3/S vs DSM

[omega260]

thats funny... i saw one the other day

Lay of the meddies

 

[BurrowZ]

Besides its not street racing. We just happen to be accelerating at the same time while trying to go somewhere.

Let me just say, before this thread closes, that there is no war between 3/S or DSM. If anything, you're over here trying to start one.

Also if you think 187whp is fast for an N/A V6..

 

[fastnelson]

To the OP:
i don't know what's your problem is but looks like you have your brains stuck in your ass, i think you need mommy!.

 

[Girly TT]

This thread is so full of face-palm it's not even funny.

I wouldn't even know where to begin with setting shit straight. Ugh.

You're killin' me smalls!!!! KILLIN' ME!

 

[GirLyVR4]

This thread is so full of face-palm it's not even funny.

I wouldn't even know where to begin with setting shit straight. Ugh.

You're killin' me smalls!!!! KILLIN' ME!

*phew* found my old log-in.

 

[GirLyVR4]

why i got a dsm instead of building another 3s. I have a friend that has a 3.5 stroker with twin pte 5857's and he is hopeing to make 750-850 with a good tune at 26 psi and run a low to mid 10sec pass. total cost of his build about 15-20k

With my dsm i am hoping for about 500hp on a hx40 running 32 psi on a built motor and a stripped car to run the same track times. total cost of investment including the car 5-6k

I had spent 60+k on my 94 3kvr4 when i got rid of it due to a head gasket issue from one of the top shops.

now i appreciate them and still think they are one of the most gorgeous cars from the 90's hands down.

god the more i read this thread the more crap i find


once Again mitoska1977 or whatever his screen name is is the largest stock parts vendor. gzp does part out cars but are mainly just has a shop and a reputation of not finishing work when promised.(have no personal dealings with them but i have read so many threads about work not being finished)

for anyone that is also in the 3s world the main shops in order i would recommend
3sx(provides all parts and tuning)
pampena motorsports (master tuner and generally accepted god among 3s owners he is the 3/s version of shep)
dynamic racing(shop holds the record for only 3s in the 8's)
ips (slow shipping but offers cheapish pricing)

Actually... we are about 2-3 times larger than mitoska... on a very conservative scale, and mitoska knows it as well. We are EASILY the largest in the country, and I would venture to say the world.


And fyi, these cars don't have headgasket issues unless you are running composite gaskets and high boost (which, if you're a 94 VR4, they come out of the box with MLS gaskets), and no quality shop would install a composite gasket on your car.

So, you were either toasting the SHIT out of your car with a faulty cooling system, boosting the daylights out of your car WAY above safe levels, or the top end of your engine was not assembled properly at some point in it's life.

And if you dumped 60k into your car without having 800hp and a brand new EVERYTHING to show for it, then you got taken.

 

[3kgt2nv]

That 60kthe was including a lot of things other than performance like cf parts and an all new interior. But the build i replaced almost every part since many were rusty or in unknown condition.

Since your asking though the coolant system was all replaced and i was running between 15-19 psi. The issue happened because when 3sx rebuilt the car they failed to torque one of the head studs properly

And guess you are bigger parts wise. Never really bought used parts for the 3s would rather have just bought new

 

[shane90gsx]

Well looks like I'm a little late to the party. . I'm a fan of anything Mitsubishi. The small meets we have here, everyone likes both cars. (I own a 90 TSI and a 97 vr-4) I have never seen a rivalry online either. I like to pick on non Mits cars on the track. But I love all Mits AWD cars. I picked the 3s because of how refined it is, and how good it looks. Bolt ons can make decent power. But it is very heavy.
My 90 is built and mostly road race. Cheap, fast, but rough and loud. I owned a 95 GSX. And wanted that as my daily. I did a lot of mods, and it was quick. But with smog, it made it difficult to make over 300whp. My just about stock 3s made 266whp at the wheels. (K&N and BOV) again heavy and would get smashed by a tuned 1g with a 16g. Sorry to say.
Good thing I'm bolting on 15gs and support mods. here are some pics.

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[shane90gsx]

Here is a few more of the talon.

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[shane90gsx]

Oh and I destroy Zr-1's

 

[GirLyVR4]

That 60kthe was including alot of things other than percormance like cf parts and an all new interior. But the build i replaced almost everypart since many were rusty or in unknown condition.

Since your asking though the coolant system was all repkaced and i was running between 15-19a psi. The issue happened because when 3sxwe built the car they failed to torque one of the head studs properly

And guess you are bigger parts wise. Never really bought used parts for the 3sphone would rather have just bought new

Sorry to hear about the head bolt issue.

Even with almost everything new, I'm baffled at the 60k price... We did a new built engine, all new everything, polished everything, etc, upgraded turbos, etc, 400+ AWHP build on a Spyder for under 20k parts and labor. If you weren't pushing 800+ AWHP with new top of the line, forged EVERYTHING, then you were seriously price gouged.


Aside from maintenance and some basic trim and mechanical parts, most parts are discontinued now, there's really no other option aside from used.

Well looks like I'm a little late to the party. . I'm a fan of anything Mitsubishi. The small meets we have here, everyone likes both cars. (I own a 90 TSI and a 97 vr-4) I have never seen a rivalry online either. I like to pick on non Mits cars on the track. But I love all Mits AWD cars. I picked the 3s because of how refined it is, and how good it looks. Bolt ons can make decent power. But it is very heavy.
My 90 is built and mostly road race. Cheap, fast, but rough and loud. I owned a 95 GSX. And wanted that as my daily. I did a lot of mods, and it was quick. But with smog, it made it difficult to make over 300whp. My just about stock 3s made 266whp at the wheels. (K&N and BOV) again heavy and would get smashed by a tuned 1g with a 16g. Sorry to say.
Good thing I'm bolting on 15gs and support mods. here are some pics.

Tuned vs stock really isn't comparable on any scale. I can throw a bolt-on turbo set-up on a VR4 and net 500+ AWHP on pump gas, and walk all over a 16g dsm.

You'll enjoy the 15G's though. 400awhp with daily drivability is a sweet thing

 

[donniekak]

Sorry to hear about the head bolt issue.

Even with almost everything new, I'm baffled at the 60k price... We did a new built engine, all new everything, polished everything, etc, upgraded turbos, etc, 400+ AWHP build on a Spyder for under 20k parts and labor. If you weren't pushing 800+ AWHP with new top of the line, forged EVERYTHING, then you were seriously price gouged.


Aside from maintenance and some basic trim and mechanical parts, most parts are discontinued now, there's really no other option aside from used.





Tuned vs stock really isn't comparable on any scale. I can throw a bolt-on turbo set-up on a VR4 and net 500+ AWHP on pump gas, and walk all over a 16g dsm.

You'll enjoy the 15G's though. 400awhp with daily drivability is a sweet thing

I build both cars. It's going to take a lot of money to get a 3s to walk a well setup 16g Dsm. Most of the well sorted 16g cars are trapping around 125. In fact no 3s with 2 16g' s has gone as fast as the Dsm 16g record, with one.

 

[GirLyVR4]

I build both cars. It's going to take a lot of money to get a 3s to walk a well setup 16g Dsm. Most of the well sorted 16g cars are trapping around 125. In fact no 3s with 2 16g' s has gone as fast as the Dsm 16g record, with one.

I've built both cars too

Now that we've cleared the air, what's the dsm 16G record?

Twin 16G's are not a good turbo set-up for the 3/S. They do better with bolt-on turbos (as I mentioned in my post that you quoted) retaining a td04 housing. TD05's get too laggy, unless you run billet, and even then, it leaves some to be desired for a street car. I had twin 16G's on our old 98 VR4, and it was OK from a roll, but anything under 80mph, and that car just felt lack-luster.

 

[3kgt2nv]

with the 16g kit on my vr4 it was always a bad rpm for the turbos it seamed with the 6 speed. i was either leaving it in gear for longer than i like so i could shift and be in my power band or i had to shift and respool the turbos.

the 3sxexacutioners even though i made less power felt a lot better with spool and over all useable powerband because of them being a bolt on. I wish the 19t's or the 750's were around when i did my building instead of the 5k ips 16g kit that i went with .

 

[GirLyVR4]

with the 16g kit on my vr4 it was always a bad rpm for the turbos it seamed with the 6 speed. i was either leaving it in gear for longer than i like so i could shift and be in my power band or i had to shift and respool the turbos.

the 3sxexacutioners even though i made less power felt a lot better with spool and over all useable powerband because of them being a bolt on. I wish the 19t's or the 750's were around when i did my building instead of the 5k ips 16g kit that i went with .

I had the first IPS 16G kit on our 98 VR4 (I got in on their first group buy and had the kit overnighted to meet a deadline). It was OK, but like you said, it was just not a very fun/usable power band for normal driving circumstances.

the 3sx executioners are like a 15G/16T turbo IIRC. I have a blown set off my yellow VR4 sitting on a shelf somewhere.

I have a set of billet td04's on my white TT now, LOVE them. We're still breaking my engine in, but I'm ITCHING to toss in the bigger injectors and get it tuned

The turbo options now are 1000x's better than even just a few years ago.

 

[1990AWD]

Now that we've cleared the air, what's the dsm 16G record?

16g record is just under 10 seconds on nitrous, not sure about no-nitrous. Heck even the 14b AWD no nitrous is like an 11.37.

 

[GirLyVR4]

16g record is just under 10 seconds on nitrous, not sure about no-nitrous. Heck even the 14b AWD no nitrous is like an 11.37.

The stock 9b's have run 10's on a Stealth. I'm sure, if someone was so inclined to gut and swiss-cheese their car, they could nuke out low-sub 10's with 16G's.

Was that on a stock engine? or stroked?

 

[fastnelson]

The issue happened because when 3sx rebuilt the car they failed to torque one of the head studs properly

Originally Posted by 3kgt2nv
for anyone that is also in the 3s world the main shops in order i would recommend
3sx(provides all parts and tuning)

, you just recommend that sop to everyone as the best...

 

[Spyder FX]

Will you be entering your car in Bracket 1 at the shootout Nelson?

 

[pnbdash]

there shouldnt be any fights among family members...

 

[3kgt2nv]

, you just recommend that sop to everyone as the best...

anyone can #### up. every shop will eventually have a build that fails even when all new and correct parts are used due to an unseen error.

i have seen brand new 2012 cars show up to the dealership with a knocking motor. after inspection it was found that the crank bearings were not installed at the factory.

Im not happy about the situation but i would still say that as a shop they are still respectable.

look at the other shops that were around at the time.

gt pro
dynamic
3sx

that was it for my choices. ray wasnt taking any work since he was closing his shop to go to toyota at the time and dynamic told me to bring him my car before he would give me a price. i live in ny so im not going to trailer my car across the country for a quote.

after talking with matt and steve at 3sx i had a good feeling and i would definitely use chris now for a build.

 

[GirLyVR4]

The dealer would replace that engine under warranty though. Not really the same.

 

[fastnelson]

Will you be entering your car in Bracket 1 at the shootout Nelson?

bracket 2

NBF

 

[shane90gsx]

Tuned vs stock really isn't comparable on any scale. I can throw a bolt-on turbo set-up on a VR4 and net 500+ AWHP on pump gas, and walk all over a 16g dsm.

You'll enjoy the 15G's though. 400awhp with daily drivability is a sweet thing

Thank you sir, and your right. I liked my 16g powered cars. I like the Tq of the 3s more. I'm doing the build right. I have fuel system, 120k service, (doing this early) computer, wide band, cooling, ect. And my talon is almost done too. So I can compare, FP 3065, vs 2x 15's

 

[GirLyVR4]

Thank you sir, and your right. I liked my 16g powered cars. I like the Tq of the 3s more. I'm doing the build right. I have fuel system, 120k service, (doing this early) computer, wide band, cooling, ect. And my talon is almost done too. So I can compare, FP 3065, vs 2x 15's

I'm not a sir... as indicated by my username...

You'll love the 15G's. Good luck with the build