CAR is dead neeed some help...

[killab443]

I recntly got a used transmisson and new clutch installed in my 92 fwd turbo eclipse. Install appears ok. My friend dropped the car off to me and told be there was some problems with the way the engine was running . I start it up and try it out and valves are tapping to hell and the engine is struggleing to stay on. Turbo isnt making any boost at all but I checked it the turbo is spinng fine with little play. So i bring the car back out after messing with a few things(hoses and clamps), and showed no signs of improvment. A little down the street on my way back I felt someting in the engine give out(no pop or anything) Just the engine cutting out and my car died and I pushed it to the side of the road. When you turn the engine over it seems like its not getting any compression at all. All you hear is the sound of the starter motor and see everything spinning like it should,(cams,crank, ect) just no compression. My guess is the headgasket, but I dont no why the valves would have tapped before the gasket going. Could it be the timingbelt? The belt appears to be intact and tight aftert taking the cover off and checking it.
Please help me out I dont know were to start on this project

 

[killab443]

cams

 

[killab443]

crank

 

[killab443]

So wat do you think, same conclusion since youve seen the pics?

 

[BUCK]

I take it Intake Cam Marks are level with Valve Cover Gasket & Exhaust Cam Marks look OFF - Can't really see Crank Pulley Mark but I'm sure you can - Looks pretty clean - Say a prayer tonite when you go to bed - & let us know how the Piston Tops look when you get someone to spin it over with no Plugs while you scope them out with a Maglite.

 

[killab443]

Ive never seen a spark plug like this b4.... Theres metal shavings inside of the 1st cylinder.(The one closest to the timing belt) And It was extremly hard to pull this one out because the threads are ripped apart at the bottom. Looks like there was an explosion

 

[BUCK]

More like a Collision - & the Spark Plug lost - I doubt that was Detonation. For starters - Jerk Radiator, & Jerk the Head, Intake & Exhaust as an Assembly... Sorry Dude.

 

[blu_gxl]

Well, I wasn't doubting your diagnosis just giving him other avenues. It looks like you were right though the belt was off a couple of teeth.

 

[killab443]

why take out the radiator?

 

[killab443]

do I leave the intake mani and turbo and mani on the head when i take it off? or does that have to come off

 

[BUCK]

KILLAB443: why take out the radiator?

Because - you HAVE to drain the Coolant any way to jerk the Head.
AND it's the easiest 4 bolts on a DSM
AND 2 easy clamps
AND 2 easy Connectors
AND it's in the way of every damn thing
AND the GOAL here is for the Radiator to SURVIVE the job
AND not get a ratchet thru it -

Sooooooo........ jerk it!

Buck: Jerk the Head, Intake & Exhaust AS AN ASSEMBLY...

It will take 2 guys to lift it - I've done this job man & furthermore did it RIGHT - If you want to learn these lessons the hard way knock yourself out - But don't make me post every damn thing twice!

LOVE, Uncle Buck

 

[NAT01]

killab443, I was just wondering if you could also update us when you get a chance to take a look at the tops of those pistons. I'm curious to know just how bad that 1st one was. Thanks

 

[killab443]

I did check it out and it lookslike the valve is sitting on top of the piston and it moves up and down with the piston

 

[BUCK]

Ouch! IF - that's IF the Piston is dead this will be kinda like mine when my #1 rod was bent. Being you have to drop the Oil Pan to change the Piston & maybe the Rod you might as well do new all new Rod Bearings & Rings, All new Front Case Oil Seals & delete Rear Balance Shaft - You end up with a damn good Motor when done.

 

[killab443]

Ok tommorrow im embarking on taking the head off...Anyone have any tutorials? so how do I tell if the rod is bent? Will the piston not come all the way up to its stroke or tdc?

 

[BUCK]

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=85988&highlight=overhaul

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=99037&highlight=Face

 

[killab443]

Ok i finally got everything unhooked. now what is the proceedure for taking the head off? What do I unbolt first and what order and so on.

 

[BUCK]

From my previous post...

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=99037&highlight=Face

HEAD REMOVAL PROCEDURES

You don't need to take the fuel rail off or even mess with the accessory belts. The easiest way to PULL the HEAD is with the exhaust and intake manifolds (+ the TB and fuel rail) attached. One can pull the head in 40 minutes (or less) - with a couple of guys...

You can have the head off the car in a couple of hours and install the new head in 2-3 hours (with cleaning the block surface, t-belt and tensioner change).

Jack it up - I prefer to get all 4 wheels off the ground & keep it fairly level.

Might want to remove the hood if you can get a helper
REMOVE battery & it's foundation.

Drain the coolant, I like to slip a bigger hose over the small hose at the petcock & save the anti-freeze if possible.

Drain oil - Pull filter

Pull the radiator (4 easy bolts right on top) & a couple of fan connectors.

Put jack under the oil pan (use a piece of wood to distribute the load)

Remove driver's side motor mount.

Power steering pump - remove & cap line to reservoir & flip pump to firewall with pressure line still connected to pump.

Remove Bolt from Power steering pump bracket to head lifting eye.

Remove driver's side front tire & the shields behind it for access to lower crankshaft area.

Loosen the bolts on the water pump pulley and the crank pulley.

Loosen the alternator and remove the belt.

Remove Timing belt cover & all it's hidden fasteners

Remove the bolts from all the pulleys on the front case except the rear small pulley that drives the oil pump.

Temporarily reinstall battery - tap starter & note rotation of crank pulley nut - place a GOOD 1/2 drive breaker bar inside crank pulley nut & push it against a solid surface (motor mount or chassis member) MAKE SURE YOUR FINGERS ARE CLEAR - have partner tap starter when you are clear - NOTE - I did this without placing bar against a solid surface before tapping starter & the impact from when the starter spun & the bar slapped something solid wrung off a 1/2 breaker bar I'd had for 10 years - it can cut your fingers off - be careful - an alternate method is to use a pipe wrench turned in the CORRECT manner & brace it against the upper motor mount prior to hitting the starter - it will spin the crank pulley nut off very easily - just be careful.

Remove the 2 bolts at the exhaust flange downpipe downstream of The turbo,

Remove the intake hose and

Disconnect the thermostat housing from the head (without disconnecting any hoses or sensors). Disconnect the thermostat housing (with all the hoses attached) by unbolting the three bolts and sliding it off the studs.It's also faster if you unbolt the whole thermostat housing from the head (rather than disconnecting the water hoses and sensors).

Disconnect the CPS, TPS, ISC, IS,

Injectors,

Remove all spark plug wires and disconnect throttle cable and cruise control cables (just snap out of their holders)

Start unplugging the wiring harness that goes across the intake (in square covering) it plugs into the o2 sensor, water neck, injectors, throttle position sensor, idle control motor, closed throttle switch, knock sensor, ac compressor, and ignition coils and igniters (should already be unplugged from step 7)

Remove both fuel lines and fuel feed line from the fuel rail.

Coil and power transistor connections,

Pull vacuum hoses.

Pull the PCV line and the other line from the valve cover.

Remove all the guards and shields from the timing belt area. Unplug all connections into coil pack and ignitor, remove ALL small vacuum lines, its okay to cut them, remove vacuum line going between intake and brake booster don’t cut it and remove fuel return hose (be ready with a rag)

Also remove the brace along the back of the engine block that holds up the intake. If you cant get it off, at least remove the Bolts that are on the INTAKE, if the ones on the block are pulled out, you still will have a bi*** of a time removing the head. It's much easier to get to the couple of bolts on the intake manifold bracket from the passenger side.

Don't take the exhaust manifold off either, just unbolt the turbo (4 bolts) (unbolt just the turbo from the ex-man). Remove the bolts and nut that hold the turbo to the exhaust manifold

Disconnect the coolant line from the firewall to the water neck, disconnect the coolant feed line and return line from the turbo (disconnect the big line fed from the hard coolant crossover pipe at the turbo, disconnect the small line at the rubber hose fed from the water neck, disconnect the coolant to oil cooler line on the water neck, disconnect oil return line from the turbo to the oil pan, but you can probably leave the turbo oil feed line connected to the turbo .

Remove valve cover and then remove the bolts that hold the head on. Make sure you untorque them in small steps and in the opposite order of the torque down procedure. This is best done with a 10MM 1/2inch drive IMPACT SOCKET.

The Hex's in the middle are freeze plugs, they stay in. The head is sealed really well, and is stuck on the gasket.

This SHOULD be everything that holds the head on. Now is the time to do a once over check of everything. Look on all 4 sides of the head for anything that isn’t unhooked and take appropriate unhooking measures.

I started by putting a crowbar thru the exhaustmanifold webs & pulling down - it levered the head loose from gasket stiction quite easily.
I then went from end to end of head & placed wooden blocks under each end until head was almost clear of Turbo Stud.

Then I just layed a fender cover over where the radiator was - leaned over the front & picked the sumbitch up.
It mioght be better on your back if... 2 guys had one end of head each or ... Climb up onto the engine bay, and grab the intake mani and the exhaust mani, and use your legs to lift head already broken loose per above...

Make sure to set the cylinder head on a piece of wood or cardboard or something.

 

[killab443]

"Remove valve cover and then remove the bolts that hold the head on. Make sure you untorque them in small steps and in the opposite order of the torque down procedure. This is best done with a 10MM 1/2inch drive IMPACT SOCKET"

Whats the difference between regular sockets an an impact socket? I have hex sockets and regular sockets, the hex sockets look like they will fit And wat is the torque down proceedure so I can know the opposite of it. Like what order does it have to o be taken off it, cuz i no its not good to just take it all off

 

[killab443]

Also I figured out what caused the jump. balance shaft belt broke and got jammed up in the timing belt and looks like it riped it the b belt bad. so time for the eliminator and a new belt and head. I dont rteally wanna change rods. how can i tell if the rod is bent without ripping it apart? The crank rotates nicely sometimes wont come past tdc cuz the valve is on top of the piston im thinkinim thinking...

 

[BUCK]

KILAB443: I have hex sockets and regular sockets, the hex sockets look like they will fit And wat is the torque down proceedure so I can know the opposite of it. Like what order does it have to o be taken off it, cuz i no its not good to just take it all off

Well if your regular sockets survive the untorqing they were better than mine - Mind you the Head Bolts MAY just spin right out as it's not uncommon for them not to have been properly torqued previously.

I would still recommend a good hard 1/2 Drive Impact bit & Extensions for the Installation Torquing.

The Untorquing order is loosen the innermost Head bolts first & incrementaly work your ways back & forth toward the ends of the Head.

BTW - This is why Balance Shafts SUCK - Yours have spun their last spin - You won't need the whole BSE "kit" - just the stubby Oil Pump Shaft from a Mirage - you will be very happy without them.

IF the Piston comes flush with top of block Rod is probably good - BUT - IF Piston is bad - & #1 may well be bad - you'll have to drop pan anyway to pull Rod Cap to pull Rod to change Piston - Once you have to drop pan you'd be NUTS not to replace ALL Rod BEARINGS - & all Rings - not all Rods.

Kinda worried about what the #1 Piston & the Head are gonna look like.

 

[killab443]

I have really good sets. All Clien Tools ( Ithink thats how its spelt). I also have a breaker bar which is gunna make it easier. I shouldnt have to worry about the sockets breaking...Hopefully. I was just worried about the untorque specs. Oo One more thing can I just cut the rear balance shaft to a stub instead of buying the mirage stub. I sdont have to remove the front shaft right? Just the rear? And all gears will stay in just without a B belt(To hold oil)?

 

[BUCK]

There IS a link to a method where the guy just cut off the shaft at the Counterweight & then drilled & tapped the shaft to plug the oil passage that fed the Rear Balance Shaft Bearing - But the Mirage Shaft is only like $16.50 from Mitsu & you'll be disassembling the Oil Pump to check clearances, retorque the Sprocket Nut (which was has been a source of BAD failures) & replace the Oil Seal at the Sprocket anyway - So man I'd spend the 16.50 - We're talking OIL PUMP here... the Heart of your Motor - & you may NOT want to play Heart Surgeon for $20...

& Yes the Front Shaft stays (with new Oil Seal), the Gear & little Sleeve that mates to the Oil Seal stays. The Balance Shaft Tensioner Pulley goes - I plugged the hole with a short Bolt, Washer & RTV.

Kinda worried about what the #1 Piston & the Head are gonna look like so let us know when you get there... Keep up the good work.

 

[killab443]

Ok Ill guess Ill just buy the stub from mitsubishi. I will let you know how the head looks hopefully by the weekend. Its gunna be a busy week for me.

 

[BUCK]

Just in case...

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=108016

 

[killab443]

Well here it is buck. The lovely piston