Help building up my N/T

[dr1665]

You should really take a moment to consider your goals for this project. If you just want your car to be a little bit faster, then you're going about things the wrong way. A couple points to consider...

• You want to do as much of the work as you can for yourself. This is not just a bolt-on and forget it situation. Things WILL break and you will quickly eat up your budget if you have to pay others to do the work for you.
• If you just want to make your 2GNT quicker, you don't need to rebuild. You need to learn how to perform both compression and leakdown tests and share the results with us so that we might offer our insight as to the health of your engine. If it's healthy, there's no reason why you couldn't install the HRC kit for $3000 and run around town on 7psi all day long. Your car will be NOTICEABLY faster and just as reliable as before. Plus, installing the kit yourself will provide you with the experience and skills vital to keeping the car alive. After you've had some seat time at 7psi, you can evaluate whether you would like to put more money into a FWD platform or move on to another project.
• You can discount and ignore the opinion of anyone who would suggest installing a 4G63 into your 2GNT.
• You can also pretty much discount anyone who suggests you contact Shep for your 2GNT transmission. If he offers anything for the NV-T350, it's going to be extremely custom and there's really no need. Bill Hahn ran high-10s all day long on a stock trans with only a Quaiffe LSD and axles. 2GNTs may have weak pistons and rods, but our transmission trumps the DSM trannies. (I know. I have both.)
• Finally, if you want the fastest car for the least amount of money, you're working with the wrong car. A factory turbocharged, AWD model is going to provide you with the most bang for your buck. FWD to FWD, it's cheaper to make a turbo car faster, but you're still stuck with some peg-legged FWD-no-traction-having-BS at the end of the day. Nothing compares to AWD.

Either way you go - boosting a 2GNT, or opting for a factory turbocharged DSM - you NEED to know how to work on your own car. $7000 is going to vanish fast if you have to pay others to do the work for you. And then what do you do when you scatter the engine later this summer?

 

[DBordersX]

www.howellautomotive.com

i plan on going through them for my stroker engine when the time comes

that way, while i wait the 14-16 weeks for it to come i can save money for the HRC stage two

i've read up a lot on this stuff for my NT (since i don't have the money to take action right now) and it seems like Howell offers a good product if you don't mind waiting forever for delivery

do a search for "2.2 stroker" in the 420A tech forum, there's lots of stuff on it

also, they do standard sized internals if you don't feel like stroking, a bit cheaper than the stroker option obviously

 

[futzly]

I'd love to learn how to work on my own car.. I'd probably save 2 grand just doing all this myself. I just don't know how. I could probably use one of my friends garages and he could teach me some stuff. And I'd obviously have to read a lot.

 

[link16]

I'd love to learn how to work on my own car.. I'd probably save 2 grand just doing all this myself. I just don't know how. I could probably use one of my friends garages and he could teach me some stuff. And I'd obviously have to read a lot.

DING DING DING we have a winner. That is exactly what I was trying to say. Oh and if you turbo a 420A vs go with a GSX, the GSX is on the top 20 most expensive cars to insure. I rebuilt all mine for $7k and I did all the work myself with some friends. We had tons of fun BSing everything and now that it is running and well, fast, we are proud of our accomplishment.


Just an off note, I thought it was against the rules to suggest he sell his car and buy a GST or GSX, maybe not.

You could also PM Mark, bullettdsm, about his 420A n/t he is the fastest 420A that we know of (from what I hear he is cheap too, just kidding).

Just have fun with it, the Hahn Racecraft kits come with EVERYTHING you can possibly need to do the bolt on part, and their tech support is second to none (after all you paid for it). That is just my .02

-Alex

 

[totaleclipse_05]

Just an off note, I thought it was against the rules to suggest he sell his car and buy a GST or GSX, maybe not.

It is:

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=173573

It gets irritating having to wade through those worthless posts before you can actually give some advice they want to hear.

 

[bullettdsm]

from what I hear he is cheap too,

, you got that right .
MB

 

[Locke]

I'd love to learn how to work on my own car.. I'd probably save 2 grand just doing all this myself. I just don't know how. I could probably use one of my friends garages and he could teach me some stuff. And I'd obviously have to read a lot.

The physical labor part of working on a car is a no brainer. Remove some bolts or screws, remove part, replace part, install bolts or screws. Some parts require removing many, many other parts just to reach. Torqueing sequences should be understood and followed on gasketed parts. Sometimes, proper adjustment and/or special alignment are needed.

Study is required to gain the knowledge of a part's function, and how it interacts with other parts. You would want to learn the principles of 4 stroke engine operation, and elementary physics and electronics. (basic and electron theories) Other extra skills are always useful when working of a car, like metal fabrication, some sort of welding, paint/body repair, et cetera, but aren't required.

Diagnostics is really the most difficult thing when working on a vehicle; a logical mind is helpful.

Study, practice, patience, and a decent set of tools will get you well on your way to saving a lot of money, and may start a new hobby. Some emphasis on the study of thermodynamics and fluid dynamics would be beneficial if you ever decided to try to seriously build an engine.


Most of us just start by following the procedures outlined in a Haynes/Chiltons manual, though. I used to use Haynes manuals as bathroom readers.

I thought it was against the rules to suggest he sell his car and buy a GST or GSX, maybe not.

It is:

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=173573

It gets irritating having to wade through those worthless posts before you can actually give some advice they want to hear.

It is, but this thread was moved from the Newbie forum, (out of reach of the "No selling NT for factory turbo-car" rule) where it was yesterday, when most of those posts occurred.

 

[futzly]

yeah.. sounds like a lot of work. I'm definitely up for the challenge though. I always wanted to know how to work on my car, only problem is I'm going to have to find a place to work because I know I don't have all of the tools. Thanks for all the advice though, it's helped me a lot. I'm pretty sure I know what I'm doing now.

 

[4UH8ERS]

PLEASE!, if you have 7 grand to work with then whats $300 worth of tools gonna hurt?

1. buy something economical for a beginner: craftsman 255pc tool set. You get your 1/4", 3/8", and 1/2" drives and tons of standard and deep sockets and wrenches.

2. if you own a dsm you need a set of ratcheting wrenches

3. Get a cheap multimeter, a crescent wrench, a pair of vice grips, a rubber mallet, o2 sensor and opsu sensor sockets and your pretty much covered for you basic 2gnt rebuild and maintnence requirements.

Tada!, now you have alot of tools that dont take up hardly any space. Play away.

ohh yeah, get a floor jack because you OEM jack is < POS.

 

[DBordersX]

I'm gonna have to agree with Jacob here

Hell, I almost went out and bought myself a shiny new engine crane (about $200) when I pulled my motor just because I THINK I'm going to be pulling out my engine again later (i couldn't resist getting the leveler/angler though)

that may be a tad bit of overkill but definitely get your own tools

and get good, Made-In-USA tools too, I can't tell you how many cheap Taiwan or China sockets I've destroyed just working on this one project

 

[dr1665]

I'm gonna have to agree with Jacob here

As am I, and he picks up another chiclet as a result. That is absolutely correct and perhaps one of the best pieces of advice I've ever seen given over here.

If you've got $7000 to spend on a rebuild, buy exactly what he said to buy and pick up a Chilton's manual as well. Hell, forget the Chiltons and visit my az2gnt.net for a link to download the factory service manual. It will tell you everything you need to know, each step of the way. Any tools Jacob didn't mention can be rented cheaply, if not free, locally, when you need them.

First time engine rebuilds can be nerve-racking, but you'll find that, the deeper you get into the project, the easier it gets and the more fun you will have with your car. Remember Hansel and Gretl - leave yourself a trail of crumbs to find your way back to a complete engine! When you remove something, put all the bolts/clips/etc into a zip lock bag and label it. When you go to put it back on, you'll have everything you need. It's just that simple.

Reduce the project into smaller pieces and you will get right through it. You might even find this sort of thing is all you want to do on a given day. (Well, so long as it's not 120* in the shade like it is here in the summer...)

 

[futzly]

yeah I could do that, but it would take me too long to do. I have a full-time job lined up for me this summer and I don't have a back up car.. so that might be a problem : / hmmmmm

 

[XMasta19]

If you don't want your car, give it to me...I'll make sure to put in plenty of well due wrench time hehe.


P.S. I like chiclets

 

[link16]

yeah I could do that, but it would take me too long to do. I have a full-time job lined up for me this summer and I don't have a back up car.. so that might be a problem : / hmmmmm

Well, factor in a 3-4 week period of car rentals, or a really great g/f, I chose the latter. Either that or don't rebuild until you have time. Aside from the fact that you will have the socket sets and the service manual; the greatest tool I found I had were right here with all of these fellers. At times dsmtuners can be annoying with the waiting game but these guys will go out of your way to help out, hell even Paul makes crap for our cars. Have fun and try not to spend it all like I did. Make an Excell spreadsheet of everything you need to buy and so on and so forth.

Sorry for the long one guys.

-Alex

 

[4UH8ERS]

hell even Paul makes crap for our cars.

How dare you call it crap.

J/K we know what you meant it just sounded bad. BTW, I am still curious if Paul is working on an efficient intake manifold for our cars. He mentioned something about it a couple months ago, but I haven't heard any updates yet.

To the OP, First off buy the tools! Then buy a blown motor from the junk yard or something for dirt cheap. Place it on an Engine stand and build it up slowly as time and money permits. The knowledge you will obtain from this venture is priceless and well worth it. With you haveing the spare motor to build you wont have any downtime, except maybe for one weekend when you decide to swap them. Don't make it seem harder than it has to be. I mean I have had a full time job and a full time girlfriend since i was 20 and I made time.

 

[futzly]

good point.. I'll take that into consideration.

 

[porzeczka00]

Wow $6-$7k ... you can do wonders if you do it yourself. I'm in the process of finishing up my 99' RS. Try not to think that you have so much money to work with, if this is your first time working on a car things are going to break, but that's how you learn. Hey that's how I learned and still am learning, stick with this forum a lot of good guys with awesome advice as you can see. If you don't know how to get to a bolt, search the forums you'll find an answer, if not, try the 2gnt forums. And if that dosen't work ask you'll get an answer real quick. If you do it yourself you'll be a lot happier, becasue when you run out of that money and something breaks you'll have an idea of where to start. I'm doing mine myself and so far I've spent $900. ( a turbo off a wrx, and exhaust pieces fabricated by my dads friend.) And I don't plan on spending anymore, becuase i don't have anymore. I know how you feel, I crashed my car fixed it, the body will never be perfect but I've had the car for about 5yrs now, and everyone would tell me the same thing just buy a Turboed car, but thats not the point, becasue I've been through a lot with this car, and it's a lot of fun going from N/T to a turbo! and well worth it! So if you have the time take it easy... it's not hard it's just like Legos.. if you need anything i have a bunch of sites of where to buy parts. Maybe once I'm done with mine I'll show you my car, i'm about 2hrs away, NJ. Good Luck!

 

[link16]

He is north of Harrisburg tho, or I would show him too. It would be nice to see a 420A DSM turbo in MD or in person for that matter.

 

[futzly]

I decided to get it completely rebuilt with stronger forged internals, which is being done as i speak, and then turbo it when the new engine is all broken in.. = RS-T