Options for N/T Spyder

[Rubent70]

I know this is a subject thats been beaten to death, but I'm having a hell of a time trying to find the info i need.

So heres my issue.
The car currently has a bone stock 4G64, however it will need a rebuild! (200k miles)
I plan on building the 4G64/63 hybrid but from what info I've found it will be a complete PITA sourcing the parts if the block has to be bored.
Should i just drop a 4G63 or try sourcing all the parts for the hybrid build?
Mind you I am pretty sure the cylinders will have to be bored, so is it still worth pursing the hybrid build?
Any input would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks,
Ruben

 

[Dakota98talon_esi]

i would deffintly just find a 6 or 7 bolt and just drop in it. would be around the same amount of money if you can do yourself. it still wouldnt be a bad invested. i just blew my car up, and a day later i called some junkyards and found a newly built 7 bolt in a wrecked 98 eclipse. 600 for motor exhaust and turbo.

 

[Rubent70]

Yeah that definitely sounds like the way to go. I am going to hit up the junkyards this weekend. Thanks for the input.

 

[Dakota98talon_esi]

yeah. no problem man. uhm just make sure if you do find one try to do a compression test and look under the car at the oil pan and stuff. escepialy near oil pan bolts and make sure there is no oil anywhere. i bought my car for 1100 and didnt like look real good because this is my 1st dsm. and ive the car about 2 weeks and 3 days and it blew. my compression numbers came out very bad the first two trys, the third they came out very good. but turbo is shot and so is my head gasket. so just make sure yoiu check all that stufff out before you go and waste your money..

 

[Rubent70]

Yeah I'll definitely be sure to check. This is my first dsm also and I didn't check it very well, and turns out it needs quite a bit work. But hey when I'm done it'll practically be brand new .

 

[Dakota98talon_esi]

yeah exactly. . most peoplr that get rid of these cars theres more shit wrong with it than you can imagine . but their still very well worth the money that you put in them man. be sure to keep me updated on the build and ill give as much advice as i can

 

[MJBean420]

Find a totaled Spyder with a 4g63 and do a swap...

 

[Dakota98talon_esi]

Find a totaled Spyder with a 4g63 and do a swap...

^^^bump. the only thing i hate about swaps is i had a d16y8 and did a k20 turbo swap and the whole rewiring the whole car isnt worth it not sure if its the same dsm but jdms suck dick

 

[WES_393]

I plan on building the 4G64/63 hybrid but from what info I've found it will be a complete PITA sourcing the parts if the block has to be bored.

The only part that would need to be sourced is the pistons, which are not difficult to find. Companies like Manley and Wiseco offer low-comp, forged 4g64 pistons for turbo builds. Your machinist will let you know which bore size you need, so wait until then to order. But I wouldn't ditch the 4g64 for a 4g63 unless you absolutely have to. The boosted 4g64 is a monster on the street and not much more complicated to build. Even if the block is somehow unusable, you still have the ability to build a 2.3 stroker using your 100mm crank.

Link to Manley's piston spec options. The 4g64 options are under the 100mm STD STROKE 2.4L section.
Manley Performance - Sport Compact - Mitsubishi - 4G63 / 4G64

Find a totaled Spyder with a 4g63 and do a swap...

It doesn't have to be from a Spyder though. The Spyder GST uses the exact same 4g63 as the hardtop GST/GSX.

^^^bump. the only thing i hate about swaps is i had a d16y8 and did a k20 turbo swap and the whole rewiring the whole car isnt worth it not sure if its the same dsm but jdms suck dick

The Spyder GS and GST are very similar under the hood and share many of the same parts/sensors. The 4g64 is basically a stroked, naturally aspirated, SOHC equipped 4g63. The swap still involves some electrical work, but nothing close to what your describing.

 

[Rubent70]

Thanks for all the info guys.
As of now the plan is to try and find a 4g63 for a good price at a salvage yard. If that doesn't happen then I'll try to find a good 4g64 to replace the "tired" one that's currently in the car and build it on the side.
I will definitely keep y'all posted and let you know what I find. Thanks again for all the help.

 

[delta448]

Even if you find a junkyard 4g63, there's no guarantee that it will be in usable condition, let alone have upgraded internals, low miles and perfect compression. I'm sure that doesn't happen often. Why not start out with an engine you know at least runs half decent and doesn't have any spun bearings or internal damage? Why risk spending $5-600 on something that you'll still have to tear down and rebuild?

Your 4g64 might need bored but have you disassembled it yet to check for scoring, roundness and taper? Don't assume anything. If it does need bored, it probably won't need more than 0.5 mm (0.020" ) to correct the cylinders, and that would mean you can still buy off-the-shelf turbo friendly pistons for it. Even ones that are meant for a DOHC swap.

If you still decide to pull the old 4g64 out, let me know. I'll give you a fair deal on it and build it for myself.

 

[Rubent70]

Even if you find a junkyard 4g63, there's no guarantee that it will be in usable condition, let alone have upgraded internals, low miles and perfect compression. I'm sure that doesn't happen often. Why not start out with an engine you know at least runs half decent and doesn't have any spun bearings or internal damage? Why risk spending $5-600 on something that you'll still have to tear down and rebuild?

Your 4g64 might need bored but have you disassembled it yet to check for scoring, roundness and taper? Don't assume anything. If it does need bored, it probably won't need more than 0.5 mm (0.020" ) to correct the cylinders, and that would mean you can still buy off-the-shelf turbo friendly pistons for it. Even ones that are meant for a DOHC swap.

If you still decide to pull the old 4g64 out, let me know. I'll give you a fair deal on it and build it for myself.

I'll let you know if I decide to get rid of it. I am planning on building the hybrid but I'm still comteplating dropping in a 63 for the time being so that I have all the supporting mods in place when I drop the 63/64 hybrid in.

 

[Rubent70]

So here's an update to the situation; I ran all over town like a mad man and was unable to find either a 64 or 63 at the 4 salvage yards I went too. So for now the plan still remains to build the hybrid but it seems like the spyder will be down for longer than I had intended.

 

[Spyder Sean]

Just curious is it the 2.4l sohc you are running? Because I'm totally lost with my build that's what I have and I'm wondering if I should just get a new head. I don't plan on running boost. All motor and possibly a AWD swap.

 

[Rubent70]

Yeah the engine I have now is the 2.4L SOHC. I would like to do the AWD swap as well but that's a ways down the road.
If you're looking to run all motor and wanted to up the displacement, there's a 2.6L stroker kit for the 64 using a 63 head.

 

[WES_393]

So here's an update to the situation; I ran all over town like a mad man and was unable to find either a 64 or 63 at the 4 salvage yards I went too. So for now the plan still remains to build the hybrid but it seems like the spyder will be down for longer than I had intended.

Forget dropping in a temporary engine, just build the 4g64. Have a machinist inspect the block/crank and machine if necessary. Then find a head and have it rebuilt, or buy a head from one of our supporting vendors. You could have all the parts at your door and ready to assemble in 1-2 weeks tops. It wouldn't cost much more than building a 2.0 either.

Just curious is it the 2.4l sohc you are running? Because I'm totally lost with my build that's what I have and I'm wondering if I should just get a new head. I don't plan on running boost. All motor and possibly a AWD swap.

Yes, the 4g64 is the 2.4L SOHC engine. If you don't plan to boost then I honestly wouldn't swap the head. The small intake ports help with low end torque, which is really all the NA 4g64 has. Plus, the SOHC is super easy to work on and cheap to maintain. I'd keep the SOHC head until you plan to install a turbo. With any NA 4-cylinder your not going to make much power without one.

I also wouldn't AWD swap with all-motor unless your okay with 0-60 being well over 10 seconds.

Also, as cool as the 2.6L is on paper, it's not a very practical build. The 4g64's thin cylinder walls don't handle the extreme rod angle very well.

 

[Diamond Star Werks]

Also, as cool as the 2.6L is on paper, it's not a very practical build. The 4g64's thin cylinder walls don't handle the extreme rod angle very well.

But a partial fill could fix that

 

[Rubent70]

Forget dropping in a temporary engine, just build the 4g64. Have a machinist inspect the block/crank and machine if necessary. Then find a head and have it rebuilt, or buy a head from one of our supporting vendors. You could have all the parts at your door and ready to assemble in 1-2 weeks tops. It wouldn't cost much more than building a 2.0 either.

The reasoning behind dropping in a temporary motor is because of fuel cost.
I wont be able to finish the 64 build until the end of the year possibly and i drive about 100 miles a day. I am currently using an f-150 with 5.4 V8 and was looking into a temp motor to use the spyder as a DD. On the plus side if i can find a running 64 as a temp, then i can build this one as well and find a gst shell to drop it into
Still kicking around some ideas but i will keep y'all updated.

 

[Rubent70]

So far these are the parts that im looking to purchase for the bottom end

Manley Pistons 8.5 C.R. (Part number 613005C-4)
Brian Crower Rods (Part number BC6110)
Stock Crank

I hope to be around 300-400 hp with 15-20 psi
Will this setup work fine for the goals i have?
I will be running pump gas (93).

Any info would be greatly appreciated.

 

[gieri002]

So far these are the parts that im looking to purchase for the bottom end

Manley Pistons 8.5 C.R. (Part number 613005C-4)
Brian Crower Rods (Part number BC6110)
Stock Crank

I hope to be around 300-400 hp with 15-20 psi
Will this setup work fine for the goals i have?
I will be running pump gas (93).

Any info would be greatly appreciated.

The stock 4g63 could handle those goals, no problem...

 

[Rubent70]

gieri002 Thanks for the input.

I'm new to the entire concept of rebuilding an engine and have no clue what i should be looking for parts wise to complete the head. I know my HP goals are somewhat mild so i need some input as to what parts i need for the head. Obviously i will need cams, cam gears, valves and stems, but i just wanna make sure i get everything i need.
Sorry for all the noobish input

 

[GPTourer]

I would not go the all motor route at all. The only time Mitsu even tried (in this country) was with the '94 Galant GS and it doesn't make a whole bunch of power (160hp) - but it has a 4G64 DOHC engine.

The quickest way is to find a 2.0 4G63 turbo as stated, but if you are having trouble finding one and just want the car back on the road, you can swap in another 4G64 from a 7G Galant (or Spyder) or pull the engine and build it into a 63/64 hybrid turbo.

 

[Rubent70]

I would not go the all motor route at all. The only time Mitsu even tried (in this country) was with the '94 Galant GS and it doesn't make a whole bunch of power - but it has a 4G64 DOHC engine.

The quickest way is to find a 2.0 4G63 turbo as stated, but if you are having trouble finding one and just want the car back on the road, you can swap in another 4G64 from a Galant (or Spyder) or pull the engine and build it into a 63/64 hybrid turbo.

I am going to pursue the build of a 4G64/63 hybrid and turbo it.
I've tried finding a 4G64 engine to run in the mean time but had no luck at the junkyards and i'm not willing to pay upwards of $700 for a temp engine.

Sorry let me clarify that i was asking about parts for the 63 head as i will get rid of the SOHC head for a 2G DOHC 63 head. Any parts suggestions for the 63 head?

 

[GPTourer]

Any parts suggestions for the 63 head?

You just get a 2G 4G63 head from a '95-'99 GS-T or GSX. If you just slap it on there, you'll have very high compression because of the non-turbo pistons so you won't be able to run much boost (if that even works at all, I know the 3G guys do that, I do not know if the 2G 4G64 N/A pistons will clear a 4G63 turbo head) - so it would be better off if you build the bottom end while you are at it with lower compression pistons designed for F/I and thicker rods. The block and crankshaft need to be checked out but they are reused.

If you want to build up the head, you can get some cams and have a machine shop clean it up and put new springs and lifters in. I used HKS cams, but I think they are discontinued so just look into whatever the cool kids are using these days. Or better yet, just send it off to one of the DSM builders and let them do the whole thing to your specifications and budget. Use ARP studs and an MLS gasket when you put it back on.

 

[Rubent70]

GPTourer
Thanks for all the guidance.
The pistons i want to order have a CR of 8.5 with the 63 head is this a decent CR for a DD?