engine building question..

[thor]

Hi all,
I'm new to the world of DSM ownership. Let me preface this by saying that I have built a number of small block chevys, but this is my first attempt at a 4 cylinder.

I have a 94 talon non turbo manual. the previous owner let it overheat to the point of melting everything plastic and rubber attached to the engine. So I needed a new engine.

I purchased a 'rebuilt' 4g63 long block from someone on ebay and I have a couple of questions.

1- How hard should it be to turn over with a breaker bar and wratchet in the crank sprocket? I bent a long bar trying to turn it over to check for ease of turning, and it just feels too tight. It will eventually turn easier after 1 crank rotation and a few drops of oil in the cylinder, but still feels too tight. the next day it will do it again. Everything is hooked up- head, timing belt, and balance belt. I bought it this way. Plugs are not installed. i'm not that dumb..

2- what is rod and main cap torque supposed to be? the manual says main/rod 18/14.5 ft lbs +1/4 turn. It seems too loose for me, but again, i'm used to small block chevys. just want to verify.

out of curiousity, I checked the bearing clearances and they read within spec per factory shop manual. I believe the new rings are what's holding it up being too tight.

I don't want to pull the head off as it was put on before i got it. I just need piece of mind that this is normal.
I'm giving this car to my girlfriend so it has to be reliable. I want to do it right.
here's pics if anyone is interested- www.phantomaudio.net/talon.htm

thanks for any and all responses
John

 

[Silverstrocker]

its shouldnt be hard at all to turn manually, try dropping a minimal amount of oil in through the spark plug holes for a little lube, but turning it should be very easy

 

[thor]

yeah, I tried that. after the initial 'oomph' of overcoming the feeling like it's stuck, it will turn somewhat freely after about a half of rotation on the crank.
i'm sure the rings just need to be broken in. The amount of work i'm putting into this is insane and i'll be pretty pissed if it blows up in the first 10 minutes.

 

[phillabaum03]

Yuck!

 

[gurmanator]

whoa!!!If you bent a bar trying to turn the motor over then something is wrong.since the plugs are out then you should be able to turn it with your hand.did you take the rod and main caps off?If you did then there is a good chance that you got one of them on backwards(I did it).did you set the end-play on the thrust bearing?rings dont bind and if oil in the cylinder helps it turn then I will bet it blew a head gasket and then it sat for awhile and now the cylinders are rusted(no plugs in it right).people do this all the time.

 

[Boostedexcel]

HA^^^good luck trying to turn any motor by hand!!!! I think the manual says you should be able to turn with about 30 lbs, more or less....

 

[thor]

whoa!!!If you bent a bar trying to turn the motor over then something is wrong.since the plugs are out then you should be able to turn it with your hand.did you take the rod and main caps off?If you did then there is a good chance that you got one of them on backwards(I did it).did you set the end-play on the thrust bearing?rings dont bind and if oil in the cylinder helps it turn then I will bet it blew a head gasket and then it sat for awhile and now the cylinders are rusted(no plugs in it right).people do this all the time.

I bought this engine 'rebuilt' which after investigating all the guy did was throw new rings on and I *think* new bearings. I can't speak for his attention to detail of keeping the main caps on and rod caps in the correct order. I did check what I could with plastigauge and it squished within specs. I re-torqued to 14.5ftlb +1/4 turnon the rod caps and 18 ft lb +1/4 turn on the mains. They have the arrows pointing the right way.

what I did notice though was when I pulled a cap off the piston I couldn't push or pull it in the cylinder bore by hand. even hitting it with a soft hammer it took a bit to move it. I think it's ring related for sure. maybe because i'm working in a cold damp garage? even when I finally do get it to turn it seems like more than 30 pounds are needed to spin it.

with the timing belt on I wouldn't think it would be easy to turn by hand. overcoming the valvetrain components wouldn't be that easy.

ugh. you know.... try and save a few bucks and look what happens. i'm probably going to have to chance it and hope it works the problem out on break in.