Performance parts for n/a dsm's

[punishment]

I'm in the middle of building a n/a 4g63 powered colt for my shop and noticed while looking through the n/a threads that you fella's have been kinda overlooked when it comes to the bigger dsm shops as far as performance pieces go. Here's my question, do you think there would be enough interest in these sort of parts (headers, intake manifolds etc.) for us to start building them and offer them on our website?

TC
www.punishmentracing.com

 

[Daedalus]

First off, thank you for your intrest in helping out our very overlooked N/T community!

I can think of a lot of things we need. My list will just be for the 4G63 N/T which is even more abused than its 420a cousin when it comes to parts.

Performance Intake Manifold That is cheaper than 500.00!!!
- Could also be used w/Turbo 4G63's which could increase your target market
Performance Headers for the 4G63 N/T
- The only one ever produced was by Borla way back when our cars still had in transits on them from the dealer. Now Mach V is holding us all hostage for 450.00 to get our hands on the last remaining stock. Just think if you could create a product just as good, but for cheaper! I would buy it in an instant. I just cant swallow the 450.00 price tag. (http://www.machv.com/busracexhead.html)
- A Race head built with specific flow characteristics to benefit the N/T's...? (Prolly the same as a turbo now that i'm thinking about it...)
- N/T 4G63 Specific Exhuast system. Currently we have to peice together a custom setup. What about a full exhaust system made for your cars? I would buy one!

I will have more ideas. I would love to see somebody produce this stuff. THere would be large deamnd for Intake manifolds, Headers, seeing as how everyday someone comes on here asking what header to buy for his 4G63 N/T, only to find out one dosent really exsist.

 

[Thunderskull]

One other thing you might think about adding: cold air intake. Also, if you got into building engines specifically for n/a folks, that would be good too. We tend to have to build our own setups ourselves if we want a decent n/a engine. Once again, I'm talking about the 4g63s. If you did a cold air intake, I can just about guarantee you that they would sell like hotcakes. Nobody makes them for our 1st gen n/a 4g63s and people ask about them ALL the time. The only other thing I can think of are n/a 4g63 race engines.

 

[nutshot]

I'm in the middle of building a n/a 4g63 powered colt for my shop and noticed while looking through the n/a threads that you fella's have been kinda overlooked when it comes to the bigger dsm shops as far as performance pieces go...

6 points for using the correct term ( N/A = naturally aspirated ) for the 4G63 twice in one sentence! Do not be lead astray by those that would call it N/T (what is this anyway? are the cars supercharged or something?), you are on the path of righteousness.

 

[Daedalus]

N/T = Non-Turbo... yes, the engine is a NA, but in this community catering to the turbo model, the N/T was morphed out of air to keep things straight... You say NA in here and people look at you funny, im just being nitpicky though... Keep your thoughts coming!

About the cold air system... Maybe you could just mass produce (kinda) a modification to shoot air up to the exsisting short ram intakes (thus kinda creating a cold air intake)... or just make an entirly new system... However, this would be very hard seeing as how there isnt much clearence to run piping between the engine bay and front bumper...

 

[Thunderskull]

You could do it either way. No, there's not a great deal of clearence, but it could be done. You would need an extension for the air sensor cable. The easiest solution is to remove the canister under the snorkel and cut a bigger hole for the pipe. That would keep the airflow pretty straight.

 

[punishment]

Keep the ideas coming, this is something we are now going to definitley do. At 1st we will focus on the 4g63 (my personal favorite) and go from there. We also have something we are working on as far as cold air intakes, that if it works out should be interesting.

I will check this post as long as it's alive, so everyone post your thoughts, we are still trying to gauge interest.

TC
www.punishmentracing.com

 

[1.8laser90]

hey
would you consider doing any of this for the 1.8l engine ?

 

[Daedalus]

I dont know if you can make cams, etc... But maybe offer staged upgrades for the 4G63 N/T... No one that I know of has ever done this. You could truly pioneer the N/T community and create a name for yourself.

Some Ideas:

Stage 0:
Spark Plugs
Wires

Stage 1:
Air Intake (Maybe Cold Air?)
Tubular Headers that are high quality and cheaper than the Borla's
2.5" Catback
Cat Delete Pipe / High Flow

Stage 2: (Since timing belt would have to be taken off, might as well make it all one step)
Underdrive Pulley Set
Cam Gears
Turbo Cams / HKS 264's Or Your Alternative?

Stage 3:
Intake Manifold (Maybe a new in house design optimized for N/T's?)
Race Head
Pistons (High Compression/Forged)

Stage 4:
Fuel Injectors (390-450cc)
Upgraded Fuel Pump (140-190lph)
NOS?

Provide discounts, etc when purchased in stages?
ECU upgrade (Eprom alternative specifically designed for N/T engine)?

If you roadmapped this upgrade process and offered all of these parts you would become the N/T "Mecca" online just as Mach V and Extrememotorsports has done for the Turbo Crowd. Provide Install tips, Dyno sheets, driving impressions, and great customer service.

I would love to buy from a company that made any sort of effort towards our community. Since I am allready commited to spending at least another 2-3k on engine performance for my N/T, you have one commited buyer allready.

If you cant make the parts in house, stock them and sell them in a package deal. I think this is a great buisness opritunity, and I am excited to hear you have plans to actually create new products for our cars.

Let me know if you would like any more ideas, or would like testers, reviewers for your products. I would love to help you out! Please keep us informed with plans.

I have a roadmap of my modifications, but they are going to be delayed a couple months (end of summer) so if you have an alternative by then, you will have a buyer!

*One other thought. Many people dump their N/T's because their are simply no easy ways to modify their cars, (aka, information on how to, or products to do so). If you did do this, maybe we could turn around the community and show people that our cars can be made fast, their are parts available, and it is readily possible. People wouldnt come in here and say "I am gonna sell my N/T and get a Turbo", instead we could start getting people that actually want to build their N/T!

 

[Ralli///Art GS]

Nobody makes a lightweight flywheel for the N/A 4G63 (6 or 7 bolt). The Turbo flywheel is bigger and will not fit in the bell housing or match up with the pinion on the starter. That is quite a high liability part, but if it was made well, I would definitely buy one. It wouldn't be subject to load like that of a AWD turbo launch, since the N/A's will never see a ACT 2600 or anything like that. To further remove rotating mass, a DAMPENED lightweight crank pully would be great. As far as I know Buschur is the only one who makes them and they run for $300.00+. There are plenty of crank pullys out there, but I don't want one that doesn't have the rubber dampener in it. A DYNO PROVEN header would also be fantastic, something to enhance low to mid range torque. I could go on and on about the horror stories with my pace setter header. Finally an intake manifold that incorperates velocity stacks inside the plenum and uses silicon runners (something like samco sport hoses). This way the runner length could be changed to change the gain at different RPM points. A phenolic resin spacer should also be used to isolate the manifold from the heat produced by the engine head. I am a mechanical engineer and have design concepts if you want to PM me about any thoughts.

 

[punishment]

Wow. This is more response than I thought we'd get.
I'm definitley looking into everything posted, the header will be the first thing looked into as I'll need one in my the colt we're putting together over the weekend, and have been researching header designs for awhile.
I'm pretty excited, I've been building turbo dsm's for awhile, but this is more interesting because it's more of a challenge, I've gone low elevens in my eclipse but big deal so have hundreds of other people.

Ralli///Art GS feel free to email me directly at [email protected] with your design ideas.

TC
www.punishmentracing.com

 

[punishment]

We got the motor into the colt with just some miner modifications , this going to be a fun car, seems pretty snappy. As soon as my flange gets here I'll get the header built for it.

TC
www.punishmentracing.com

 

[Daedalus]

Sweet!!! Keep us updated!!!

 

[Thunderskull]

We got the motor into the colt with just some miner modifications , this going to be a fun car, seems pretty snappy. As soon as my flange gets here I'll get the header built for it.

TC
www.punishmentracing.com

Take pictures of the header for us too. Are you building a 4-1 or a 4-2-1 header? I would think our cars could take more advantage of the 4-2-1 header. With a nice 2.25 or 2.5 inch exhaust it might giive us n/a 4g63 guys some good mid range power with a more even torque curve. To what specs are you building this engine? I'm planning my engine build right now, and I'd like to see what other folks are doing. I keep hearing people talk about how they're going to build up their 4g63, but nobody seems to have actually done it and posted the results.

Thanks

 

[94Talon2]

The intake ports on a 1g 4g63 are huge, I would love to have a large TB.
Light flywheel is also a great idea.
The stock exhaust mani is large enough, hi flow cat and cat-back is all you need.

 

[punishment]

The header is a 4-2-1, I've got a couple of designs I'm still working on.

The engine is going to be stock for this year, we're going to see how far we can take the n/a with bolt on's, cams, and tuning.

I will keep everyone posted on our progress.

TC

 

[Thunderskull]

Sounds good. It would also be interesting to see how the motor would benefit from higher compression.

 

[toyotech360]

Even if you guys could stock the HKS 264/264 cams would be huge. I own a 91' eclipse 2.0L N/T with Only 53,000 miles on it and would rather see it shine non-turbo. If you guys develop some quality parts you'd have my paycheck.

 

[NitrousBob]

I have started a company regarding high performance parts that are not readily available until now. Im tired of seeing $600 intake manifolds. $300 cams.. my company is due to start in August 04(i know that kind of shoots summer down) I make a few parts that could be helpful for the DIY person. I got header flanges for 4g63 in stainless and mild steel for building your own headers, tubing can also be added. Intake manifold w/coil mounts and you can use stock throttle body and Im making it also work with the 3 inch MAF conversion and 3"throttle body. My dad raced pro 4 circle track in california and I learned alot about 4cyl performance.. they averaged 270+hp out of 2.4l gm quad four engines.. Normally aspirated on sidedrafts. As soon as I tore down my first 4g63 dsm engine I knew it was on. I also do ceramic coatings with a local shop. its like 150 for a long tube header. I will post as soon as the casting comes out of the sand. The tooling is almost done. the Manifold will go for 250-300dollars w/hardware and stickers and everything. Oh yeah... www.MILDOFF.com.. Still setting it up... keep that in mind... I said august launch but I will make a note to put order info and and pics as soon as its finished.

Peace

 

[Daedalus]

Great to hear!

Keep us updated!

 

[Mike1992]

I'd be happy with
Leight Weight Flywheel, a better Header than my Pacesetter, Cold Air Intake, Performance Intake Manifold, Dampened Underdrive Crank Pulley,

Leight Weight Flywheel=No one makes them for the 2.0 NT, the do however make them for the 1.8's "sigh" $200ish range

4-2-1 Thermal Coated Header=Ok pacesetter is the way to go for affordability, but the welds suck, I got the one without the coating and it heated my engine bay to the max so its thermal wrapped. $200ish Range

Cold Air Intake=If there was a good place to relocate the filter out of engine bay heat that would be excellant. As my home-ade intake sits, it draws in alot of engine bay heat, I need to box it in and cut my inner fender to draw cool air in, Might be an Idea, and yea a exteded wiring plug would be nice to. Injen makes an Intake for us, but its not a cold air intake its pretty much the same thing I have just in metal and not PVC. $200ish Range

Intake manifold=I've though about getting one, as there are a few on the market that are my for the 4G63T, but Id think we'd lose alot of low end with one of those, maybe design one that will open uppower in all ranges. $300ish Range

Dampened Crank Pulley=I am currently running an undampened Underdrive pulley, I dont wanna even thing about it, but the gains are nice, offer a nice dampened one for say $150 plzzzz (great Mod)

Of course a good head would be nice, along with higher compression pistons, but seriously if im going that far im going turbo.

 

[punishment]

I've decided to launch a whole new site dedicated to the 4g63 n/a This way there is no searching around for parts. I hope to have it named and up early next week. I keep getting told to stick to turbo's, so I'm even more determined to make this work than before.

TC
www.punishmentracing.com

 

[Mike1992]

You da man! Finally something for our side! Smart thinking $$$

 

[Daedalus]

Punishment.

You = Demigod of N/A DSM's
You = DA MAN!

Oh yea, if you need any help with the site design, or coding let me know! I would be glad to donate some time to the cause!

 

[Thunderskull]

That's a pretty header. Nice and shiny. How much are you going to let it go for?