Lets get it clear. What are the stock block record rules.

[rhamlinii]

Been there.

I have killed two pistons ring land's on two different occasion's chasing this record this year. But it has its advantage It keeps the bore in good shape. Replace with another 1G piston rod combo out of my spare engine inventory and its up and running in less then 4 hours (replace piston with engine in car John Force style)WTF

, reminds me of those old street racing days doing it John Force style. Blow the car up on Friday, talk shit. Have the car up running saturday night, with more nitrous and a little less timing.

 

[bastarddsm]

Please keep in mind this is for the STOCK BLOCK not whole Engine/bolt-ons.

So this is turning into how many niche records can we create to make ourselves feel better about our mediocre accomplishments?

Jeez I hold a bunch of those.
1. Fastest with n/t engine and a china 16g on E85
2. Fastest AWD swapped 1g
3. Fastest 1g n/t, turbo swapped, awd swapped runing a cheap felpro head gasket and a holset.

 

[e85_4g63]

So this is turning into how many niche records can we create to make ourselves feel better about our mediocre accomplishments?

Jeez I hold a bunch of those.
1. Fastest with n/t engine and a china 16g on E85
2. Fastest AWD swapped 1g
3. Fastest 1g n/t, turbo swapped, awd swapped runing a cheap felpro head gasket and a holset.

... I read about these kind of "record's with *'s" a couple weeks ago on DSMTalk, they were talking about who has the fastest 1ga with a carbon hood, etc etc. (nit picking) stuff.. I think we all agree on the "rules" for the "stock block" records though, BSE is the only variable.

 

[TofastForU_99]

Updated please read.

 

[e85_4g63]

UPDATED

THESE ARE THE RULES FOR ALL STOCK BLOCK RECORD ATTEMPTS 6 OR 7 BOLT!
OEM uncut crank
OEM std size pistons
OEM piston rings
OEM rods
OEM main bolts
OEM rod bolts
OEM oil pump
OEM oil pan
BSE optional

Dont get me wrong I do not feel that I am titled to make these rules, these are just what everyone has agreed on and is what the current record holder has.

I agree!

 

[rrussell]

Updated please read.

Update looks Great!!!

Now I can get back to breaking I mean building again.

 

[4WARND]

Guys I do not believe I hold the record anymore. There was recently a car in Florida that went 9.8x. I do not have any info on the car other then it was supposed to be on a stock block. I will hold my head up knowing I was the first to ever get into the 9's.

 

[Alex7747]

Guys I do not believe I hold the record anymore. There was recently a car in Florida that went 9.8x. I do not have any info on the car other then it was supposed to be on a stock block. I will hold my head up knowing I was the first to ever get into the 9's.

and thats just badass! on the stock block

 

[SupremeDsm]

Well we need proof mike or you are still the stock block record holder.

 

[black91awdturbo]

Well we need proof mike or you are still the stock block record holder.

Is this a joke?

 

[SupremeDsm]

Is this a joke?

I can sit here all day and say i seen people break records but with no proof it doesnt stand. Period.

 

[99gst_racer]

I wouldn't worry about even mentioning a cut crank or overbore. Those are simply steps to get overall machining within tollerance, and offer no performance advantage. How many cylinders are still round like from the factory after 10-20 years of use?

More importantly, the piston should be cast and make a factory compression ratio.

And I think it's fair to say main bolts and rod bolts must be OEM, but aftermarket head studs can be used because they are't nessacerily part of the block.
This is how I'd spell it out:

OEM style crank, rods, pistons, rings, oil pump, and oil pan
OEM main bolts and rod bolts
BSE optional

Just my .02.

 

[Lofty]

x2
I vote no to ARPs, as you should probably think about it this way;
Stock Mitsubishi fasteners will only hold up to a certain power level, upgraded fasteners allow you to increase power to a level that exceeds the standards for how much abuse the stock fasteners can withstand, as it has been said this puts in too many variables into the stock block standards.

I read something about voting arps because it's a weekend warrior/daily.

Records are not meant to meet people's needs, people are meant to meet the records standards and still be better than the rest.

I can't think of anyway balance shafts can impede horsepower (while not ideal) they aren't affecting power, only oil pressure so to speak, plus it was also an option.

However, coating bearings/pistons in my opinion should be allowed, as these things are simply ways to prep the shortblock

 

[kidtsi]

I wouldn't worry about even mentioning a cut crank or overbore. Those are simply steps to get overall machining within tollerance, and offer no performance advantage. How many cylinders are still round like from the factory after 10-20 years of use?

More importantly, the piston should be cast and make a factory compression ratio.

And I think it's fair to say main bolts and rod bolts must be OEM, but aftermarket head studs can be used because they are't nessacerily part of the block.
This is how I'd spell it out:

OEM style crank, rods, pistons, rings, oil pump, and oil pan
OEM main bolts and rod bolts
BSE optional

Just my .02.

 

[DSMReviver]

x2
I vote no to ARPs, as you should probably think about it this way;
Stock Mitsubishi fasteners will only hold up to a certain power level, upgraded fasteners allow you to increase power to a level that exceeds the standards for how much abuse the stock fasteners can withstand, as it has been said this puts in too many variables into the stock block standards.

I read something about voting arps because it's a weekend warrior/daily.

Records are not meant to meet people's needs, people are meant to meet the records standards and still be better than the rest.

I can't think of anyway balance shafts can impede horsepower (while not ideal) they aren't affecting power, only oil pressure so to speak, plus it was also an option.

However, coating bearings/pistons in my opinion should be allowed, as these things are simply ways to prep the shortblock

Haha man your last sentence are kinda contradicting to what you have said about "records are not meant to meet people's needs, people are meant to meet the records standards". Coating would be meeting the people's needs.

The way i look at it, using ARP in the head/studs is simply meeting the need of other stock parts(pistons/rods) because they are able to handle more power and stock head studs would keep them from reaching that goal due to head lift. And plus its the most simplest way of doing it without having to tear up the motor to to do other modifications.

Stock block to me is untouched bottom end or stock parts, no port work on the head, don't have to have balance shaft, and stock pans.

I say yes to ARP head studs because they are simply maximizing other stock parts. To push them further and to realize the potential gains that can be had staying completely stock.

just my 2 cents...

 

[Lofty]

Coating isn't physically changing what's originally in the shortblock though.

I'm plus for headstuds though.

 

[SupremeDsm]

But pistons did not come coated from mitsubishi. So that would be changing the stock piston. So I vote no for coating. I vote yes for head studs as they are for the head. I vote no for any type of overbore because that would take part of the challenge away. bse should be optional.

 

[doubleclutch99]

But pistons did not come coated from mitsubishi. So that would be changing the stock piston. So I vote no for coating. I vote yes for head studs as they are for the head. I vote no for any type of overbore because that would take part of the challenge away. bse should be optional.

The stock turbo 2.0 also came with a flywheel and dampener. to change that would also change the stock bottom end. so who and how do the rules get decided?
Sim says that changing these things are just bolt on's. well if that's true then putting in forged piston's and rod's could also be considered bolt on's. i guess what i'm saying is where does the line get drawn? stock bottom end should be just that a stock bottom end.

 

[ed1380]

The only challenging thing about no overbore is finding a good block. If other race organizations allow it, then it should be allowed.

 

[TofastForU_99]

The stock turbo 2.0 also came with a flywheel and dampener. to change that would also change the stock bottom end. so who and how do the rules get decided?
Sim says that changing these things are just bolt on's. well if that's true then putting in forged piston's and rod's could also be considered bolt on's. i guess what i'm saying is where does the line get drawn? stock bottom end should be just that a stock bottom end.

Yes there is a fine line to what can and cannot be allowed, that's why we are all here talking it over. When I think stock bottom end I think everything inside the shortblock is stock not what bolt-ons are on the external engine.

 

[99gst_racer]

The only challenging thing about no overbore is finding a good block. If other race organizations allow it, then it should be allowed.

Yup, and good original bores are going to be more and more difficult to find as time goes by.

IMO, a freshened up factory engine is still a factory engine, and an overbore is part of the freshening up process. And if there's no performance advantage, then what difference does it make?

 

[1qkfwd]

The stock turbo 2.0 also came with a flywheel and dampener. to change that would also change the stock bottom end. so who and how do the rules get decided?
Sim says that changing these things are just bolt on's. well if that's true then putting in forged piston's and rod's could also be considered bolt on's. i guess what i'm saying is where does the line get drawn? stock bottom end should be just that a stock bottom end.

This just seems like it's goin to far. It's a stock block record. You can think of that as just the shortblock assembly. Most short blocks dont come with flywheels or dampeners. I think the point is to beat the record on the stock rotating assembly.

 

[SupremeDsm]

Flywheel and dampener is on the outside. If you was to order a short block from somewhere it would not come with either one of these. You guys are making this to difficult. Its stock block which is a stock rotating assembly and anything internal in the short block. Its not meant to be easy. Mike is the record holder. He has all stock short block internals. If someone wants his record then we need to follow his set up which is completely all stock on the short block internals.

 

[99gst_racer]

Is a "stock block" a block with factory original parts? Or just OEM type components?

To me, they're both "stock blocks". Mike just happened to have a factory original block. I don't think that detail was ever intended to help define the record.

 

[BogusSVO]

Ok here is a question or two...

From a machinist stand point..

A stock crank still has the factory markings
So a ground crank is still a stock crank.

A factory crank that has been knifed edged is still a stock crank UNLESS the rules mandate the use of a factory weight crank.

As far as rods well loop holes abound
Stock rods will have factory casting marks.
What about balancing the rotating assembly to tigher allowences than factory?
Can stock factory rods be shot peened to remove stress risers? If they were shot peened, can you tell? I know I have a hard time picking them out.
What about "old school" machine work on the rods, Polishing the beams of the rods will strengthen the rods and also make them lighter, and that in turn will lessen the stress on the rod bolts.

Can the rods be resized to bring them back to spec? if that is done, you change the factory Center to center of the rod.

Can a Stock rod be side clearanced for thermal expantion? if so, what will be aceptable rod to crank clearance?

Finally, who will do the teardown and inspection on the engine that has gong for the record?
Who will have the final say if it was legal engine or not?

I ask this, beacuse over the years I have been building heads/engines for some entry class racers, and given the rules I have to build a "legal" engine in, I have found a number of loopholes that can be argued.