trying to make a turbo decision, please help

[JiveMasterT]

ok, well, I am torn here between the AGP RS49T and the SBR-G50....

The problem here is that I was going to go with the AGP because of the warranty and the really good price, but the SBR-G50 looks like a better turbo. They are both comperable in price, so that is no big deal. I was going to go with an external wastegate, but that kinda setup is just too expensive and is something i will probably consider when i step up to a built motor and something like an FP 3052.

anyhow, I am trying to find out what people's opinions on the internal wastegate setup for both turbos.

Also, which is better in the long run? The 1 year no fault warranty or the garret center section? I hear that with turbonetics, it is hit or miss and since this is my daily driver i really cant afford to be taking turbos on and off all the time, but at the same time i dont want to install something and have it blow up on me and be out $700. please guys, help me out here... give opinions... this is like the hardest decision ive ever had to make with respects to my car.

 

[Hammer_Gaidin]

I'd go with the SBR turbo. The guys at SBR really know what they are doing and have always have great customer service. Plus the garrett center is a plus. And i think they're on special right now.(I might be wrong)

I'd also go with external wastegate...i recently finished my setup and i'm very happy having the external..and later if i decide to upgrade my turbo i dont have to pay an additional fee to get it internaly gated...plus less spool lag

 

[90blacktsiawd]

Just a thought but why dont you check out bullseye power's turbos? They are priced comparably to slowboy and you could get a turbo of similiar size to what you are looking at. Just giving you another option to check out.

 

[JiveMasterT]

Just a thought but why dont you check out bullseye power's turbos? They are priced comparably to slowboy and you could get a turbo of similiar size to what you are looking at. Just giving you another option to check out.

yeah i was looking at bullseye since the agp rs49t uses bullseye parts, but i dont like the internal wastegate setup, so i was like "ehhh" the sbr internal gate looks much better.

i would go with an external wastegate but the gate and the o2 housing is gonna be like $600... so i dont know. i mean, i know it's better but this is my daily driver, so im wondering how much i would really need that.

also, if i wanted to switch from an interal gate to an external off the o2 housing, what would be involved? ahh!!! so many options!!!

 

[90blacktsiawd]

I hear what your saying about the external setup. Im actually lookin at doing that now because i can't fit my fans on my radiator with the wastegate actuator in place. Here check it out http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=184261 . DSMotorsports has some really nice o2 housing by Shearer for an external setup. But its a month and a half wait if you want it rerouted back into the exhaust

 

[91-gsx]

about that turbo you have installed 90blacktsiawd, why does it not fit right i was thinking of getting a turbo later on but what just happened to you worries me. did you manifold move the turbo forward or something?
if anybody else might know tell me and what kind of turbo is that?
thanks

 

[90blacktsiawd]

Ya the manifold moved it down and forward a bit. 2 of the 4 lines dont reach. I'm trying to rotate the compressor housing to make it fit. I spent all afternoon porting my o2 housing because the wastegate hole isn't big enough and the flapper arm hit the housing when its only half way there. I don't think this is the norm for turbos like JiveMater is lookin at. Mine was put together from spare parts,

 

[sweet97]

ok, well, I am torn here between the AGP RS49T and the SBR-G50....

The problem here is that I was going to go with the AGP because of the warranty and the really good price, but the SBR-G50 looks like a better turbo. They are both comperable in price, so that is no big deal. I was going to go with an external wastegate, but that kinda setup is just too expensive and is something i will probably consider when i step up to a built motor and something like an FP 3052.

anyhow, I am trying to find out what people's opinions on the internal wastegate setup for both turbos.

Also, which is better in the long run? The 1 year no fault warranty or the garret center section? I hear that with turbonetics, it is hit or miss and since this is my daily driver i really cant afford to be taking turbos on and off all the time, but at the same time i dont want to install something and have it blow up on me and be out $700. please guys, help me out here... give opinions... this is like the hardest decision ive ever had to make with respects to my car.

If your speed mods are correct buy an EVO 16G. You need 650cc inj's and a big FMIC to run a 50 trim. I would have suggested the RS60T that I run. Amazing QUICK spool and lot of top end power. The INTERNAL wastegate by Bullseye only opens 1/2 way at best and will still hold 15 psi so internal is fine, no problems. 3"exhaust would help but I did not really look to see if you had that. If you were to go with the RS49T I would say go to the RS60T. I run 22PSI on pump and at 75% Injector Duty cycle. I have all the bolt ons, having just added comp cams 200's so now it is building my 6 bolt and then selling my smooth running motor from the '93 with 109k miles on it. Mark

 

[93jdmlaser]

I got my pte 50 trim from slowboy. Talk to nate over there. He was great and very helpful. I paid 800 for my not what was listed on the site. I was a great price and I had it weld for free for my external off the manifold. The pte has the one year warrenty too. If you look on the trader and classified you can usually find an exhaust manifold with a wastegate already on it. I picked my ported 2g with tial 35mm for 275 shipped and never creeped since. I dont trust internal gates but people are running them fine so its your call. If you can find a good deal used on the combo go for it.

 

[olmytsi]

I have the rs49t and i recommend it. I get full boost by 3900 and it is as streetable as a stock turbo However if you arent afraid to go bigger, get the rs60t as its the same price.

 

[JiveMasterT]

I have the rs49t and i recommend it. I get full boost by 3900 and it is as streetable as a stock turbo However if you arent afraid to go bigger, get the rs60t as its the same price.

did you get it internally gated or externally? was it as hard to setup as some people complained? did you have any shaft play?

 

[sweet97]

Jivemaster like I said I got the RS60T and it is a great turbo with surprisingly quick spool. Not hard to install and the AGP oil lines are the best, really beefy like the Bullseye turbine they use.
You just can't run a 50 trim or larger on a stock sidemount and will need 650cc injectors and some form of fuel control. I use the MAFT with an EPROM ECU and dsmchip. A Walbro/AFPR rounds out the fuel requirements. A Spearco 2-221 FMIC cools the charge.
Perhaps you have the required mods and have not updated your mod list. I tried an RS49 without the proper mods. Tried the dejontool street FMIC and could only boost to 13 psi due to excessive knock. I've had the EVO III 16G,RS49 and the RS60T. 3 sets of injectors, 2 full exhausts and 2 FMIC's. Do it right the first time as it's expensive! mark

 

[JiveMasterT]

Jivemaster like I said I got the RS60T and it is a great turbo with surprisingly quick spool. Not hard to install and the AGP oil lines are the best, really beefy like the Bullseye turbine they use.
You just can't run a 50 trim or larger on a stock sidemount and will need 650cc injectors and some form of fuel control. I use the MAFT with an EPROM ECU and dsmchip. A Walbro/AFPR rounds out the fuel requirements. A Spearco 2-221 FMIC cools the charge.
Perhaps you have the required mods and have not updated your mod list. I tried an RS49 without the proper mods. Tried the dejontool street FMIC and could only boost to 13 psi due to excessive knock. I've had the EVO III 16G,RS49 and the RS60T. 3 sets of injectors, 2 full exhausts and 2 FMIC's. Do it right the first time as it's expensive! mark

I'm going to be running a MAFT as well and using that to tune until I get the money for DSM link. Here is what is going to be going in before i even order the turbo...

Fuel:
Forced Performance 650cc injectors
Aeromotive w/ Install Kit
Walbro 255 Fuel Pump Kit
Joe P Boost Controller

Tuning:
1998 TransAm MAF
GM MAFT

Intercooler Stuff:
ETS 2G Intercooler Race Kit (7" Bar and Plate)
FP 4" Intake Pipe

after it is all installed in the car, then I'll put in the turbo. I'm still trying to figure out how to mount that intercooler to the t25 though because of the outlet for the turbo, but that is besides the fact.

sooooooooooooooo, those that reccomend the rs49t - how do you like the internal wastegate setup? that is the route i am thinking of going since im going to need to route the exhaust back into the downpipe anyway. basically, ive heard that the sbr / pte turbo's external gate is good and the agp internal gate really sucks and is hard to set up. can you folks offer your opinions on this? also, the sbr / pte 1 year warranty isnt no fault / no questions like the turbonetics / agp one is it? so many questions! ive been doing insane amounts of research and emailing companies.

 

[sweet97]

Just do the FMIC and turbo together. The ASGP actuator is different but not a problem. The wastegate is a Bullseye as that is the turbine housing used. It's a 38mm and has held as little as 15psi for me and now I run 20-22psi with no problems.Good Luck, mark

 

[bytheway]

I'm trying to make the same decision, except i was between the PTE SCM-50 and the RS49... I'm leaning more towards the SCM50 right now.. I just want something a little bigger then my 20g

 

[JiveMasterT]

Just do the FMIC and turbo together. The ASGP actuator is different but not a problem. The wastegate is a Bullseye as that is the turbine housing used. It's a 38mm and has held as little as 15psi for me and now I run 20-22psi with no problems.Good Luck, mark

thats what i was thinking of doing, but i want to do the ic at the same time i do the maft and injectors because i need to run the plumbing for the maft, so i dont know...

 

[olmytsi]

I went with an internal gate and like stated above, it works perfect. Ive got an o2 dump and i havent seen any creep yet. The setup is not a pain at all, its completely bolt on. The wastegate looks different and weird at first but its actually a decent design that leaves room on the passeger side. Dont get a pte as most failures i have heard were from there. Just to reassure some people, i took off my rs49t 2 weeks ago because i am doin a 6 bolt swap and the shaft is SOLID, the shaft does NOT move a bit so it isnt a bad turbo like some are claiming. I put about 2400 miles on it at 20 psi daily and even had it up to 23 on leaded fuel once.

 

[bob123131]

I Would go with sbr for sure i have heard some really bad stuff about the other company.

 

[JiveMasterT]

See that's the dilema i'm facing here. everyone posts when they have had a bad experience with a company or a turbo, but no one posts to say "yeah! it bolted right in! no problems!"

keep posting about the products themselves please. i dont care about the companies because they are both sponsors of the site (i think) and so im assuming that since i am a member of the site they will be willing to help with any customer service issues.... i just care about the differences in the turbos.

if i get an internally gated turbo and i decide to switch to an external down the road, how hard is it to swap it over? it would most likely be an external gate off the o2 housing...

 

[sweet97]

You can still do all the work at the same time. If you want easy gowith an 18G or 20G. Cost more for the 20G but I have a friend with a Buschur model and it rocks!!. the FMIC will be much harder than the turbo and the turbo is not that difficult. AGP is sticking by the no questions asked policy and it seems that things have settled down.
The 60-1 rocks too! Really it's just the fear of the unknown. I had some issues installing the 60-1 but nothing that could not be corrected and ben from AGP is a top notch customer service guy. Bullseye sells some nice turbo's also and David is also top notch for service.

 

[sweet97]

You will likely have to install slimlne fans, SIMPLE! Call Bulseye and get ahold of David and tell him you want to keep the stock fans and the power level you want. He can hook you up if anyone can. Mark

 

[JiveMasterT]

You will likely have to install slimlne fans, SIMPLE! Call Bulseye and get ahold of David and tell him you want to keep the stock fans and the power level you want. He can hook you up if anyone can. Mark

is this in regards to the external wg?

also another question about the external wg setup... what do i need to do to an internally gated turbo in order to make it work with an external setup?

 

[sweet97]

I use the internal wastegate and often the actuatior will interfere with the stock fans. External may also simply because the compressorhousing on the turbo's are so large they interfere with the fans. My friends 20G required slimlines though he ha a fluidineradiator which is thicker so external wouldnot need slimlines most likely.
All you need to do to an internal gate to go external is weld the flaper shut! then add the external parts.
1. the Bullseye internal gate works just fine.
2. AGP uses Bullseye housings with the internal gate that works so well.
Jive man what are your concerns? You seem to have many and I bet more than half are not real. Please list them so we can comment. What is making this such a difficult decision? My cams were my most difficult. mark

 

[JiveMasterT]

My concerns:
1. I have heard bad things about both companies and I wanted to hear some good things to smother those fears.
2. My understanding is that internally gated turbos are more likely to creep, so I wanted to go external, but an external setup is a whole lot of money and I dont know if it is really needed for my goals.
3. Later on down the road when I have the money I would like to look at going with an external wastegate but I don't want to spend money on a whole new turbo just to do this.

I dunno... I'm just about to drop a lot of money. I'm paranoid. Thanks to everyone who has looked and posted. Furthermore, thank you for not turning this thread into a giant argument.

 

[sweet97]

My AGP RS60T works fne with the internal gate. Allturbo manufacturers make duds at some time. Like I said earlier you just weld the flapper of an internal to go external.
There are some changes with oil coole only turbo's as most of these are. fans do often interfere. I bought a slimline at a local Advance auto and wired it to the stock harness. Easy. Easiest would be to stay with a Mitsu like a 20G but they are expensive though in the long run may be a break even proposition for you. Do youknow anyone near you who could help you? Mark