Car is dying, won't stay on without giving gas

[Templisk]

Alrighty, I went to disconnect my battery earlier to pull off the dash to paint it. Let the battery drain for a bit and got called home so I put everything together hooked up the battery and went to take off (hand-tightened the battery down)

The car started normally, let it idle for a minute and went to go and got about 5 feet and it died. I turned it back on and it died again. So I pushed it back to where it was, and tightened the battery down better with the tools. While I was doing this one of the bolts snapped (on the bottom right keeping the battery connected to the alternator)

So we went, bought another bolt and tightened it down again. When I started it up it was idling really really weird. Jumping from 1k to 200 rpm to 1.2k. I let it sit there for a while letting it warm up to see if that would work. It did, it stabilized at 900ish rpm and didn't move for 5 minutes so I went to drive off again. Again it died 5 feet from the house when I let off the gas completely. So I turned it on, and again it died.

So I turned it on again, and gave it gas after it fired up and as long as I held in the gas it stayed on. I didn't touch anything else at all, and have never had any problems lik ethis before. Please get back to me asap I don't have another ride home and I need to be home in about an hour.

 

[Templisk]

Update: We were checking fluids to see if it may have anything to do with it. I was low on oil, and it was dark. I can't do an oil change right now but I added 2 quarts so it's overfilled slightly.

My oil gauge has always since I got the car said I had like no oil pressure and it's doing it now still so I don't know if that has anything to do with it. My check engine light is on, but it's reading P-0125 which is some coolant sensor.

So I'm just letting the car sit til I can hear back from you guys, afraid to fire it up if it's a major underlying issue.

 

[xcz504d]

Check your fuel system, filter, pump, injectors, things like that.

Any check engine lights?

Any problems with the clutch lately?

 

[Templisk]

CEL has been on, it's driveable as long as I give it gas constantly but it won't idle on it's own. So I can drive it to an autozone and get the codes checked to see if anything new is on, but as of last check a couple weeks ago it was a coolant sensor and that was it.

A bit late tonight to do anything to it, and I can't move around too easily (recovering from an Inguinal Hernia repair surgery) so I'll have to convince my buddy to take a look at the fuel system.

Thanks for the reply.

 

[xcz504d]

Check the throttle postioning sensor also.

Might want to disconnect the battery again for a few minutes to let the ECU clear any trouble codes out and reset your fuel trims.

Replace the temp sensor for good measure. Just to eliminate that factor, also use that opportunity to flush your radiator too

 

[Templisk]

Ok, I drove on it earlier it was frustrating as hell stopping and the engine dying. I drove it earlier for a good 20 minutes and the problem seems to have worked itself out.

Going to take it easy on the car and see if anything happens, noticed the CEL came back on, so I'll stop by AutoZone tomorrow and get that checked.

Thanks for the help g uys, I'll keep you posted.

 

[xcz504d]

I wonder if it has somthing to do with your fuel trims... Your ECU, after a while of driving, might be compensating for somthing for you, you could be running at 140% fuel trims just to keep the car from dying, while the ECU is controlling it, it might only be working its way around the problem.

 

[Templisk]

Possibly, how can I check my fuel system on my own to make sure everything is operating correctly?

I've always wondered if my car was lacking some power. Sometimes I feel like I have to go WOT to keep up with normal traffic. And if my gas gauge is accurate then I'm getting around 13.5 mpg in cityish highway driving. Up to 45 for a while and down to a stop every half mile or so if the light is red, otherwise several miles at 45-50 mph.

If it helps any I've noticed after warming up the car and revving I have some substance coming out the tailpipe. It's dark, like a black. Most common just above idle, the higher I rev the less there is (assuming it's burning before it gets to me) and time to time I get a dark puff after a rev. Dark grey-black in color.

 

[xcz504d]

Wow, 13 mpg is horrible! Your fuel trims are way out of whack. Even when my o2 sensor went out and all of my fuel trims were maxed out to 140% I was still getting 19 mpg in the city is BUSY stop and go traffic.

Things it could be. MAF (Mass air flow) if it is telling your car that you are recieving more air than you really are, then you will run rich.

o2 Sensor can make you run rich.

Bad fuel injectors, fuel injectors sticking open (happened on my corvette I started loosing power and my CEL came on, lucky for me corvettes tell you EXACTLY what the problem is I ran fuel injector cleaner through it and I havent had a problem in 7 months with it)

Fuel pressure to high, do you have an after market fuel pressure regualtor?

Do you smell gas inside the car? If so you might need to change your fuel filter.

Might be your fuel pump... I would get that CEL looked at first and start from there.

Also a bad coolant temp sensor might cause that, if the car doesn't think it is warmed up it will keep adding more and more fuel and your thermostat won't open to cool the car and you could overheat it.

 

[Templisk]

Car is completely stock except for a K&N air filter. No fuel smell in the car, temp gauge is reading about 50%, it never ever goes over that. When I go fill up today I'll add some fuel injector cleaner. While I'm out I'll get that CEL code checked.

As for the MAF and o2 sensor how can I tell if they are the problem, and how can I correct the problem? I have no tools available to me other than screwdrivers, and a couple socket wrenches.

 

[xcz504d]

A scredriver and a handfull of sockets can take the entire car apart Take my talon for example, it started off troubleshooting the driveline, next thing I know my entire enclosed porch is housing the entire interior and half the engine All I have is a socket set and 6 screwdrivers

The CEL will give you a better idea whether your o2 sensor is going bad and your MAF. If that doesn't tell you anything, it doesn't mean there arent any problems with either, it just means you are going to have to do the work yourself to get it resolved.

Check out www.vfaq.com ALOT of great info there on how to do alot of things, most of it is based around modifying your car yourself, how to do installs and what not but you might find some useful things there in the future.

You can look in the intake and electrical sections of the site to see if you find anything that might help in the mena time, but I want to see what trouble codes you have, thats a good first step.

In the electrical section of that site it hould tell you how to retrieve your error codes and should also tell you what each code means..

 

[Templisk]

NUMBER CROSSED : P0170
CROSS

TROUBLECODE OBDII (ALPHA) P CODE

TROUBLESHOOTING P0170
THE PCM HAS DETERMINED THAT DURING TESTING, THE FUEL COMPENSATION VALUE FOR BANK 1 EXCEEDED THE SPECIFIED RANGE. (BANK 1 IDENTIFIES THE LOCATION OF CYLINDER #1, WHILE BANK 2 IDENTIFIES THE CYLINDERS ON THE OPPOSITE BANK)


If I'm getting this right then Cylinder #1 is getting flooded with too much gas, possibly as a result of one of my fuel injectors being stuck open.

P0171 would be too lean, P0172 is too rich but P0170 is just a fuel trim problem. That code came back twice =/

Topped off the tank (went from 1/8 to full on just like 10 gallons, so my gauge is inaccurate) and put in a bottle of STP Fuel Injector Cleaner. I can't really tell if there's a fuel smell in the car, if there is it's really really faint. If it had to do with my fuel filter would it be really prominent?

 

[xcz504d]

If you drive the car everyday, you might not even notice a fuel smell because you become used to it, have someone smell your shirt when you get out of the car after driving somewhere, or have someone else ride in the car with you, they might be able to notice it. Fuel filter problems generally lead to lack of fuel problems causing your fuel pump and fuel trims to be high trying to comepnsate for a bad filter. With the trouble code you pulled I would think it was an injector problem, a stuck injector would perform as you have described, bad timing could also affect it.

But it sounds like the injector, not so much the timing. It might take a tank or two to clean out the injectors (so you might want to pick up a second bottle when you fill up next time) if that doesnt work, you just need to replace the injector... You can pick up stock injectors pretty cheap in the classifieds.

 

[Templisk]

k I'll be looking at replacing the fuel filter regardless. I've had the car about 2 months and don't know what was replaced when. So when I get the oil change done sometime this week I'll go ahead and change the fuel filter while I'm at it.

I've been holding off doing anything huge for the car because of some body problems. Getting the pictures developed in the next day or so to see if the car is even worth keeping.

 

[xcz504d]

Not trying to discourage you or anything, body work is the most expensive, unless you plan on doing it yourself.

What you can do, is do the prep work yourself, sand it down real good, maybe some light bondo work, theres plenty of info on the web to help you start that, then drive it to Maaco and let them paint it for cheap. Maaco has a bad rap, but it's their lack of prep work, if you do good prep work, the paint they spray on it will last a long time. Don't expect them to color match the car, if you go that route, sand and prime the entire car.

Before sanding and priming though, go down to Maaco or call them and see how much they would charge you if you brought your car in to be painted. Get a quote, save your cash, when you have enough, then sand and prime it. Once you prime it you have to paint it, you cant wait long, and make sure its the dry season, moisture will ruin your primer, and the last thing you want is to have to sand and prime more than once

 

[xcz504d]

One more thing, if you plan on tackling the body work your self, you might want to limit yourself (depending on how comfortable you feel) to small areas of body filler, any big spots of rust, you can have a body shop quote you on how much it would cost to have them repair (but not paint) it. Have them fix it for about $200, do the rest yourself, then drive it to Maaco.

 

[Spoolin4Ever]

I want to see the body pics. You can do it all yourself: Sanding, BONDO (hehe), primer, paint and clear.

I say do it all yourself. It's a great learning experience, and kind of fun. Here's a few tips on DIY Autobody on the cheap (spray cans).

1. Use the same brand and type of primer, paint and clear coat (if you do use a clear coat, which I highly recomend). I did this (mixed emm) and had some funky stuff happen to my paint

2. Don't apply paint, primer, etc.. when it's really hot, or it won't be a thick coat, because it dries instantly upon application (ask me how I know).

3. Take your time.

4. Don't worry about really small mistakes: You might make a few mistakes here and there, but they probablt won't be very noticeable once it all dries.

5. Bondo: Only put about 1/4" thick layer of bondo at a time, let it dry, then add another (if needed). If it's too thick it won't dry very well, and could fall off in one big clump


After I had painted an entire 1992 Eclipse 1.8 in black, later I sold it and not a word about the body was said or asked by the person who bought it: So that tells me you can do this yourself and have an acceptable level of quality.

PS I have seen the maco paint jobs on T/E/L, and they look ok, but it looks the same as the spray paint jobs! The paint has a slightly grainy appearance, just like the spray paint jobs do! So you might as well do it yourself.

 

[compression]

your mass airflow sensor could be bad also

 

[Templisk]

As far as the body problems go, the car has been in an accident I'm sure.

On the passenger side, the weld in the engine bay, at the top of the firewall has buckled in.
The front bumper doesn't sit in line with the hood, passenger headlight mount snapped.

The trunk doesn't close and seat flush the entire way

There is some rusting on the driver side of the engine bay directly above the wheel well (small hole in it too about the diameter of a screwdriver)

So I may not bother keeping the car if it's not structurally sound. As I get on my feet I plan on giving my car all my spare money which will add up to some decent numbers down the road. I don't want to have a platform that won't last me long. I'll be posting the pictures so I can get a better opinion on whether I should keep the Talon or sell it. Probably tomorrow or the next day.

We keep getting back to the MAF I need to go look up how to figure out if it's bad. I'll drive on it for 2 tanks of gas. If I still have horrible gas mileage I'll try troubleshooting it further.