Help!!! Belt squeal unsolved...

[wicketdreams]

Ok guys I dont mean to But I havn't had my 97 TSi AWD that long (my first japanese car) and I've read all the posts concerning this prob, and I need more input because I've had it in the shop 5 times now and the problem persist. 3 diff mechanics have checked the balancer and all the pulleys, and they all seem to be fine, but the damn power steering/ alt belt still squeals like hell, and over a week's time it gets progressively worse. it's gets realy bad when the heat is on, they've even tightened the belts as tight as they could get them. no squeal for 3 days then the squeal comes back. One shop after 2 attempts even put gatorbacks on free of charge, and the squeal came back. I dont want to randomly start replacing components just to find the squeal, but it's driving me crazy. I start a new job soon that's an hours drive away, and I don't want to have to worry about is this gonna be the day that belt breaks again, while im driving. I live in michigan in a GM town, no one around here is realy familiar with DSM's especialy AWD ones. I need something, anything, any kind of info to slove this prob.

 

[the_skin_eater]

Mine was doing that too....Then it fell off... My friends FWD laser is doin it too...

Have you checked the condition of the pullies themselves? If after tightening it it still squeels, and if the belt is still in good condition, Id check that.

Also, does the belt seem to go slack after a while? Like its not keeping tight or does it always remain how you left it?


oh yea...How do you figure its a Japanese car?

 

[Grimis]

mine squealed when i put a new one, on, i took it off and turned it around and it stoped.

as for the "japanese car"

thought the dsm's where made in the usa......

 

[YiNYaNg]

Heard a few cases where it was the alternator's bearing squealing.

 

[YiNYaNg]

yes dsm is USDM

 

[95blackGsTurbo]

Make sure everything is aligned. That is the biggest thing over looked when reinstalled a belt on our cars. The power steering pump is very easy to get off center. Also make sure the belts are really tight.

 

[90 GSX]

Crank pulley (dampener) separation.

 

[wicketdreams]

Thanks guys, but already checked the dampener, and the altenator is new. as for the japanese car comment I worked for gm and chrysler for a long time 3 years for chrylser 10 for gm. its true the cars were built right here in romulus MI, but the entire drivetrain was engineered by mitsubishi. another example would be the saturn vue, drivetrain was engineered by honda. I hope the comment didnt offend anyone I was only stating that this was my first car that wasnt a chevy or ford V-8.

 

[VETDRMS]

Wicket: Hey my '97 is doing the same thing, only it will squeek mostly when it is cold and if you have the headlights on it will squeel.. , the load of the alternator is enough to drop the engine idle rpm so that belt has to be pretty tight. I tightened it and it was good for a couple weeks but came back. I am going to have another look at it.

I have had it apart many times trying to fix it, I'll let you know if I get it...

 

[wicketdreams]

Vet, I'm starting to suspect the altenator myself, ### when its under load, (heat, headlights, even fog lights) i get it. We tested the dampener to see if it was part of the prob, but no dice..no wobble and we marked it and after about 30 starts the line is still straight and connected. we even flushed the power steering fluid thinkin maybe it was thickening up when it got cold, but it keeps coming back. my only problem now is the fact that it seems to be a high mileage car only problem..I got the car for 5, but i had to put a new turbo and manifold on it..I realy like the car but this seems like it should be a simple prob and its turning out not to be that way. If I cant get this resolved, I think i'm goin to sell it.

 

[Mitsu RacerX]

Ok I had the same problem with the belts until I went back to the OEM belt. This is what is was told when you hear the belt squeling the belt is warming up the grooves. But if ya look at most after market belts when you get them hot they become hard and Plastic. After you warm the belt up, the belt becomes plyable and can stretch. If ya take off your belt before you crank it in the morning you will see that the belt is hard, while most OEM belts are soft...Beleive me I didn't believe it until the HI-performance shop showed me.....

 

[Defiant]

Put a chalk mark on the rim of the harmonic balancer and on its hub. Check their alignment after you hear the squeal.

 

[flinguist]

Had the same problem. It was the balancer. It looked ok when I took it off, but when I put the new one on the squealing problem disappeared. I got mine at Rockauto.com for around 60 bucks.

 

[wicketdreams]

we marked the balancer, like i said about 30 starts later line is straight and connected, so I dont know what else it could be.

 

[VicBoost]

Okay one of you dsm gurus see if you can fix my problem. See my problem is similar but mine only squeals in the winter when its cold. Its squeals for about 5 mintues when turning on the car and when the engine is warm it stops. Everything seems to aligned fine and belts are on nice and tight. Never makes the nose in summer, hell the car runs way better in the summer.... reasons why i hate winter. If any of you guys can figure it out for me that would be great.

 

[malern28us]

I have the same problem as Vicboost in my car. The only bonus of having a blown motor is no squeal.
Eric

 

[DisLilN00Blet]

I had a similar problem with my GSX and the last thing I had done to it was the belts tightened and the tensioner bolt checked out. That was about a month ago and haven't had the problem since

 

[toybreaker]

The belt squeel that only occurs in cold weather may be the powersteering pump belt protesting the fact it's got to turn a pump filled with a really cold, viscous fluid.

On a cold start up, it may slip for a bit, and then calm down.

The fluid ages over time, and with the high underhood temperatures seen by the system, the fluid will begin to break down, and lose it's beneficial properties. This can show up as a cold start belt squeel. Just pull the dipstick out of the p.s. reservoir and inspect the fluid. If it's all black and smells cooked, changing the fluid out make may things all better again. Your power steering pump and rack seals will thank you with better/longer service, especially during the winter months.

The power steering v-belt belt is driven off the inner water pump pulley, by the water pump/alternator serpentine style belt. The additional load of the power steering, on top of the drag from the alternator can also be enough to make the alternator belt beg for mercy. On a cold restart in the morning, the battery may be discharged from running the heater, and headlights the night before. When you first light the car up, the alternator will really work hard to throw some amps back at the battery, and it will really load up the belt with the additional force required for it to produce full current. (it's actually a couple of horsepower, under worse case scenerio, fully discharged battery, cold start)

Those two loads together may be enough to slip the belts some, but only on a really cold morning.


If the alternator mounts are worn, or the alternator is mounted crooked, the serpentine belt won't be making full contact across the belt face, and may stretch unevenly. You can lay a straight edge across the pulley grooves and eyeball the alignment.

I have umm, seen the outer pulley put on backwards... , and it will make the belt unhappy further down the road. Occaisionally, one will come in like that, and if you put it back together exactly how it came apart, you'll get a noise in a day or two.

Marking your dampner with a paint stripe/witness mark is always a good idea It will show you any slip between the hub and outer ring.

 

[VicBoost]

The belt squeel that only occurs in cold weather may be the powersteering pump belt protesting the fact it's got to turn a pump filled with a really cold, viscous fluid.

On a cold start up, it may slip for a bit, and then calm down.

The fluid ages over time, and with the high underhood temperatures seen by the system, the fluid will begin to break down, and lose it's beneficial properties. This can show up as a cold start belt squeel. Just pull the dipstick out of the p.s. reservoir and inspect the fluid. If it's all black and smells cooked, changing the fluid out make may things all better again. Your power steering pump and rack seals will thank you with better/longer service, especially during the winter months.

The power steering v-belt belt is driven off the inner water pump pulley, by the water pump/alternator serpentine style belt. The additional load of the power steering, on top of the drag from the alternator can also be enough to make the alternator belt beg for mercy. On a cold restart in the morning, the battery may be discharged from running the heater, and headlights the night before. When you first light the car up, the alternator will really work hard to throw some amps back at the battery, and it will really load up the belt with the additional force required for it to produce full current. (it's actually a couple of horsepower, under worse case scenerio, fully discharged battery, cold start)

Those two loads together may be enough to slip the belts some, but only on a really cold morning.


If the alternator mounts are worn, or the alternator is mounted crooked, the serpentine belt won't be making full contact across the belt face, and may stretch unevenly. You can lay a straight edge across the pulley grooves and eyeball the alignment.

I have umm, seen the outer pulley put on backwards... , and it will make the belt unhappy further down the road. Occaisionally, one will come in like that, and if you put it back together exactly how it came apart, you'll get a noise in a day or two.

Marking your dampner with a paint stripe/witness mark is always a good idea It will show you any slip between the hub and outer ring.

Okay so i guess the reason why mine is squeeling in the cold is because of power steering fluid i haven't changed it in awhile like it is full and everything. How do i change the power steering fluid, like i mean drain and then put new stuff in there?

 

[VETDRMS]

Have you managed to get a look at the belt when it was squeeling? My belt was jerking rather violently. Remove the lower cover and take a look at it between damper and the alternator pulley.

I am starting to suspect my alternator as even turning on my rear defrost is dropping engine RPMs considerably...

 

[wicketdreams]

VET, I believe you and I have the same problem..Today it's cold and snowing here, I went to start the car and of course I got squeal...ran the heat and defrost and it squealed a little longer..then stopped...I went to do the brakes on my sisters car and when I finished, I went to warm the car again..this time i turned on the rear defrost as well as had the heat on full blast..radio also playing....went from quiet to nonstop squeal...I cut the defrost off..squeal stops...defrost on...squeals again..turn radio off..defrost on..no squeal..radio on..squeal..turn off the heat..no squeal...turn heat back on..squeal....Drove around and did the same routine...so now I'm suspecting that there is either a misalignment, or the bearings have gone bad, or a combination of them both..so I'm gonna have it checked this week...

Toybreaker...thanks for your input..your breakdown was very informative..and thanks to everyone else for their input on this, I know this subject had been covered a million times already.....

 

[VicBoost]

Does anyone know how i can drain the power steering fluid because I think thats is creating the problem in the cold weather. Plus I haven't changed it in a while.

 

[luv2rallye]

Make sure the water pump pulley hasn't been put on backwards which puts in a slight offset into the belt/pulleys alignment with alt and PS.

 

[Defiant]

we marked the balancer, like i said about 30 starts later line is straight and connected, so I dont know what else it could be.

Did it squeal during any of those tries?

 

[wicketdreams]

well those starts were over a 3 day period, and it didnt squeal, because we put the new belt on first ( back asswards I know) but this time around gonna check everything before swappin the belt