Results when the oil level is over filled?

[96gstdsm]

OK well I had asked this in my other thread pertaining to my 6 bolt swap and lots of blue smoke etc.
I got my oil changed today after about 100 miles on my break in for my new block and turbo. When I got home I noticed my exhaust was smoking alot. Blue smoke. I then popped the hood and I could see oil bubbling out between the exhaust manifold and the head. I wiped it down and checked again and it was definitely coming from there. Could see it oozing out from every bolt hole. Mostly the far most left and right sides of the exhaust manifold though. I jacked the car up and when running you could see oil just dripping off the car and to the ground. Now I didn't get so far as to really check to see if there were other leaks underneath the car, but looked as if there might be.
I later checked the oil level and it seemed to be very high. I replaced my dip stick some time back since it broke, and bought an oem replacement one. So I am assuming it measures the same.
On the receipt from the oil change it showed that they put in 4.7 quarts which is normal for an oil and filter change.
I checked the oil level and it is way over the second notch. It is about the same amount over the second notch as the second notch is from the first notch.

Could this be effecting my car negatively? Could this cause oil to get there and work it's way out the exhaust manifold? Would this cause the car to blow smoke out the exhaust pipe?

 

[boostnhard]

It will definetly cause a whole lot of blue smoke. As far as damaging the engine i doubt it, someone clarify this please.

 

[96gstdsm]

Could it cause oil to leak out the exhaust manifold gasket area? I would think those two things would be connected. Also could the excess pressure from the added oil cause problems with the piston rings since they only have around 150 miles on the rebuild?

 

[oimirageio]

Its not going to blow your engine if thats what your asking but it is going to make you car run like ........
Just let the car cool down, go get one of those 5$ walmart oil catch pans and dump some of the oil out. If that is not an option take it back and have them dump the extra oil for you and complain so you get another oil change free next time ....

If not its going to keep burning the excess oil off and you car is going to smoke and smell like .

 

[Simpleman1]

I heard that bubbles or cavitation in the oil may affect the lubrication of vital parts (bearings, etc.). I don't know if this is true.

You could also have a valve seals problem, which I've experienced before my rebuild. It may not be related to extra oil you have in your engine.

 

[96gstdsm]

Its not going to blow your engine if thats what your asking but it is going to make you car run like ........
Just let the car cool down, go get one of those 5$ walmart oil catch pans and dump some of the oil out. If that is not an option take it back and have them dump the extra oil for you and complain so you get another oil change free next time ....

If not its going to keep burning the excess oil off and you car is going to smoke and smell like .

Ok so I am hoping that will explain the whole smoking out the exhaust, but how about the oil leaking around the exhaust manifold? Would that most likely be related? Don't know how or why there would be oil leaking from there. Could the high oil levels force oil up and out there somehow?

 

[PieEyedPiper]

I'd imagine thats possible. But drain that oil ASAP.
If 4.3L is full (I'm in the ball park right?), and that takes you to just below the top mark, but since you're way over the top mark you have almost twice as much oil as you should. At least if you go by my terribley inaccurate measurements.

Bottom line is you have way too much oil in there and it could be damaging seals or worse.
Start doing your own oil changes

 

[96gstdsm]

I'd imagine thats possible. But drain that oil ASAP.
If 4.3L is full (I'm in the ball park right?), and that takes you to just below the top mark, but since you're way over the top mark you have almost twice as much oil as you should. At least if you go by my terribley inaccurate measurements.

Bottom line is you have way too much oil in there and it could be damaging seals or worse.
Start doing your own oil changes

Yeah I know doing my oil changes is good. Was just in a hurry kinda before work, and also got a free car wash(which they managed to also take off my side skirt corner piece)
Don't think I will be trusty many places with my car anymore.
Hopefully draining the excess oil will stop the terrible smoking and oil spurting.
If not back to the drawing board.

 

[t25fury]

as mentioned before, just drain the extra oil and you should be ok, it may smoke for a bit while the oil burns off of any exhaust parts.The bubling you saw was the hot exhaust making the oil burn and boil,it may have shot out of your dip stick and on to your manifold.Overfilling the engine with oil can also cause ariation,or frothing of the oil by the crank and can lead to bearing failure.

 

[Ho0ked]

Hey there, here is what I think may be going on, several possabilities....

1) Your oil is over full

2) your reading the dipstick wrong (it does happen)

3) Your head is not properly torqued to spec, did you say this was a recent 6bolt swap?

Yes its possible the oil change place over filled you, but not likely, are you wiping the dipstick, then re-inserting it then pulling and checking it a second time ?

Pop your valve cover and check head stud torque
Clean that oil off, it can start a fire (don't ask me how I know that)
If your dipstick blows out theres a really nice, simple fix, throttle spring from advance auto parts help section + tiny hose clamp= spring loaded latch for the dipstick.
looks good, works fantastic


Just be sure your oil really is over full before you dump any.

 

[96gstdsm]

Hey yeah I checked many times and it is overfull. I checked today and it is not as overfilled as it originally looked. Might have been on a slight slant or something. But still non the less overfilled. It does not seem like the amount it is overfilled would cause what is happening. It is smoking pretty bad today out the exhaust and from the engine bay where it is leaking oil on both sides of the exhaust manifold. Yes it is a fresh 6 bolt block swap. Only like 150 miles since it was installed. Also new turbo and pump was installed. The oil is with out a doubt coming from the exhaust manifold and head connection. That has to be connected to the smoke out the exhaust. The smoke is definitely blue. The turbo I installed was brand new. I took the intake off and no oil was in there and there is zero shaft play.

 

[Ho0ked]

Sounds like something is not torqued properly.

I'd check your head studs, if the head is leaking you will get oil in your combustion, causing smoke. and the oil around the exhaust manifold is also related to that. Plus u could also get coolant leaks in the combustion chamber.

What kind of head gasket did you use? what spec did you torque the head to?
Some head gaskets require heat cycling and re-torquing.

Let us know.

 

[olmytsi]

I agree with the post above. I have overfilled my engine many times and it has never smoked or leaked like that. Sounds more like leaky valves seal.

 

[forcefed 95]

Over fillin your engine with oil will casue major damage like bearings to seize up. This is casue caseu the crankshaft spinning around turns the oil to a film and casues the bearings to kinda be washed from thier oily state. See oil fills a tiny gap between the bearing and the crankshaft or connection rod and thats what the bearings kinda ride on if you will. Well when it starts to foam you take that away and loose all lubraction between the two. So you over fillin your engine with oil is very bad and highly not recomended thats why there is service manuals to give you fluid capacities.

joe

 

[96gstdsm]

Ok I will have to check the torque on the bolts, and head studs.
As for the oil change I did not do the change. Brought somewhere since I was real busy and got a free car wash. They wrote down that they gave me 4.7 quarts, but definitely seems like more. I checked again and the level does not seem as high(###### cause it's leaking from somewhere).

So I am thinking that it is probably does not have anything to do with the oil level. What all could cause oil to get into the exhaust manifold and seep out?

Oh and also what is a standard price for a shop to charge to do a compression test? They have it there and might as well have them do when when their checking everything else out, but they want like 70 bucks. Seems pretty high.

 

[olmytsi]

Bad Valve seals and the like will cause oil to go into your exhaust manifold.

 

[pnishr]

It doesn't sound like he's saying oil is going INTO the exhause manifold, rather that it's leaking between the head and exhaust manifold... which isn't all that unusual or unexplainable. several (if not all - trying to think since I JUST replaced mine) Studs that hold your Ex. Manifold on are threaded INTO oil galleys in the head. So, being overful, having excessive pressure in their too, might squeeze some of that oil down the threads of the studs. Make sure they're all torqued into the head well.

check it out.

 

[96gstdsm]

Yeah I was thinking it could be that bolt into the oil galley. The only one that is bolted into the head is the lower middle one correct? Most of the oil seems to be coming from the right and left upper side of the exhaust manifold. There is also an air leak there obviously, so when driving it gets pretty loud and starts kinda hissing/grinding noise. Ticking when moving slower.
I got it compression tested and it came with cylinder #1-150 #2-165, #3-155, #4-155
Also they dye tested the oil and could see it was indeed coming from the exhaust manifold.

Does it seem like with those numbers it could be rings or head gasket?
How do those numbers seem or a freshly rebuilt block? (1g rods 2g pistons)
Would those numbers go up more during the break in time?

I just picked my car up and took it for a quick drive home. I wound it up gently into boost then gave it a quick punch. I did not notice any bogging, hesitation, or anything like that. If it were rings I would think it would bogging down a bit.

What are the odds of the turbo seals being bad on a brand new turbo(extremepsi big16g)
and leaking oil back up into the exhaust manifold? Would it boost fine, even if leaking oil? I took the intake off and inspected and no oil there and zero shaft play.

It also seems really unlikely that the valve guide seals would be bad all of a sudden. This is my stock 2g head and I had no problems with it prior to the 6 bolt block swap. Now after 120 miles or so all of a sudden starts leaking bad and billowing smoke out the exhaust.

 

[MelloEclipse]

It also seems really unlikely that the valve guide seals would be bad all of a sudden. This is my stock 2g head and I had no problems with it prior to the 6 bolt block swap. Now after 120 miles or so all of a sudden starts leaking bad and billowing smoke out the exhaust.

are you kidding me, it's a DSM...ALL kinds of things are going to happen 'all of a sudden'

 

[96gstdsm]

are you kidding me, it's a DSM...ALL kinds of things are going to happen 'all of a sudden'

Yes well I know it is possible, but the odds don't seem very high. Even thought there are a lot of miles on the stock 2g head, for it to go as soon as I get a 6 bolt block installed, within 100 miles of getting it back, for it to be the valve seals, and not something to do with the swap, just seems not very likely to me.

Dsm's are not really unreliable, just comes down to how it is maintained. If everything is kept up to date, tuned if necessary, shouldn't be too many unexpected problems.

 

[nightspeed87]

Id imagen filling with too much oil could cause the same effect as having too high of oil pressure in a way. Your probably more likely to blow out seals, gaskets than anything...
Could even strain your oil pump somehow depending on how much its over filled...
Now to add in, its ok to over fill your oil slightly higher than the top dipstick line especially on lower oil pressure engines but thats only to a certain extent.

 

[Black91TSiAWD]

A bad valve cover gasket can cause oil to leak down the front side of the head, onto and around every exhaust stud and appear to be coming from there. Its worth a shot, thats what mine is doing right now.

 

[boostnbuds]

i dont think u have bad rings or anything, what does happen is u experience and increase in oil pressure wich will cause things to leak I.E. your exhause studs. also when the oil level is that much over....seems like a quart or so by your description, your crank shaft is slapping around in the oil causing the frothing condition we've heard about, but also the oil will have a tendency to creep up the cylinder walls and begin burning, what happens if u let it go to long is it destroys o2 sensors and cat converters. as long as you werent running it too long i dont think u will expirience any permanant damage.


allso your compression readings are good. check the pcv system.

 

[red_devil]

You will notice the car run bad if it has too much oil in it. Running too much can damge seals. In most oil change stations for some reason they have that a 4G63 holds between 4.5/4.9 qts. I dont know where they get there info from but 4.3qts is what it takes. Being.4 of a qt over full will not damage anything. When the car has 4.7qts in it it will read abnormally high like it is doing.

Kinda off topic...but a women came into our shop the other day complaning that her car was running bad after she changed the oil. She had attempted to fill her engine up all the way until it was full at the filler cap she had used around 15qts in a little 1.8 camry motor that takes 4qts.

 

[96gstdsm]

i dont think u have bad rings or anything, what does happen is u experience and increase in oil pressure wich will cause things to leak I.E. your exhause studs. also when the oil level is that much over....seems like a quart or so by your description, your crank shaft is slapping around in the oil causing the frothing condition we've heard about, but also the oil will have a tendency to creep up the cylinder walls and begin burning, what happens if u let it go to long is it destroys o2 sensors and cat converters. as long as you werent running it too long i dont think u will expirience any permanant damage.


allso your compression readings are good. check the pcv system.

OK, how much overfilled of oil would it take for the oil to leak out the exhaust manifold bolt? Only 1 is bolted into the head and in contact with oil right? It is really smoking a ton now. Much more than before. The oil in the engine is worst on both sides of the exhaust manifold. I can tell the seal is not good since I can hear an exhaust leak there also. Could it really effect the car this much from being over filled with oil? As I posted in an earlier post, the oil level was not quite as high as I initially thought. Was on a slight hill, checked again and was still high but about have the distance less over the full line.

I am just trying to decide wether or not to get it towed(for free) down to south jersey to have it looked at by the guys who installed it for me. Obviously they messed up a little since at the very least there is an exhaust leak by the exhaust manifold. There is no easy way to narrow it down to anything else right? Is it possibly dangerious to be driving it at all thinking it might be either valve guide seals, turbo or whatver else it might be? I mean I am not going to be daily driing it now but like to a shop or something like that.