4 Mechanics Have Given Up, Please Read and Help if You Can

[New2DSM2]

Hi guys,

As my name suggests I am relatively new to DSM ownership but not at all new to cars or car maintenence.

Here is the problem I am having I hope you can help me with:

I bought a 1990 Talon TSi AWD 5 speed from a guy for $700. I know what you're thinking (crap) but it wasn't, he was the original owner with the original sticker and he is just an older guy who is out of touch with what the car was really worth. It had 56,000 miles when I bought it (64,000 now). The problem I am going to describe has been there since day 1 owning the car. There is a fairly aggressive 'grinding sound' coming from the right rear wheel area of the car. We have hooked up chassis ears to it, and had thought, determined it is somewhere in the suspension (crossmember, control arms, etc.). The sound is ONLY there when you decelerate in gear (any gear), but it is intermittent, sometimes it is gone entirely, sometimes extremely loud. The sound is best described as 'gear whine' or 'rotational' of some sort. This being the case, we started replacing things (and haven't stopped). So far we have replaced all universal joints, the rear differential, both rear axles, all four rear wheel bearings, all crossmember/carrier support bushings (except the ones in the crossmember itself, because you can't without buying a whole new one). We have taken the driveshaft out altogether (drove and accelerated very very slowly before you start twitching) to see if we could localize the sound and we noticed it was perfectly quiet, no noise whatsoever, which led us back to the rear of the car. Having replaced anything that has gears, universals joints or splines, we don't think it is drivetrain related. Basically, the only things left in the car that haven't been replaced are the control arms bushings, ebrake items and the crossmember (dealer FIRMLY believes this is the problem and wants $1000+ to change a new one into it because of labor @ 10.4 hours). All four of our mechanics feel it is NOT the crossmemeber, but we are at a loss, the noise has lessened a tad but won't go away, and we really don't believe it's the tranny because the noise went away when we drove it with only the front wheel drive, but again I am a newbie so tell me if we are wrong. Any help you guys can lend us would be most appreciated. Also, just want to add I don't really care what it costs (obviously) I just want it fixed so I can drive this peach without grating my teeth when I downshift and decel.

Only mods on the car are a SPEC Stage 3 lightweight clutch and Flywheel, Buschur turbo back, OZ Super Leggeras (brand new) and a Supra SMIC. By the way, the noise was there before the clutch install. (see, I did search first).

Please help, I can't be the only guy in the world of DSMs to run into this problem.

Thanks in advance and sorry this is long but you guys said you needed info for diagnosis

Let me know if you need any other information.

 

[erebusknight]

Have you checked how the exhaust is hooked up. My buddy drives a 2000 Z28 and he was messing with the Y-pipe. Later he brought it down to my shop and we were thinking brakes (grind on braking). sounded awful. Took it out for a spin and found out the driveshaft was hitting the Y-pipe because it was not in all the way.
The driveshaft only hit on braking because of the driveshaft bucking up during braking
try looking for ANY interference with anything. I would check that exhaust next seeing that its not OEM

 

[GVR4592]

That was going to be my suggestion as well. I've had problems in the past with my exhaust hitting my diff and driveshaft.

 

[shift_racer]

Or maybe worn motor mounts which would in turn cause the engine to move more under decel in gear which could cause other things to move causeing a bind between the driveshaft and the transfer case and rear diff. The driveshaft would tweak a little bit also and hit something as well.

 

[talondude4]

Check everything from exhaust shields to brake shields, also struts.


Just some of my suggestions.(I'm guessing).

 

[New2DSM2]

The exhaust seemed a likely candidate as well so we checked that, sorry, should have mentioned that in the first post. The chassis ears tell us it's something in the right rear because the sound is very loud there, but I understand that sounds get transmitted through the driveline. The motor mounts may have merit though as the car sat for so long and other things were very dry rotted, so I will check those maybe replace them. Any suggestions for a street/strip motor mount that won't crack my spine every time I shift?
Thanks for the suggestions gang, it is really appreciated. I was also thinking about the control arm bushings, I hear the term 'knuckle bushing' used alot in DSM circles, which one is the knuckle bushing? Anyone have a blow up or diagram?
Thanks again!

 

[talondude4]

http://www.slowboyracing.com/shop.php?sid=&cat=2400

 

[New2DSM2]

Thanks for the fast reply, but it says 'If you ask how stiff these babies are, you may not want the answer.' Anything a tad less ummm...backbreaking or are these the only option you guys like?

 

[talondude4]

Thanks for the fast reply, but it says 'If you ask how stiff these babies are, you may not want the answer.' Anything a tad less ummm...backbreaking or are these the only option you guys like?

Not sure other then replace with stock. The only thing with those mounts is that the car will vibrate.

Other then that there pretty sick.

 

[Dream On]

I say if you're going to replace them, get the urethane ones. I was going to say clutch chatter, since my spec stage 3 chatters on decel., but since it was there before, I'm not really sure where to start.

 

[Rex2342]

Check the transfer case to see if there is fluid in it. what about the wheels rubbing the brake lines? My last 90 did this until it wore through and almost killed me and my dog.

 

[New2DSM2]

Ok just went and checked the fluid in the transfer case and its fine, and also checked the brake lines and they are way clear of the wheels, but keep the suggestions coming guys, I would be willing to go check the wheel clearance on my wife's QX4 if I thought it would help.

 

[talondude4]

I would check for a bad wheel bearing or a bad joint in the axle shaft. Also check for chop on your tires, or any signs of a bad alighnment.

 

[New2DSM2]

All four rear wheel bearings and both axle shafts have been replaced already (much to my dismay) and no improvement/fix. Do you guys think the dealer might be right about worn out bushings in the crossmember where the rear carrier bolts up? Anyone ever experienced those going bad?

 

[talondude4]

All four rear wheel bearings and both axle shafts have been replaced already (much to my dismay) and no improvement/fix. Do you guys think the dealer might be right about worn out bushings in the crossmember where the rear carrier bolts up? Anyone ever experienced those going bad?

Ok i got the fix!






























turn the radio up!

 

[emd645e3]

Ok i got the fix!






























turn the radio up!

Welcome to the world of DSM's. My fix for any noise I heard: "Just don't think about it. Don't talk about it."

 

[New2DSM2]

Good call man! I have been applying that fix for about 7 months now and it works great until the wife is in the car and goes, ' What's wrong with your car honey?' GROAN I used to just pin her back in the seat and she would forget about it but unfortunately I also have a 450+ WHP 240SX and she got used to it being much more violent than my DSM (for now) and so the nagging continues even under WOT

 

[emd645e3]

Good call man! I have been applying that fix for about 7 months now and it works great until the wife is in the car and goes, ' What's wrong with your car honey?' GROAN I used to just pin her back in the seat and she would forget about it but unfortunately I also have a 450+ WHP 240SX and she got used to it being much more violent than my DSM (for now) and so the nagging continues even under WOT

Yeah, it worked for me until what was making the noise decided to break

2 months later, and some parts, the 'Clipse will be moving again by next week. Just keep trying. Check and re-check. It really sounds like a transfer case/trans/diff problem.

 

[BaddAssGst]

I know alot of people will say it's unlikely but I would say it's in your flywheel. If it's the same sound I have, I would say thats it. I know of 5 guys that have an aluminum flywheel and they have the worst noise, myself included. It's only on decelleration and only when it's in gear. Try slowing down in neutral and see if it goes away..

I can't say for sure what it is but all I know is that it sounds like it's coming from the rear of the car.

 

[Jeff822]

Actually i think i am having the same problem as you right now ( i kno its coming from my exhaust somewhere) but i think one of my hangers is hittting the driveshaft and sometimes on the highway it sounds like the whole exhaust its just dragging making an awfully loud grinding sound, and when i hit a bump or something i can fell my auto shifter shake when my hand is on it from the exhaust tapping. see if it might be one of the hangers not lined up right rubbing the driveshaft.

 

[force-fed]

All very interesting responses, well I am new to dsm but not new to cars. I do not know if you did this already but if it sounds like a grind I would try to get under there and start checking for contact spots where some wear would be evident. Check that heat shield for the cat see if that isn;t touching the driveshaft as well.Check that the lil dust shield cup (or watever it's called) at the end of the transfer case isn't touching the Shaft

 

[lasertim]

If the sound went away when you took the driveshaft it is obviously something to do with something from the driveshaft back.

Have you checked the driveshaft hanger/support? I am not sure if that is the correct terminology. I hear all kinds of stories of the rubber getting weak and deteriorating and causing driveshaft "slap". Maybe yours is so bad that it grinds instead of just flopping around like it normally would do when going bad.

 

[Rex2342]

Yeah maybe it's the carrier bearing for the driveshaft? I didn't notice if you checked it or not but it cold cause a grinding noise if the rubber is rotted away.

 

[New2DSM2]

Driveshaft carriers, there are 2 of them on the thing. Good call, I will try those next, that sound could be generated there and transmitted to the right rear wheel. I know it isnt the cat shield because its not there anymore, and the exhaust isnt touching anything either but thanks for those ideas as well guys. I can't tellyou how much I appreciate all of ya trying to sort this out with me. Let me try those carrier bearings cause they look very rough and go from there...hell at this rate I will have a brand new car

 

[JOEY A]

The carrier barrings are realy loud, and it will come and go but when there really shot you will just hear the banging grinding sound.


Maybe you should go to a DSM shop, im sure there is one were you at or ask some people on the forum if they can direct you to some were better...