Need Help Fast-Timing Belt Loosen

[jibberishballr]

We are putting the head back together and cant get the timing belt loose enough to line up with the camshafts. We never took the timing belt off and need to loosen it to continue the job. What should we do?

 

[FORMONTOYA]

I'm going to "assume" you removed the belt off the cam gears and now you can't get them back on. If that's the case, did you "pin" the auto tensioner? If not, you will have to depress the tensioner shaft and pin it in place in order to get the belt back on, the follow the rest of the steps for proper tensioning.

If that's not it, a little more detail is required.

VFAQ can be your friend.

 

[jibberishballr]

we have the timing belt lined up with the cam gears so we dont lose our timing, but we cant get the gears back on the cams, so we need to loosen the belt to get enough slack to put it on the cams.

 

[FORMONTOYA]

OK, same principle.

Did you "pin" the tensioner before you removed the gears?

 

[jibberishballr]

No we didn't we. How do we get around this.

 

[FORMONTOYA]

The only way to do it now is either remove the tensioner and put it in a vice, then "pin" it. Or go here:
http://www.vfaq.com/mods/timingbelt-2G.html
and start at #9 using the tool as specified. Then follow from there.

Just a note, you can actually use the battery hold down bolt to accomplish the same thing the tool does. Just be careful not to gouge the belt.

 

[jibberishballr]

Ill try it. Thanks for the help. There are no other alternatives though?

 

[FORMONTOYA]

Of course I'm not looking at the car, so I'm just going through what I believe to be the issue. If you look at the difference between the "pinned" and free length of the pin it is 11mm [0.043in]. Doesn't sound like much, but can make all the difference in the world when it comes to putting things back together. It just sucks to be "so close you can taste it" and it still doesn't quite fit.

From behind the keyboard miles away that would be the first thing I would suggest. You're certainly NOT going to compress the pin without something (vice, bolt, etc.), which I believe is the problem.

 

[jibberishballr]

Its really difficult to do because I can't really see what I'm doing. I used the battery bolt and got it through the hole after removing the rubber plug. I'm confused on what the bolt does by turning it. Will it be in a hole when turning or directly on the belt? I understand how you loosen the center bolt on the tensioner pulley but am confused on what to do with the bolt.

I also dont understand this step on the vfaq you gave me:

11.
Compress the Auto Tensioner push rod by SLOWLY rotating special tool no. MD998738 until hole in Auto Tensioner push rod aligns with the hole in the Auto Tensioner body (Figure 6).

I dont know how to align it because I can't see it.

Could you explain this to me using either figure 7 or the main color picture at the bottom of the vfaq because these look the most familiar to me.

 

[FORMONTOYA]

Looking at Fig. 6 (since it has the tool):

When you tighten the "tool", it will press against the belt and pulley which in turn will depress the tensioner pin; however, you have to be careful while using the battery hold-down bolt since it does NOT have rounded corners. You will need to have something between the belt and the "tool" so it doesn't gouge the belt which will basically ruin it.

After you depress the pin as shown in Fig. 8 (center picture, align both holes in pin/body), you can get a small drill bit (or whatever) through the hole so the pin stays depressed which will get you slack in the belt.

As you already know, there's not much room to get your hands in there let alone see when the holes line up to insert the drill bit. The much easier way is to remove the tensioner and use a vice (more work), that way you can physically see what's going on.

 

[No_Skillz]

The MD998738 tool acts like a screw and pushes in the tensioner. It will eventually compress the little rod in the tensioner so that the pin holes line up, at which point you slide in the pin (if you need to). Keep in mind that this will make the timing belt loose, so make sure everything is still timed correctly before you pull out the pin or remove the tool.

 

[BISHILVR]

Pull the motor mount on the drivers side if you have it in, and then pull the front roll stopper (motor mount ) bolt and use a jack with a block of wood on it (to avoid oil pan damage) and jack the motor up/down as required to have more access to the timing belt/tensioner area. 2g's are extremely tight in that area even with the engine jacked up.

 

[jibberishballr]

Looking at Fig. 6 (since it has the tool):

When you tighten the "tool", it will press against the belt and pulley which in turn will depress the tensioner pin; however, you have to be careful while using the battery hold-down bolt since it does NOT have rounded corners. You will need to have something between the belt and the "tool" so it doesn't gouge the belt which will basically ruin it.

After you depress the pin as shown in Fig. 8 (center picture, align both holes in pin/body), you can get a small drill bit (or whatever) through the hole so the pin stays depressed which will get you slack in the belt.

As you already know, there's not much room to get your hands in there let alone see when the holes line up to insert the drill bit. The much easier way is to remove the tensioner and use a vice (more work), that way you can physically see what's going on.

Quick question. When I put the tool/bolt in I hit a bracket not a belt. How can I gouge the belt if I can't hit it?

 

[BISHILVR]

^^^ I'm not sure what he means by that, but I've never come close to the belt.

 

[No_Skillz]

Quick question. When I put the tool/bolt in I hit a bracket not a belt. How can I gouge the belt if I can't hit it?

Formontoya is staying that if you use the battery tie down bolt, it might hit the belt and damage it. You do NOT want to gouge the belt. It is supposed to push on the bracket with a pulley on it and push down the tip of the tensioner.

 

[jibberishballr]

^^^ I'm not sure what he means by that, but I've never come close to the belt.

I didn't come close to a belt either which made me think I was doing it wrong but I think I'm doing it right because I am hitting a bracket. I wasn't able to work on the car today but will try tomorrow and see if I get back on track.

 

[FORMONTOYA]

Everyone is correct, I'm not saying you will hit the belt; however, since you're basically making a tool as opposed to purchasing a tool designed for the job you want to keep a closer "eye" on the process (what if the battery hold down bolt was bent, etc?).

If I "tell" you to keep an eye on it while doing the job, you may or may not.
If I tell you to be careful and not gouge the TB belt, you will more than likely pay better attention to how things go together.

 

[jibberishballr]

Everyone is correct, I'm not saying you will hit the belt; however, since you're basically making a tool as opposed to purchasing a tool designed for the job you want to keep a closer "eye" on the process (what if the battery hold down bolt was bent, etc?).

If I "tell" you to keep an eye on it while doing the job, you may or may not.
If I tell you to be careful and not gouge the TB belt, you will more than likely pay better attention to how things go together.

Okay I understand, I was just getting worried about hitting a belt and I wasnt near one so I though I was in the wrong spot.

I still cannot see anything due to the lower timing cover and cannot find a way to get it off. Do I have to remove all the belts? Maybe I should rephrase my question. What do I need to do to be able to see where I put the pin? Also how much can I jack the motor up without hurting anything (ie the oil pan being crushed, etc.)?

 

[BISHILVR]

Yes, you have to pull all of your belts to take the lower timing belt cover off, its real tight in there and almost impossible to see the tensioner even with the engine raised and the cover off. The max height you want to lift the engine depends on how far you cv joints can stretch before you damage them, pull your drivers side front wheel and jack from that side on the oil pan (with a block of wood between the pan and the jack, mitsu actually tells you to do this in the factory manual) as you are jacking the engine up, keep an eye on the cv joints and how tight the boots are getting on them, so you dont rip the boots or pull them off. The engine can move pretty far up though (far enough to not be able to close the hood) We usually like to have the car up on blocks/ramps/jackstands when we do the belt so that things are easier to see. A GOOD light source is a must when doing this also. If you want to, feel free to IM me on aim.

 

[BISHILVR]

To take the lower timing cover off, you have to pull one of the studs from the motor mount bracket on the top/drivers side mount, plus ALL the pulleys and belts have to come off including the crank pulley. You will be jacking the engine up/down about 15 different times to get to different parts, real annoying. I dont know why mitsu did'nt make an access panel behind the drivers wheel well like they did on the 1g, so much easier that way.

 

[jibberishballr]

I'll go work at it and IM you and let you know how its going.

 

[jibberishballr]

Was having too much trouble with It and finding problems that I shouldn't have so I took it to my mechanic and he is doing It for a small fee. I will finish the car tomorrow, run it with mineral oil for a few hundred miles, do a flush, put new coolant in, and then do an oil change. Hopefully everything seals well and all is good. I'll update tomorrow night.