1g Help, might be knocking

[g4ebguy90]

Alright guys.
I hate 6 bolts. I thought they were bulletproof.

1991 GS with a GST ENGINE.

Anyways.

This is what happened.

Highway at 65 car was getting a little hot, I pull over to let it cool, battery dies, I get it jumped and head back out on my way. Car starts to make a weird noise, at 65 mph, I pull into a parking lot, and there is OIL all over the ground on my tire, and on the engine, then to top it off, 5 mins later coolant comes bubbling out the overflow . It was a sad sight.

After it was cooled off, I started back up, Battery dead again , after getting jumped for the 2nd time, the car starts LEAKS NO OIL.

I check it, it's about 1/2 quart low. I say screw it lets get it home. I drive it home making this weird noise *NOT KNOCK* just a rattling sounded like from head, i dont go above 2000 rpm. I get it finally to my house i give it a little gas like up to 3k and it SOUNDS HORRIBLE.

I pull into my house, and at idle it's making a light clunking sound.... I give it a little gas and the clunky noise increases ..... i have 2 dsm's down .

What could this be?????? loose pulley or a bad rod..... sigh, and to top it off I don't be the crap outta of it, i took good care of this car while I had it.

Pretty upset, I got no money to fix it, and no job, and no car now, and 2 broke down DSM's.

 

[kt239]

Sounds like mine did when I had a bad rod bearing. My thoughts? Bad rod bearing based off of the fact that your symptoms almost directly replicate what mine were.

 

[g4ebguy90]

ok, Umm if I pull the oil pan, What do I look for, Will the rod move back and fourth????
I'm going to pull the pan today. it's a 6-bolt do I got to do anything special to get it off, or is it just a take off bolts thing?

What did you car do ?

 

[92AWDHX40]

Pull the bolts off and pull the crank out and inspect everything nothing special needed just a engine tear down to get to what you need to. A tear down, basic tools is all you will need.

 

[kt239]

Yeah If you want to check real quick to see if that IS the situation you are having you simply drop the oil pan and wiggle the rod ends back and forth, if one of them is bad you will know real quick. Mine had the same knocking pattern you are describing thats what made me think that was your issue. If nothing else its a quick thing to try to rule a possible issue out.

 

[Geier]

I would take off the timing belt covers first to inspect your balance shaft belt.

 

[g4ebguy90]

DUDE, I checked my belts, the balance shaft one is like torn in half, and if I pull on it, its real loose and I can hear a knocking noise. What to do???? Kind of weird.... I've never worked on a 6 bolt so... What should I start with. I think pulling the pan is pointless right now. Should I cut the balance shaft belt off, and see how it runs??? It already vibrates really really bad. I thought it had a balance shaft delete. But to my amasement it dont. Pics to come

 

[Calan]

From what you have described, you most likely jumped timing and have some bent valves. I would focus on that first.

I just posted this in another thread about 15 minutes ago, but it applies here too:

To reiterate and add to the few good suggestions in this thread (somewhat in order of simplicity):

1. Stop attempting to start the car until you get some more information.

2. Pull the spark plugs, and check for signs of pitting, breakage, or discoloration.

How To Read Spark Plugs

3. Visually check the timing (again). Inspect the timing belt, and make sure that all the marks still line up correctly.

4. Do a leak-down test... NOT a compression test. Cranking the motor over for a compression test will only make things worse if you have valve or bearing damage.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/articles-engine-fuel/338152-compression-leak-down-testing.html

5. Drain the oil and look closely for metal flakes, or signs of water mixing with the oil. Shine a bright flashlight on some of the oil at an angle and look for reflection off metallic particles, and strain some through a clean white cloth and see if anything gets left behind.

6. With the plugs out, turn the motor over by hand with a wrench on the crank bolt, and listen for any signs of interference or metal on metal contact.

7. Pull the valve cover and look for anything suspicious, such as rockers out of place, lifters discolored from excessive heat, etc.

8. Pull the oil pan and check the rods for play, and inspect everything possible for wear or breakage.

Take this route and then get back to us.

 

[g4ebguy90]

DUDE did you not read my above statement. the balance shaft is ripped, and if I pull on it, it makes a knocking sound. I think I found it.

Heres some pics.
As of right now I'm stopping work, until I can be advised.

 

[LiquidX]

The one thing you'll really want to look for since you have that "clunk" noise is any bearing material in the oil. That will all need flushed out before you get it taken care of. I would suggest installing an elimination kit for the balance shaft. Makes timing a lot easier too.

 

[g4ebguy90]

Yea, I'm going to pull the pan to be safe. If that checks out, then off comes the crank and I'm gonna get crackn at the BS delete. I might just leave the belt off for a week or 2, till I get by. I don't see how I could do a good balance shaft delete without pulling the engine.

 

[92AWDHX40]

Yep its not easy pulling the pump off would be a pita.

 

[Calan]

DUDE did you not read my above statement. the balance shaft is ripped, and if I pull on it, it makes a knocking sound. I think I found it.

Heres some pics.
As of right now I'm stopping work, until I can be advised.

DUDE...I read your statement and did advise you on what to do.

If your BS belt is ripped and causes noise when you pull on it, there's a chance that something got into the timing belt and caused you to jump timing. If so, you could have slightly bent valves which would cause "a rattling sounded like from head".

So my advice still seems to make sense to me after re-reading it.

Did I miss something?

 

[g4ebguy90]

Ok I get what your saying now, I hope for the best and will update.

As of right now I'm getting ready to pull the pan.

 

[WeaselHack]

Ok I get what your saying now, I hope for the best and will update.

As of right now I'm getting ready to pull the pan.

I know we had our differences of opinion last night but I'm sorry to hear about your trouble...Hopefully its a simple fix.

 

[g4ebguy90]

Well, it's a dsm . But man today went really bad.

I'm getting ready to pry off the pan so I will know if there is anything serious soon enough.

Well guys .

I found a huge peice of bearing in my oil pan, along with tons of metal shavings.

The freaking balance shaft bearing came out of place, the balance shaft, i think dug into the block. Idk if that can hurt it or not, cause i think the block would be stronger then the balance shaft.

I could move the balance shaft with my fingers.

The worst part is, cyl number 3 from the timing belt, the rod end has play in it, more then the others.... I think i'm going to remove the cap and see what's going on .

I'm pretty upset. Time for another game of rebuild.

And there it is....

I took the rod cap off, and I cant get the bearing to come out. It just sits on the crank and spins, it's like it's connected to the other bearing on the rod small end. But it looks damaged to. I was hoping to clean it and install, and tighten to correct torque and see if that would help. But i give up this engine is done.

 

[WeaselHack]

Yep...Balance shaft failed, lost oil pressure and spun a bearing...Its toast :-(

 

[g4ebguy90]

Man.... truly a sad day in my life.
My gf is so mad I bought this car. I've owned it for like a week.
Sigh.....
Im glad, i only traded a car i bought for 800 for this turbo eclipse.

 

[fourgsixthree33]

I just had a similar problem as I have rod knock. I have yet to pull the pan but I am currently looking for a short block. I'm sure it would be easier, cheaper, and quicker to just swap out a short block. I suggest you do the same. I have a new rebuilt head to go on it so you may need to find a long block or just find a new head.

Sucks you just got this car. With no job, it is going to be hard to fix your DSM's. But, thing's will look up.

 

[g4ebguy90]

I'm just worried about metal getting to the top end of the engine, So idk if the head is good either.
I assume it is but you never know, the block and oil pump are goners for sure though. I was thinking of using another shortblock and swapping a head over. dsmgraveyard is having a meet on the 23rd or 24th so I'll probaly go up there and find one.

 

[fourgsixthree33]

Just thoroughly check your head over and clean it up. Maybe take it to a machine shop. I would get new valves and stuff while you have it apart.

 

[kt239]

Wow that's a little worse then I thought it would be! Good luck with everything bro.

 

[g4ebguy90]

Just picked up a 6 bolt, and a rod knocking 420a. .

Went to Indiana to get it.

The 6 bolt, has new rods and pistons, * I checked myself * seemed alright. Balance shaft delete.
Only issue, is that camshafts are out, and no turbo. That's about it.

I got the 6 bolt and the 420a for $280 cash along with some other goodies. With gas and stuff it came to around $400. Im happy hopefully she runs well.

I'm just gonna swap my cams from my 6 bolt to this one.

The rods looked reconditoned with ARP bolts, and the pistons looked shiny brand new. So I hope this engine will at least run for a month.