What is the end all clutch fix 1g dsm ACT2600.

[90 GSX]

I have had nothing but problems since installing my ACT2600 a couple years ago. My car has always engaged near the floor but it was never a problem. After I put the ACT in, it was okay for a while, but it slowly got to a point where I could feel the clutch was dragging when I went into gear. Then eventually I couldn't shift.

I replaced the slave cylinder, brought out the master rod adjustment all the way, I got the pedal assembly welded. It was fine for a while then I started experiencing the same symptoms as before and eventually I couldn't shift.

Then I pulled the trans and put a couple washers under the pivot ball. It was fine for a while then it deteriorated again. I went under the car and the fork was broken into two pieces.

I then bought a new ball and fork from shep and put them in and it shifted great for about 1-2 months and now I'm back to the same position. I estimate in about 1 week if I keep driving it will become undriveable.

I can pull the trans and put the washers back under the pivot ball but it's just a bandaid again. How can I permanently fix this bloody clutch without going to a stocker? I even have the stupid braided line from the bracket on the tranny to the bracket on passenger side of the engine bay. Should i buy this techna-fit deal??? EXTREME PSI : Your #1 Source for In Stock Performance Parts - Techna-Fit Clutch Line : Mitsubishi Eclipse 90-94

 

[Calan]

Assuming the clutch, pressure plate, fork, and pivot ball are not worn and within spec, that leaves the following as the most likely culprits:

1. Clutch adjustment at the pedal
2. Improper bleeding, air getting in the lines, or bad fluid
3. Bad master cylinder
4. Leaking slave cylinder
5. Improper flywheel step height

Since your problem seems to be dynamic (ok for a while and then goes downhill), I would scratch off #1 and #5 and lean toward #2... which could also be related to #3 or #4. Since you replaced the slave already, that makes #2 or #3 more likely.

Here's what I would do:

1. Drain all the fluid and replace the master cylinder. It's not that expensive, it's fairly easy to do, and if it's 20 years old...it's worth it even if it isn't the actual cause of your problem.

2. While the lines are disconnected, blow some air through them to clean them out. Then cap them and make sure they hold pressure. Make sure to tighten them properly; use a flare wrench and don't over do it.

3. Replace the fluid with some new DOT3 brake fluid, and do a thorough job of bleeding the lines. Pick up a Mighty Vac hand bleeder for $40... it will save you a bunch of time and makes bleeding the clutch and brakes ridiculously easy.

4. Make sure the pivot arm is sitting about in the middle of the bell housing opening, and adjust the clutch pedal as required.

Don't use any pivot ball shims, slave extension rods, etc. As you already stated, they are just bandaids.

 

[BrokenTsi]

Ive had the exact same problems with the act2600. EXACT same.

Ive done all the things you've done but about 10 times since I've owned a DSM. I changed to a Quartmer Master setup and never looked back. Read the tech articles on jackstransmission's website and you will learn alot.

I went 10's on an act2600 with street disc. When it works, it works great. It happened to be working great that day, then after that it was a constant fight to get the clutch to stop dragging.

 

[las_vegaslazer]

This may not help you but is my 2 cents.I had problems with my 2900 and after 12 years of owning act and a dsm I switched to quartermaster twin. I will NEVER own a single disc clutch ever again! The quartermaster was the best mod I ever did on any of my dsm.

 

[90 GSX]

Interesting guys thanks for the good responses.

My fluid is probably clean but I will flush it anyway. There is no air in the lines, I do a pretty good job at bleeding and I always bleed it constantly until air free, clean fluid is coming out for a few strokes of the pedal.

The master is not leaking but I guess replacing it wouldn't hurt, but I'd rather not do it if it's not necessary.

Switching to a lighter pressure clutch seems like the permanent fix I'm looking for. The ACT is a great clutch though. I've been using it pretty agressively for over 30k miles and it rarely fades or slips, it has good manners and great launching power. The only problem is that the pressure plate fingers provide more force than the stock clutch system was engineered to provide.

I've never even heard of quarter master until right now. Are they reliable and long-lasting? Where is a good place to get one? This is for a daily driver. Would an exedy be a better choice?

 

[4pistons]

My car suffered from a soft pedal and difficult disengagement. I eventually found the pedal assembly bracket was broken after I removed it to install metal bushings.

This crack allowed the assembly to flex excessively whenever I pushed the pedal rather than it actuating the clutch. I had to pull the entire assembly out to find the crack though. It's awfully hard to squirm your head way up under the dash to see it.

Rick - '91 GSX

 

[las_vegaslazer]

Interesting guys thanks for the good responses.

My fluid is probably clean but I will flush it anyway. There is no air in the lines, I do a pretty good job at bleeding and I always bleed it constantly until air free, clean fluid is coming out for a few strokes of the pedal.

The master is not leaking but I guess replacing it wouldn't hurt, but I'd rather not do it if it's not necessary.

Switching to a lighter pressure clutch seems like the permanent fix I'm looking for. The ACT is a great clutch though. I've been using it pretty agressively for over 30k miles and it rarely fades or slips, it has good manners and great launching power. The only problem is that the pressure plate fingers provide more force than the stock clutch system was engineered to provide.

I've never even heard of quarter master until right now. Are they reliable and long-lasting? Where is a good place to get one? This is for a daily driver. Would an exedy be a better choice?

I ordered mine from shep. It was 1170 shipped for everything you need for install. The pedal pressure is stock like now that I am using the 2g slave acctuator. My quartermaster does have rough engagement as I am using the sintered iron discs. You can get organic full face discs for more slip for daily driving at the cost of the clutch not handling high heat and high power.

I weighted the quartermaster and an act pp, disc and fidanza flywheel and the quartermaster came in 2.3LBs less. I am not the smartest person on these boards but have owned a dsm for just over 12 years now. I have used a lot of parts and broke a lot of parts. I got this clutch after talking to shep at the shootout this year. I read a lot about the twin disc messing up tranys and still went with one. I have had it 6 months now and I can say I will never own a single disc ever again. Read these post with good info in them.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/new...seem-almost-same.html?highlight=quartermaster

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/dri...master-twin-disc.html?highlight=quartermaster

 

[BrokenTsi]

I was quoted 980 for everything from a vendor for the QM, TOB, and modified fork. It may come with a ring gear, im awaiting an email response.

Its not really supposed to be on a daily driver. The QM will improve shifting like you wouldnt believe, but the engagement is "grabby" and it makes a bit of noise when cruising. Not a huge deal to me. This clutch is easier on the synchros.

 

[red1993gsallmt]

Thank god im not the only one with the act2600 drag, change to a new flywheel and a sprung four puck and it still drags. And i defintly have enough travel with my new clutch assembly and two washers behind the pivot ball, i can hear the fingers of the pressure plate hit the disk springs when i max the adjustment out, so i will back it off a little and it still drags above 6k!!!!

 

[Morphius]

OP, was your problem solved?

 

[red1993gsallmt]

changed the clutch to a spec stage 2+, im gonna break it in and let u guys know if it fixed the problem. Even tho so many people have had problems with spec i cant seem to find a clutch thats flawless so im gonna give it a try, u guys think it will hold for mid 11s?

 

[BrokenTsi]

My buddy went 11.66 on that same clutch. It didnt fix his shifting problems, however, it was improved. Everything has to be perfect to prevent clutch drag at high rpms.

 

[red1993gsallmt]

i set up my act 2600 and street disk on my stock flywheel and rigged a way to disengage the clutch to take some clearance measurements. I found that it takes very little pedal travel to have the springs rub on the pressure plate, and the max clearance i could get without the springs being able to rub was between .035 and .040( thats with the disk against the flywheel and measureing the gap between the disk and pressure plate). Now i was told by another well known clutch companys engineer that they shoot for a min of .060 when designing a clutch. With that said i wont run a sprung disk with a 2600 again, an unsprung disk might be fine tho. That .035-.040 was with a very slightly worn disk and pressure plate and a recently turned flywheel from road race

 

[90moneypit]

I don't know if this is relevant to the OP's problem but it does seem to be a problem with a LOT of 1g's, worn clutch pedal bushings. It seems to be worse with the heavy ACT pressure plate but can happen with any clutch. The simple test seems to be to press the clutch to the floor, release, wait 5 seconds and try to lift up on the pedal from underneath. If there's travel then the bushing is worn and will need replaced. It's a major PITA but it's recommended for anyone with a 20 (or nearly so) year old car to check this. Think about all the ham fisted (footed?) people that have possibly driven the car and rode the clutch at stoplights or who think fast shifting requires you to stomp through the floor board and then jerk their knee straight up to release. That's an extreme example but is just as valid as high city mileage for wear purposes. The metal around the bushing gets oval shaped and only gets worse once it's started.

 

[Mock]

Alright, i would also like to get some opinions. I called my local machine shop (not going to say any names) to get some pricing on a possible built block. When i called and talked about the setup i was going to run. The Lady in sales kept trying to sell me a quartermaster twin plate clutch. Saying "don't listen to the forums, Crankwalk happens because clutches like ACT force more pressure on crank causing crankwalk. But if i was to go with a twin plated clutch i would never have to worry bout crankwalk". I was only looking to get a qoute on a block only build when i called.

 

[BrokenTsi]

Eh, its hard to say......

If it hasn't walked, I wouldnt worry about it. Since you're going to build a block anyways, just built a 6 bolt and you won't have to worry about anything.

Any engine will have crank wear or damage due to a heavy clutch. From personal experience, I tore down a completely good running 6 bolt engine to do a full build on. When I inspected the thrust bearing, the bearing was damanged, and the thrust main bearing cap was worn severely. I blame this on the act2900 that was on the car for thousands of miles from the previous owner. Car ran fine, drove fine, but the wear was excessive. It almost made the block unusable. The machine shop had to weld it, then resurface it to get it back into spec.

In any case, with any performance clutch, dont stand on the clutch at red lights, and pull it out of gear and coast to a stop using the breaks. Its easier to change pads/rotors then clutches/flywheels. This will cause excessive wear on your crank and strong clutches don't help the cause at all.

 

[red1993gsallmt]

spec clutches are really soft, just like stock. Im still amazed that my new spec holds the tourqe my hx40 stroker throws at it. They are great as long as you remember to break them in and install them right (goes with all clutches)

 

[RedEyeBanDiT]

NO NO NO

These are the only problems if your slave is good and clutch assembly;
Either your pressure plate is warped,
or
You DID NOT get your flywheel cut the right thousandths to match your new clutch and PP.

 

[red1993gsallmt]

or you use a 2600 with a sprung disk, 2600 was made to be used with a non sprung 6-puck thats why so many people have drag issues with street disk. i have one set up on my work bench now, the pp fingers hit the clutch disk springs before it can disengage far enough to not have a drag issue. And i set it up on a brand new act flywheel and a freshly cut flywheel from roadrace, same results on both flywheels

 

[lccynmbr13]

Put a shim behind the clutch ball. This needs to be done on every act install I don't know why they don't come with them. A turbo bolt washer is the perfect size, take the pivot ball out and put it back on with the washer. Problem solved.

 

[pur97tsifwd]

Watch these video from jacks trans they will help you on any questions you have on shimming your pivot ball as to when or why you should do it and also how to properly adjust your clutch.

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[Thruapole]

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Just wanted to throw this info up in case anyone needs any clutch parts from the dealer.

1 - Support, brake pedal, this is the bulk of the piece you remove to do bushings
2 - MB599167 - Bracket, right side of the piece you remove to do the bushings, n/t cars only refer to 21
3 - MB605790 - Clutch switch, the one near the floor for the starter, not for the cruise control
4 - MB599203 - Clutch pedal
5 - MB151298 - Stopper
6 - MB193884 - Pad
7 - MB012212 - Return spring (I only had this on brake pedal)
8 - MB534211 - Bushing, outermost on the left for clutch axle/shaft
9 - MB534210 - Bushing, these are for the brake pedal, 2 required
10 - Brake Pedal
11 - Brake Pedal rod
12 - MB058634 - Bushing, all the way to the right, smaller bushing on clutch shaft
13 - MF451107 - Washer, wave spring
14 - MB599871 - Lever n/t cars only, refer to 18
15 - MF450006 - Washer, plain 10mm
16 - MF450406 - Washer, spring, lock washer, 10mm
17 - MU430002 - Nut, 10mm
18 - MB599879 - Lever, turbo cars only
19 - MB534531 - Return spring, turbo cars only
20 - MB012205 - Bushing, return spring, turbo cars only
21 - MB534525 - Bracket, right side of the piece you remove to do the bushings, turbo cars only
22 - MB555171 - Bushing, lever to master cyl
23 - MB534533 - Clip, return spring, turbo only
24 - MF241251 - Bolt, M8x16
25 - MS240085 - Bolt w/ washer, M8x20, holds assy into car

I don't think the job is as bad as everyone made it sound, it took almost 3 hours to get apart, but I was in no rush. I hope its worth doing with brass bushings...

 

[92_6bolt_1290]

Does anyone else think that this issue should be noted?
I'm having the same problem with my ACT 2600 PP and a solid disk.
I have nothing against ACT clutches but for a car thats street driven it seems like they aren't the best option. Personally, I haven't looked into the QM setup but it sounds pretty awesome, otherwise I would just stick with all Fidanza or spec down there. I've been messing around with a friend's 91 Tsi awd with a Fidanza setup and the only thing it needs is a longer slave rod.

 

[Morphius]

I've been messing around with a friend's 91 Tsi awd with a Fidanza setup and the only thing it needs is a longer slave rod.

Why would it need a longer slave rod? The slave rod doesn't create longer throw. The hydraulic ratio between the slave and master cylinder do, in addition to the ratios between the clutch pedal and the master cylinder lever on the pedal cross shaft.

 

[92_6bolt_1290]

Why would it need a longer slave rod? The slave rod doesn't create longer throw. The hydraulic ratio between the slave and master cylinder do, in addition to the ratios between the clutch pedal and the master cylinder lever on the pedal cross shaft.

there is too much travel before the throwout bearing even touches the pressure plate so the clutch doesn't fully disenguage. I don't need the longer rod to increase the throw, i need it to move the base position of the throwout bearing closer to the pressure plate