Rod bolt torque help, ARP 2000 bolts on eagle look a like rods?

[Talyn]

I have H beam rods that look almost identical to an eagle rod, they have ARP 2000 bolts on them. One of them spun a bearing and I bought a single eagle rod to replace it, I will use eagle's rod bolt torque spec for that one (43 ft lbs) however they claim that they use custom ARP bolts and not to use ARP's standard specs. That being said, should I use ARP's standard specs for the "ARP 2000"s on the other rods?(The Eagle's ARP bolts are stamped "Eagle 1.5 03 ARP 2000" And does anyone know what brand they are if not eagle? And if anyone knows the actual spec, please list it. Also any time I've bought ARP stuff in the past(flywheel bolts, main studs) it came with thread lube, I assume the ARP rod bolts should also be installed with it?

Edit: Some searching revealed that they might be scats, can anyone verify that scats are unmarked and look like eagles? their site says they use ARP 2000s, and they do look like the eagles. They are stamped 5900 mba on one side of the main section, E 245 on one cap side, and a matching 245 below that on the rod side, then on the opposite side of cap "XR"

 

[BogusSVO]

You have to be careful mixing rod brands, one rod may be several grams lighter.

You should have all 4 rods balanced.

Yes, Scat rods look a lot like Eagle rods with out the markings.

Post a pic or two of the rod in question

 

[Talyn]

Genuine Eagle on the left.

 

[Archer Fabrications]

You have to be careful mixing rod brands, one rod may be several grams lighter.

You should have all 4 rods balanced.

Yes, Scat rods look a lot like Eagle rods with out the markings.

Post a pic or two of the rod in question

Scat rods are made from the exact same metallurgical blank as an eagle rod.

 

[BogusSVO]

smoker, it is not the metal that is the issue. but the weight.

There can be 4 or more grams off overall weight or a couple of grams on the small end alone.

I have scaled replacement rods of the same brand and found then 4-5g off

 

[Talyn]

Well I found ARP's specs for their 2000 series rod bolts for our engine, and the spec is 40 lbs which is pretty close to the 43 for the genuine eagles, so I'm sure thats the correct spec. Although I don't have ARP lube, but I do have moly-graphite engine assembly lube-which I believe is pretty much the same stuff and should be an ok substitute?

 

[My1GLaser]

I have Manley rods in my motor and had to source and Eagle rod to replace one with a broken wrist pin. They were the only brand that had the same gram weight rods as the original Manleys in my motor. The closest Manley rod was 10 grams off!!!

 

[Archer Fabrications]

smoker, it is not the metal that is the issue. but the weight.

There can be 4 or more grams off overall weight or a couple of grams on the small end alone.

I have scaled replacement rods of the same brand and found then 4-5g off

Oh i know, i wasnt sayin they were forged the same way/place

 

[BogusSVO]

Oh i know, i wasnt sayin they were forged the same way/place

Honestly, it would not surprise me to find out the rod blanks were forged in the same foundry.

 

[Archer Fabrications]

Honestly, it would not surprise me to find out the rod blanks were forged in the same foundry.

I was refering to them being not the same forge press into the shape of the rod, not the material itself this time

I wouldnt doubt they use the same source to get both blanks.

 

[jakeachy]

eagle and manley both have their blanks made at the same chinese plant. both claim to have their own machined here in the states, which is likely not true.

 

[Archer Fabrications]

eagle and manley both have their blanks made at the same chinese plant. both claim to have their own machined here in the states, which is likely not true.

Source?

 

[My1GLaser]

They don't appear to be from the same blank at all! I have had both in my hand side by side. The Eagle is thicker, probably 1/8" or more and the small end has about 3/16" more support for the wrist pin. It even looks different along the sides. The edges of the "H" are thicker. I really wish I would have bought Eagle rods, I probably wouldn't have broken the wrist pin...I was a little hesitant to replace one rod in a set because of the differences, but the gram weights were identical and I figured that was more important than the brand being the same!

 

[JacksonAuto]

Similar? Yes. Identical? No. Both companies have the forgings produced in China and a majority of the rough machining is done there. They're then brought here to the US where the final machine work is performed. My source? The horse's mouth.

That said, to find the torque you can assemble the rod and start at 40 ft/lb with ARP lube on the threads and under the head. Using a bore gage, measure the ID of the housing bore checking for not only the dimension but also concentricity. If it's egg shaped then increase the torque in 2 ft/lb increments not to exceed 48-50 ft/lbs. You could use the bolt stretch method but you'd need to know the manufacturer of the rod to get the spec. To get you close, the range for most h-beam rods is .0050-.0055" stretch.

 

[jakeachy]

Source?

Similar? Yes. Identical? No. Both companies have the forgings produced in China and a majority of the rough machining is done there. They're then brought here to the US where the final machine work is performed. My source? The horse's mouth.

That said, to find the torque you can assemble the rod and start at 40 ft/lb with ARP lube on the threads and under the head. Using a bore gage, measure the ID of the housing bore checking for not only the dimension but also concentricity. If it's egg shaped then increase the torque in 2 ft/lb increments not to exceed 48-50 ft/lbs. You could use the bolt stretch method but you'd need to know the manufacturer of the rod to get the spec. To get you close, the range for most h-beam rods is .0050-.0055" stretch.

Both companies will openly tell you. In fact, I think there is some legality to that.