DSMers I need some advise, 50 trim @ 14LBS, Dare I raise the boost?

[SpoolingSpyder]

Me and a friend just finished Installing my SBR G50 Trim. Along with that Ive installed some reinforcment mods( Brakes, Suspension, New Motor Mounts, Timing belt, water pump, Strut Bar, AEM Wide Band). My current go fast mods are the 3 inch intake, ported Turbo Manifold, 3 inch turbo back custom exhaust, 50 Trim, 255 walbro FP, PTE 770 Inj, ACT 2100 clutch, AEM Wide Band, SAFCII, HUGE FMIC, Stock 7 bolt motor on 140k miles 150 compression across the board( mobil 1 full synthetic every 3k). I have the car tuned with the wide band and the SAFCII at 14 PSI running extreemly stong with a 12.5 reading on the wide band at WOT. I am very worried about my motor being able to handle more HP/Boost as its ALOT faster than my 14b at 18 psi only at 14 on the 50Trim. Ive heard the sweet spot on the 50 trim is at 18+ PSI, but at only 14 psi, it feels like warp speed already. I know its been asked and said many many times. Im curious if I will be able to run 18-20 PSI on my motor with that many miles on it. Again my stock 7 bolt has compressoin is 150 across and tuned with a wideband and an SAFCII but 140k miles. Im running 14PSI and it runs VERY STRONG! Will it hurt to push it 18-20 PSI with a motor of 140k miles? Anyone running a 50 trim or bigger with high miles? Anyone have any pros/cons about turning up the boost? Any advise would be Very much appreciated

 

[Quasimondo]

Compression seems okay. You got the fuel mods in place. Boost away

 

[CanadianTSi]

My car has 217,000kms and I run 22psi everyday on my 50 trim.

PS 12.5 is kinda lean, when you raise the boost I would shoot for 11.5

 

[FASTFWD]

Don't rely on wideband readings alone. If you have access to a logger, log your timing curve during a 3rd gear pull. Make sure that it's got a nice climb, w/ no dips (which could mean knock is being encountered). Just take your time and slowly up the boost, and log your runs/timing. On my car, it currently has over 80k miles, and I'm running 22 lbs, putting out 380whp (93 octane). Stock block, head, intake, t/b, etc... Good luck w/ the set-up.

 

[SpoolingSpyder]

Thanks for the replys. Anyone elce give some advise? Feel free to share the bad times as well. Mostly scared to run more boost because a buddys 50 trim setup went strong for afew months. Then had his flywheel gernade thru his engine

 

[ldstang50]

Getting a logger to watch your timing isn't a bad idea. Something to think about to run safely.
Speaking of safe, 12.5 is a little on the lean side of things. I don't see a problem raising the boost but I would definitely try to add some more fuel for an 11.5-11.7 a/f.

 

[99gst_racer]

There is some damn good advise in this thread. Like Quasimondo said, you have the fuel mods to turn up the boost - go for it. And like CanadianTSi said, 12.5 does seem a little lean. Most of us DSMers are in the mid 11 range on the wideband. What are your EGT's like? Peobably a little high.... And like ldstang50 said, a logger is a great investment.

Definitely add more fuel before you turn up the boost.

 

[gimmie11s]

.... with a 12.5 reading on the wide band at WOT......

richen it up.

 

[SpoolingSpyder]

richen it up.

But it runs SO STRONG at 14 psi, it pulls ALOT harder than my 14b at 20 PSI. Anyhow, new update. Got a tubular Turbo manifold ( old one was bend on the side) and a ported o2 housing with external dump on( runs VERY STRONG, Spools 3400 rpms 14 PSI!. Going to keep it at the 14 psi now that ive got my 2.4 stroker motor being built on the side. Oh what fun I can see me having before I have to replace all the transmission particles next!

 

[NOSLO2PT0]

But it runs SO STRONG at 14 psi, it pulls ALOT harder than my 14b at 20 PSI.

That's because you are ready to pop the motor! Shit. I don't even run 12.5:1 with RACE GAS. Imagine how fast your car will be once you stop detonating and having all your timing being pulled. I've run 26psi 93 octane on a stock 1G longblock with 160k miles on it. 50 trim, right around 420whp. On pump gas, and a 2G motor, keep the wideband around 11.2-11.3:1. On a 1G, you can get away with 11.5:1.

 

[Batty200]

I would prob only run about 18-19psi with the injectors being so large until you get something such as a DSMChips Eprom to compensate for those huge injectors since larger injectors with an SAFC or anything like that will result in too much timing advance. If you retard your base timing it will be a slight hack that will allow higher boost with less aggressive timing but I would recommend a chip then crank it up.


Later

 

[droptopgst]

I would listen to everyone here. I have 144,000 miles on my gst spyder 190-195 compression and am running 21psi. daily. Nothing done to the internals. I would be willing to bet that your 14psi. that is lacking fuel, is probably in worse shape than my "a little on the rich side" 21psi set up. These motors are not made of glass and can handle 20-25 psi without a problem as long as they are tuned right. An improper tuned 4g63 can melt or blow even at 10 psi. Anyone that has a high hp car will tell you, tuning is where the power is.
Good luck!!

 

[XakEp]

If he isnt knocking at 12.5:1 AFR then he's fine. Its just that at higher boost and that ratio, detonation goes from an annoyance that pulls timing to a monster that eats motors.

 

[99gst_racer]

That's because you are ready to pop the motor!

haha, yup. Your motor will never feel stronger than right before you blow it up.

 

[SpoolingSpyder]

That's because you are ready to pop the motor! Shit. I don't even run 12.5:1 with RACE GAS. Imagine how fast your car will be once you stop detonating and having all your timing being pulled. I've run 26psi 93 octane on a stock 1G longblock with 160k miles on it. 50 trim, right around 420whp. On pump gas, and a 2G motor, keep the wideband around 11.2-11.3:1. On a 1G, you can get away with 11.5:1.

Well now that I am driving the car in vacuum(damn exhaust leak! VERY ANNOYING). I wont be able to tune at WOT until the manifold/O2 housing are in next week. Will richen it up to right about 11.3 to see how it acts( will try to do this with a logger as well). But my question is. If I'm able to run a 11.5 or higher with the pocketlogger with smooth timing and no dips. That would say I'm able to run leaner no? I want to try and get as lean as I could with the best tune with the pocketlogger showing a smooth timing advance curve with no dips. What if I'm able to run 12.0 or 12.5 with no timing taken out pump gas? What about even at 18 psi or 20. Would that change any opinions? I might as well test this because my 2.4 built motor is almost done and if and engine explosion is what I get....Then I was told so and In goes the new motor. I am just wondering what if I'm able to run my motor leaner with no ill side effects for many more miles. I would like to get a dyno run at the 11.0 AF 11.5 AF 12.0 AF and a 12.5 AF at 18 psi stock motor, pump gas and see what the graphs show. Thanks for all your responces and I appreciate every post. Things have changed recently know that Ive got the funds for the 2.4 and its in the works. So the thread kinda changed to , HOW FAR CAN I TAKE MY STOCK 7 BOLT MOTOR WITH 144k MILES ON A LEAN TUNE WITH A 50 TRIM AND PUMP GAS! I will try and take pictures of the dyno at the rich tune and lean tune at WOT with Hp/torque readings as well. Thanks everyone and Ill try and re post my findings as soon as I get them. Peace

 

[CanadianTSi]

Is making an extra 10-15hp really worth melting your motor?

Also your selling yourself short by running anything under 20psi on that turbo.

 

[gimmie11s]

HOW FAR CAN I TAKE MY STOCK 7 BOLT MOTOR WITH 144k MILES ON A LEAN TUNE WITH A 50 TRIM AND PUMP GAS!

when you find out, let us know... you'll definitely make more power at around 14:1... that should be lean enough.




!

 

[95AWD_TSI_TALON]

Riching it up! Look at it this way. You can listen to what everyone tells you that is PROVEN and when you 2.4 is done..Pull the motor and have a good motor to sell. Say 1k toward your 2.4 fund.

OR

Keep it lean and it pulls good....but it pops.....destroys the bottom end....destroys your good head that might be needing to go on the 2.4 block. And say your lucky and just crack a ringland and not throw a rod through the block. Now you just had a chunk go through your new 50 trim......Just cost your ~1k from selling motor...plus your 50 trim and the days you could drive it until you switched motors.
I was there in you situation with my 6 bolt half done...and it took me 3 months to get everything back together after I threw a rod on my stock 7 bolt because of leaning it out and uping the boost. You learn from your OWN mistakes better then other peoples....I know.
Matthew