? about dual tunes

[DSM_munky_man]

Alright, so I am getting my tuning close to done for my pump and when its done I am wanting to tune for e85 as well. So I am going to use the Idle Switch mod to switch between tunes. Now I know that I am going to have to put my pump gas tune on the secondary map and map the e85 on the primary map. But here is my question. I am assuming that airflow is going to stay the same hence you only switch fuel maps. But what happens when I turn up boost for the e85? Am I going to have to do airflow again and WOT everytime I switch between the two? Or would the computer know the difference and account for that?

 

[jrohner]

I don't really understand your question, but E85 vs gasoline your injector compensation, fuel map, and timing map will all be different.

 

[fullCircle]

Alright, so I am getting my tuning close to done for my pump and when its done I am wanting to tune for e85 as well. So I am going to use the Idle Switch mod to switch between tunes. Now I know that I am going to have to put my pump gas tune on the secondary map and map the e85 on the primary map. But here is my question. I am assuming that airflow is going to stay the same hence you only switch fuel maps. But what happens when I turn up boost for the e85? Am I going to have to do airflow again and WOT everytime I switch between the two? Or would the computer know the difference and account for that?

You should only have to tune to the highest boost your car will see, once you are done you should be set when running at lower psi's

 

[DSM_munky_man]

Whats the easiest way to run 2 tunes w/ 2 fuels w/o having to retune everytime?

You should only have to tune to the highest boost your car will see, once you are done you should be set when running at lower psi's

Ok, so if I am going to run for example 30 psi on e85 but only 22 on pump then I tune e85 at 30 and fix my airflow and timing for that, then when i switch to pump and 22 psi I should be ok? will it derate me any since it is tuned for higher boost and different fuel? Or will i still have a considerable amount of power with pump still.

 

[fullCircle]

Whats the easiest way to run 2 tunes w/ 2 fuels w/o having to retune everytime?



Ok, so if I am going to run for example 30 psi on e85 but only 22 on pump then I tune e85 at 30 and fix my airflow and timing for that, then when i switch to pump and 22 psi I should be ok? will it derate me any since it is tuned for higher boost and different fuel? Or will i still have a considerable amount of power with pump still.

You will have to do a full tune for each setting, 1 for E85 and 1 for regular gas. i have ECMlink V3, but i have not had any expreiance with it yet. Car is currently down.

Whats the easiest way to run 2 tunes w/ 2 fuels w/o having to retune everytime?



Ok, so if I am going to run for example 30 psi on e85 but only 22 on pump then I tune e85 at 30 and fix my airflow and timing for that, then when i switch to pump and 22 psi I should be ok? will it derate me any since it is tuned for higher boost and different fuel? Or will i still have a considerable amount of power with pump still.

You will tune and save your maps for each fuel. The switch will swap the maps out as per your request. the two maps will be whatever you tuned for. your maps can have different boost pressures.

You will have to retune both maps if you make upgrades.

 

[Tyeler18]

Yoture making two completely different maps then when you switch back to say pump you'll flash over your pump map

 

[DSM_munky_man]

Just to reiterate, u guys know that with the full version u can run the idleswitch to a toggle and switch on the dash and swap between 2 different fuel tune settings, I am jus wondering what to do withtiming now, cause I figured out with airflow as long as its dialed in for w/e system your running then it will be fine when u turn up boost or turn it down

 

[Boomdeeze]

With v3, can't you have a few templates saved at once which would allow you to have multiple tunes for your car? I want to have 3 tunes for my car this spring, 93 oct. at 23 lbs, E85 at 23 lbs, and E85 at 33 lbs. Two DD settings and one track settings and I just want the 93 setting for when I go on a road trip and can't find a station with E85. So wouldn't you just need to carry your laptop around with you and you could have multiple tune saved at once?

 

[flyineagletsi]

What do you mean? Maybe I am misunderstanding your timing question but you have to tune the MinOctane table for 93 and the MaxOctane for E85. The timing between the two maps will be completley different. Get your MAF or SD whatever your useing to read acuratly like Tom mentioned on your link post and then you will adjust the timing tables as needed. I would leave the timing sliders zeroed out. Obviously if you want to crank up the boost on the e85 tune then adjust the timing tables for that in the max table but as long as you run your low boost setting on the min table you shouldn't have to compensate anything on the min table. Not sure if I answered your question at all.

 

[DSM_munky_man]

I think u just answered it. So for the tune that is activated with the switch on then I use the minoct with secondary fuel map, then use max octane timing for the main fuel map correct?

 

[flyineagletsi]

Ahhh I see the question now. Yeah IIRC the ecu will switch between timing maps dependent on the fuel and the amount of knock detected. You have to manually switch the fuel maps to the OpenLoopMaxOct or OpenLoopMinOct. So when you fill up for E85, use the switch to go to the OpenLoopMaxOct and the ecu will pull the timing from your TmgMaxOct table automatically. Since the ECU always tries to run the most timing possible based on fuel you shouldn't ever have to manually switch timing maps. If I am wrong here someone please chime in because I'm looking to do the same thing here in a month or so and I am not out to misinform.

 

[DSM_munky_man]

Alright, That kinda makes sense still just the only thing I am still confused on is, with either pump or e85 it will use the maxoct? so when I tune for either of them I just track the maxoct in the log for either fuel and adjust timing for knock reduction? or when using e85 I use the maxoct timing table and when i switch it to pump use the min oct timing table? That is the only part I am confused on!

 

[flyineagletsi]

or when using e85 I use the maxoct timing table and when i switch it to pump use the min oct timing table?

That is correct except you will switch the fuel maps, not the timing maps. The computer either will pull the timing directly out of the TmgMaxOct table or it will interpolate between the TmgMinOct table and the TmgMaxOct table. It does this whether you run E85 or Pump. So when you run pump gas, if the computer tried to pull timing from you TmgMaxOct (which is tuned for E85) it would most likely result in knock so the computer will instead pull timing from the TmgMinOct table. When you run E85 the computer will see the lack of knock and run as much timing as your TmgMaxOct table will allow before it too knocks. The reason for the Min timing table is so that normal people don't blow their cars up so when a car knocks the ecu will resort to interpolating a lesser timing value, but you are going to be using it for a different type of fuel instead.

So I also have a question..... If you run a setup like this will the ecu still be able to knock retard on the pump gas tune?

 

[DSM_munky_man]

Ya I understand I would be switching fuel maps and not timing, I was just wondering what timing tables to tune with when I am on pump or e85.

And to your question IDK. I am going to assume yes because the timing will be far more advance for the e85 so it will have to back off timing to prevent knock?

 

[flyineagletsi]

Oh ok, at least that was cleared up.

As far as my question goes.... but if your already pulling your timing from your TmgMinOct table and your Knocking on pump gas where is the ecu going to pull timing from to retard it?

On a side note if it can't knock retard, I would just leave the pump tune plenty conservative since you probably won't be too concerned with performance on pump gas. It's more of an issue of availability.

 

[DSM_munky_man]

True, but I still want it pretty beastly for gas as well, and how would you keep it conservative? I'm not sure on how the knock retard works, but maybe someone will chime in and help?

 

[DSM_munky_man]

Still need help on the question. Also I found this quote on the bottom of the octtables,

By far, most people will find that they run a very high Octane rating and can generally ignore the min octane table, or just set it equal to the max.

So with that, can I set them both to the stock Max octane, then somehow tie the seconday fuel map for my pump tune to the min octane table, tune for knock then have it run of the min table, even though it is set the same as the max? And then when I tune for e85 set the time in max table and tie that to the main tune. Or would the timeing be so high in e85 that it would automatically revert to the min table sicne it probably would be knocking all over the board?

 

[DSM_munky_man]

Nevermind I figured it out. For searchers sake, you can enable minoct table with secondary fuel maps by having them both enabled with the idleswitch active, this of course is for 1gs only.