seeing some of my money soon.

 

[Thunderskull]

Make sure it's the 2.01 version. It offers better tuning options.

 

[na90dsm]

Here's the deal. There is no real difference. The only difference is that they pretune it for a n/a car with a 3 inch GM MAF and they cut off the plug that connects to the stock MAS wiring. Other than that it's the same thing. They also include very good instructions on how to connect it to the stock wiring.

As for the header, I've never had a pacesetter one so I couldn't tell you the difference other than what I've heard from others. It's a lot sturdier than the pacesetter and it doesn't have the flex section that commonly breaks on the pacesetter header. The welds could be a little cleaner, but they'll hold well. I think they strengthened the welds at the expense of appearence.

paceseter does not have a flex section. its a ball joint type socket with to spring bolts uin the mid downpipe. pacesettes headers are ok but welding sux. i had to port mine to get a nice clean passage through the flange. they weld the inside and otu but do not clean up the bad welds. oh well. i will be oging with punishment this time. well see how it works out

 

[Thunderskull]

Yeah, I wasn't sure what to call that section on the pacesetter. One thing, I took a peek inside the punishment header, and it's smooth as a baby's bare butt.

 

[Thunderskull]

I notice most people on here that have a non turbo are really amature when it comes to automotive performance and what works and what doesn't. Take half of the posts on the "overkill on the CAI" thread for example, it's a god damn tube with a filter, how hard can it be? I think most people with a NT concider a filter and muffler a modded motor.... The turbo crew have more potential when it comes to making affordable power, so people who are into tuning and want lots of power will go with a turbo. I put all my money into suspension, and i can certainly stick with any turbo through the twisties, so it all depends on what you want the car for. I just think there are only a select few of us in the NT community that posses a depth of knowledge that stems past a filter and muffler, that's why it took so long for more advanced tuning and parts to come about. all IMHO.

Well said

 

[na90dsm]

very well said. most people cant see past the fact that our motor in the 1g n/t is the exact same as the turbo motor without oil squirters which you dont need on fordged pistons anyway, and 2 the turbo itself. granted for the wiseass's on thisa forum we have a higher compresison ratio and smaller cams and a biggere tb and no knock sensor, but all the turbo stuff fits our cars. all the cams internals, all bolt ons everythign fits.

we can use the internals as long as we run a n/a compresison raio, magnus sells 10:0:1 compresison pistons and you can get 11:0:1 from a few places. all rods, cranks,valvetrain and such all works. intakes arent hard to make, i had oen and have pics at home i can scan if needed. all electrical adn be dapted to our cars such as safc and a few others.

peopel need to see past the turbo stage and realize we can make power with this motor. all you have to do is think about it and get a game polan goin on.

sorry for spelling

 

[Damn 2nd Gear]

mmm 11:0:1 comp would be nice. im wondering what kind of power increase would be seen on our n/t with some tuning. i see hondas running 11s all motor and i wonder why we cant hit 14s. it just bewilders me. ive seen preludes hitting 13s and they are heavy like we are as well as FWD.

now with the headers, do they come with good gaskets or is it a mix of crap like pacestter sends you? paper gaskets should not be used near heat imo.

 

[Thunderskull]

They can send you the stock gasket. Or you can purchase a copper one for $16. I happened to have a copper one laying around since my gasket is already leaking. That's in addition to the downpipe gasket which is also leaking pretty bad. They sent me a gasket for the downpipe to header, and it looks just like a stock gasket. It's not a pos.

Once I get the supporting fuel mods in place, my next step is to do an engine rebuild with high comp pistons and drop in an hks 272 intake cam. I thought about stroking it to 2.4 litre, but that's going to be too much work. I may do that down the road, but that's not something I'm doing immediately. I'm going to toss a better clutch on there too.

 

[Mike1992]

This paper header to down pipe gasket pacesetter sells is a POS. I had to order my 3rd one a few days ago.

 

[na90dsm]

i got 2 spare n/t blocks here so when i get thi scar and everyoen paid off finally(moms) im gonan build a bottom end.

magnus has 10:-:1 je pistons that are fordged for a descent price. my first bottom end i will use those, eagles and a butchred crank. then from there im gonan do flywheel clutch then on to the motor.

head i want to run a level 4 with 264/272 combo,dejontool intake manifold ported to fit a 75mm tb and a dirrect port 100 shot. should make for an interesting combo. well see what the future brings

 

[punishment]

This thread has been exactly what I needed as far as getting some feedback about n/a performance parts. I wasn't real sure if there would be any interest. I've always had turbo dsm's and never spent any time on the n/a forums until I put together my colt. So keep the emails and suggestions coming.

If you have any specific questions about existing parts email me directly, all the vendors recieved an email about discussing their products in the forums, so I've been watching the thread but will stick to answering questions through emails.

TC
www.punishmentracing-na.com

 

[LaserDad91]

I notice most people on here that have a non turbo are really amature when it comes to automotive performance and what works and what doesn't. Take half of the posts on the "overkill on the CAI" thread for example, it's a god damn tube with a filter, how hard can it be? I think most people with a NT concider a filter and muffler a modded motor.... The turbo crew have more potential when it comes to making affordable power, so people who are into tuning and want lots of power will go with a turbo. I put all my money into suspension, and i can certainly stick with any turbo through the twisties, so it all depends on what you want the car for. I just think there are only a select few of us in the NT community that posses a depth of knowledge that stems past a filter and muffler, that's why it took so long for more advanced tuning and parts to come about. all IMHO.

Yes, I agree, but, I would also extend this to the turbo guys as well. Too many “basic” questions, that can be answered with a little research into a good factory shop manual. Little to no knowledge of basic trouble shooting, (you can tell who and who never worked in garage as a mechanic, or pissed around with a dirt bike, snowmobile, etc. since you have to work on them damn things all the time!!)

I like errr LOVE my DSM, and I do admire what people have done with them, and their knowledge of the systems. It is all very impressive. You cannot beat their flexibility in tuning. But from what I am seeing, they are “plug and play”! Add this component, trick the ECU with this signal, and off we go! And it appears all the tuning is basically a +- change to the stock signal. Pretty cool. I know it is not quite that simple, but that is the general idea I am getting.

You basically need to know very little about what really makes a motor run!! I hardly ever see anyone refer to checking the color of their spark plugs, to determine lean or rich condition, but have seen plenty of posts, where they run too hot, and burn it up! It would just be nice to see more of a balance between “high tech”, and the “basics.”

I have never seen so many people willing to mount their air filters on the ground, near a wheel, so they can get even more rain and dirt on them, all in the name of “cold air” intake!! And pay $100 plus dollars for a kit to do so!! :thumbdown Personally, I would prefer to run some piping, to the filter, to achieve the same result, keeping my filter nice and safe and mostly clean.

I have always said this, for a long time, since my muscle car days.

“Anyone can take a wad of cash, TO a good mechanic, and make a fast car! Show me the guy who can do more than unbolt and bolt in a pre built motor, and that is the guy I will respect the most!!” When the thing quits running, the guy with the “basics know how an engine really works”, will be able to fix it!! On the flip side, it is sometimes better to pay someone more experienced, and avoid mistakes. Either way, we know who and who cannot trouble shoot or fix their car.

My other favorite “anyone can run fast in a straight line, lets hit the corners, and see who can hang”. Gawd I used to have a ball with my ole VW diesel against the hotter cars in the corners………... Put it on three wheels, and glue to their back bumper…….

I guess I would like to see more info on what really makes a N/A car run…cams……….valve timing……..intakes (there is some good stuff out there on intakes), etc. I did see a company that makes superchargers, but non for 1G N/A, now, that would be neat!! In addition, more affordable pricing on parts! !! That latter probably holds back us N/A guys more than anything, cause it is more cost effective to "just buy a turbo".

In closing I mean no disrespect to anyone, just my two cents worth, and a plug to learn your basics!! I don’t have a problem with trying to help someone out where I can, as far as basics, or even basic troubleshooting. I will admit, I have much to learn, and get up to date on about everything!! That is what I really like about the DSM, it is a challenge, and feels good to own something with so much potential, and still get great gas mileage!! However, mine is my daily driver. I need a $500 DSM, with good body, and a wad of cash, my tools, etc. and just tinker away, taking a few breaks with a good cold one!! That day will come, as I get “other” projects completed (ie, the house, the boats, the snowmobiles, etc. !) Good gawd!!! Luckily, my new wife, likes the DSM, and supported me in buying it.........

 

[AdrenilineCrash]

Thats deep.

Well Im ecstatic to see a site that is helping us n/a guys out! Keep up the good work. I want to see some high compression pistons. 12 or something astronomical like that. Im gonna roast some all motor Hoduhs!

-mike

 

[na90dsm]

i thin one thing that would impact n/a motors greatly would be highly fly cut pistons and soplid lift cams with huge amounts of lift. we nee dbigger cams then turbo guy sto get huge air flow. if we could get a cam spec down that would be ideel for n/a that has huge amounts of lift would be good for hp ratings.

fly cutting would allow this to happen without caboom of pistons when they touch valves.also i thinks if we were to use the aluminum bottom end parts it would help greatly. less mass= faster response and higher hp.

just a few ideas

 

[Damn 2nd Gear]

We need to gather information and make a new Tuning guide for our N/A on the site. im tired of seeing poeple pointed to the tunign guide when tehy want to know which steps to take when modifying their car. for the 1g is basically says "BUY A FACTORY TURBO MODEL" for our tuning guide. imm willing to put myeffort in to search in past posts and get a good deal of info up for the new people that come in.

As of now there are almost no NA "Tuners" in a sense, we are almot "Modifiers". being that the only real tuning that 90% of Na guys do to our cars are in teh form of Adjusting the idle and trying 1 million versionf of 2 different intake options. it is great that Punishment has taken the time to setup the translator wiring for us, now we can actually tune our fuel, as for most/almost all of us dont really need a AFC or SAFC for our cars. none of us ever buy larger injjectors either. im gonna start a new thread in the NA performance forum, maybe we can all post links or quotes for better tuning our cars and get it made into a sticky or better yet a revised tuning guide that will better suite newcomers.

 

[na90dsm]

all of it can be done. i was actually the first person to have a tru n/a stroker setup. 11:0:1 compression and the whoel 9. some other people had it so they say that i talked to then i blew my car up.

my next car will run a s-fac and 450cc injectors,190 walbro,afpr,injen intake with maf translator,crower 264/272 combo to start, cam gears and a few other things.

i am gladly willign to help in this effort to make either a sticky or a section in the tuning guide. i am also willgin to test some parts and post hwo they did and if they worked or not.abotu time people wan tto get soemthign going and are finally realizing you can tune this motor.

 

[Thunderskull]

all of it can be done. i was actually the first person to have a tru n/a stroker setup. 11:0:1 compression and the whoel 9. some other people had it so they say that i talked to then i blew my car up.

my next car will run a s-fac and 450cc injectors,190 walbro,afpr,injen intake with maf translator,crower 264/272 combo to start, cam gears and a few other things.

i am gladly willign to help in this effort to make either a sticky or a section in the tuning guide. i am also willgin to test some parts and post hwo they did and if they worked or not.abotu time people wan tto get soemthign going and are finally realizing you can tune this motor.

I have a question. How did you blow up your motor? I'm just curious since I'm going a route similar to yours. I've been going back and forth on building a stroker engine. I think I'm going to go ahead and do that. I was hoping to pull my engine and rebuild it, but I think I'm just going to start with a bare block and go from there. I see no sense in doing it, if you are only going to do it halfway.

 

[na90dsm]

i didnt blow my motor up, i got it runnign really strong and driving it hard and the n/a tranny couldnt keep up. i cracked a dowel pin off my block and blew the tranny almost in half so i junked it and gave up the project.

my suggestion would be to get a gst transmission and flywheel, throw a act2100 in there and your drivetrain will be solid. the gears are a little bit taller but not by much. you may loose a little accel form it but its better then crackin trannies al the damn time.

i just scored a gst tranny and flywheel for a good price, im putting that setup in my next n/t

 

[Thunderskull]

Ok, I've got some really, really bad news. I removed my stock manifold and downpipe and got the o2 sensor out. Went to put the new header and downpipe on this morning and discovered something. THE HEADER DOESN'T FIT! Now, I know this is a new product for punishment and so I expect a few bumps. See, the only way I can mount this header is if I remove my powersteering. The power steering pump doesn't just get in the way to the point where you have to wiggle the header in, it completely blocks the piping. So, I could put the header in, but I'd have to give up power steering which I'm not going to do. I'm very disappointed. So, I put all my stock stuff back on only to find that I had killed my o2 sensor getting it off. Oh well, I needed a new one anyway. I just spoke to the guys at Punishment. I'm going to send the header back to them, and they're building me a new one based on my recommendations which I think is fantastic.

 

[Mike1992]

Well, aint that a bi*** :thumbdown

 

[Thunderskull]

Reread my message, I edited it based on my conversation with the folks at Punishment.

 

[Mike1992]

Hopefully they're paying shipping fee's. Kinda sucks though, you expect things to go smoothly, but sometimes theyre are bumps in the road.

 

[punishment]

It's been so long since we had a dsm with power steering we kinda forgot to take that into consideration, my mistake. We have already changed the design, and apologize for the "bump".

TC