Rear ended, totalled?

[shanebro]

Was rear ended yesterday by an old fogie in a dodge caravan. Already took it up to one body shop and they said it was totaled. Car still drives fine, no dog tracking etc. Car blue books for 3600 dealer. Eagle Talon TSi AWD lsd in the rear, all options. Not even a check engine light.

This is what i've fixed on it so far.
Clutch.
Pressure plate.
Throwout bearing.
Driver wheel bearings.
Driver tie rod.
Pads and rotors.
Air filter.
Starter.
Intermediate shaft to transmission seal.
Tires 16 inch premium all weather.
Plug Wires
Fuel Pressure Regulator.

We both have state farm insurance. I'm kind of lost at this point and don't have much of a game plan. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks for your time.

 

[SmalltownDSMer]

Damn, That's shitty to see. Car looked pretty clean. So what's the plan? Getting the little bit of cash they will give you for it, Or try to fix her back up? Whatever you choose, Good luck.

Jayson

 

[2GbTalonGuy]

It doesn't look too bad. May take a bit of pulling but I think it can be fixed relatively easily.

 

[nickk90]

If it is totaled dont let them give you blue book. These cars sell for more than blue book. Try finding ads for cars as clean as yours if you can find them (might have a hard time) and tell the insurance company you wont take a penny less.
You dont have to take what they offer, you can argue until your happy with what they are going to give you.

 

[phunny]

If it is totaled dont let them give you blue book. These cars sell for more than blue book. Try finding ads for cars as clean as yours if yours if you can find them (might have a hard time) and tell the insurance company you wont take a penny less.
You dont have to take what they offer, you can argue until your happy with what they are going to give you.

^^ This is great advice that most people don't even realize. But yes, that car is going to be totaled so even if you repair it you'll never get anything if you sell.

 

[ramsack]

It's going to be totaled. The whole quarter panel is destroyed. I doubt they can even get the quarter panel from the dealer anymore. Even if new parts exist anymore, the car is so old that they will force you to let them use used parts on the car. The only way to not total the car is to decline coverage and fix it with your own money.

 

[ramsack]

If it is totaled dont let them give you blue book. These cars sell for more than blue book. Try finding ads for cars as clean as yours if yours if you can find them (might have a hard time) and tell the insurance company you wont take a penny less.
You dont have to take what they offer, you can argue until your happy with what they are going to give you.

Who cares how much they sell for? They don't use blue books to value cars, they use a private system. They could care less that you paid more for your car than it's worth. It's your problem that you think these cars have some intrinsic value. Rarity only matters to enthusiasts.

 

[nickk90]

Who cares how much they sell for? They don't use blue books to value cars, they use a private system. They could care less that you paid more for your car than it's worth. It's your problem that you think these cars have some intrinsic value. Rarity only matters to enthusiasts.

Its called fair market value. They have to give you what it would take to replace the car. I'm not talking out of my ass either my last car was totaled and I ended up coming out ahead.

Also on your last post. Any time you get your car repaired they are going to try to find salvage parts before they buy a replacement from the dealer. The only time they are going to put a replacement part is if a salvage part is not available.

 

[importracr317]

Who cares how much they sell for? They don't use blue books to value cars, they use a private system. They could care less that you paid more for your car than it's worth. It's your problem that you think these cars have some intrinsic value. Rarity only matters to enthusiasts.

100% correct. You'll see a lot of advice on car forums telling you to "not accept the insurance company's offer", "demand more", etc, etc, but it doesn't work that way. They'll offer you fair value for your car, which is probably below KBB and that's it. Fight all you want, that number probably isn't coming up.

I'd take the check and see if you can buy the car back or find out what junkyard they're taking it to and try to buy it from the yard.

 

[silicosys4]

Who cares how much they sell for? They don't use blue books to value cars, they use a private system. They could care less that you paid more for your car than it's worth. It's your problem that you think these cars have some intrinsic value. Rarity only matters to enthusiasts.

In my experience, you are wrong. Every situation I've seen involving an auto insurance settlement has been to the effect that the insurance company is required to give you the current market equivalent of your vehicle. That means that if clean 1g dsm's are selling for above "kelly's blue book" or "NADA" estimates, or whatever proprietary "private system" they use, then the system is undervaluing the cars, and actual replacement value is higher. The pricing systems are just a general starting point of valuation; particularly since they are an unregulated private system, therefore subject to bias, and can't be proven to be accurately adjusting for fluctuations in the market, which everybody knows exists for particular desire-able models of cars. In my state, The insurance company is required to give you the amount of money it would cost to replace your totaled vehicle with an identical one of the same model, year, and condition. Not what the car is worth five years ago, or what they car might be worth in five years. What the cost to replace the car is TODAY. This is where you will be scouring the classifieds for ads to show them really clean cars that are as high-priced as you can, while they will be countering with the crappiest vehicles they can find for cheap. Eventually you'll have to convince them they are full of B.S. and your car was no beater, but since your car looks like it was clean, and you have pictures of how clean it was, It shouldn't be an issue. Concurrently, a lot of insurance companies are being more proactive in researching the market when pricing their policies.

 

[ramsack]

They could care less what you paid for your car or what enthusiasts think they're worth.

 

[importracr317]

Its called fair market value. They have to give you what it would take to replace the car.

Also correct, but an insurance company's measure of FMV isn't the same as the asking price on Craigslist. 9 out of 10 times, the insuance company will be considerably lower.

 

[ramsack]

Insurance is a business, and it's not to make you happy. Remember, you're REQUIRED to have insurance. It's not a business with much competition. They aren't going to throw away their own money because of your dumb ass paying more for a car than it's worth. They have a value for your car and that is it. They know how many cars, down to the exact one, exist. They don't care how many are on the market, they only care about how many currently exist. If you are an enthusiast and you want your car to be valued at a market value, there are special insurance companies for that.

 

[nickk90]

They could care less what you paid for your car or what enthusiasts think they're worth.

It has nothing to do with what you think it is worth. It is how much it would cost to replace the car. And these cars sell for more than valued. Read your policy it will say in event of a total loss you will be given fair market value of the car.
Fair market value is what the car sells for at the time. Not what a book says its worth.

 

[chadillac2820]

IMO, you should let them total it, buy it back and strip it down, then move on.

 

[ramsack]

Which is why there is a book value... It's a general guideline for everyone to follow. It's not their fault that there is a small niche market (enthusiasts) that thinks a certain asset holds an extra intrinsic value.

 

[nickk90]

Also correct, but an insurance company's measure of FMV isn't the same as the asking price on Craigslist. 9 out of 10 times, the insuance company will be considerably lower.

Exactly so you print of the ads for the cars you find on craigslist and they will be required to give you an average of the prices they are asking.

 

[ramsack]

They're not required to do anything. There are no laws that dictate that they pay you any market value. As I've said before, if you want your car to be valued at some niche market value because you think it's special, then get special insurance that is marketed specifically for antiques and classics.

 

[nickk90]

Which is why there is a book value... It's a general guideline for everyone to follow. It's not their fault that there is a small niche market (enthusiasts) that thinks a certain asset holds an extra intrinsic value.

It has nothing to do with just DSMs. It could be a Honda witch all seem to sell over KBB. If you want call a lawyer and ask them what a insurance company is required to give you in the event of a total loss and they will tell you exactly what I am saying now.

 

[ramsack]

You're full of absolute shit. They aren't required to do anything that you didn't sign for them to do. I'm sure you're a special case and read every word of the contract they gave you to sign I guess a bank is also required to appraise a car loan for market value instead of book, as well

 

[silicosys4]

You're full of absolute shit. They aren't required to do anything that you didn't sign for them to do. I'm sure you're a special case and read every word of the contract they gave you to sign I guess a bank is also required to appraise a car loan for market value instead of book, as well

You need to STFU. Have you had a car totaled out from under you and had to go through the process of being compensated? I have. You get what it costs to replace the car, with an identical one, however much that would be. The work of proving that your car sells for more than what the insurance company wants to give is up to you. If it would cost you more to replace your DSM with an equally clean identical model with the same mileage than KBB or the insurance company says, you print out a bunch of ads and throw it in their face. You don't have to accept the first offer that they throw out.

 

[nickk90]

You're full of absolute shit. They aren't required to do anything that you didn't sign for them to do. I'm sure you're a special case and read every word of the contract they gave you to sign I guess a bank is also required to appraise a car loan for market value instead of book, as well

Well I actually have gone thru I-Car courses for collision repair and part of that cover insurance coverages and requirements. Im not just saying random things.
They must give you FMV for a total loss. FMV has nothing to do with your choice to pay more than book value or thinking it is worth more than what they are wanting you offer. It is what the car actually is worth because its how much the cost.

I have also delt with 2 total losses like this and have always came out with a few more grand than they offered me form the start.

 

[ramsack]

^ Full of shit, you both "STFU". I've had my insurance company not even defend me in my behalf on filing a claim towards someone who backed into me. They don't care about you. THEY ARE NOT REQUIRED TO DO ANYTHING OUTSIDE OF WHAT YOU SIGN ON THE CONTRACT. You can research your fair market value all day and waste your time with legal fees. They don't have to give you anything more than at what they value your car. How many people even read what you sign? 99.9999% of the people out there just page through and sign wherever it's marked to sign.

 

[jcart953]

IMO, you should let them total it, buy it back and strip it down, then move on.

^ I agree. I think this is your best option.

 

[silicosys4]

I guess a bank is also required to appraise a car loan for market value instead of book, as well

The DMV in certain states requires you to pay higher taxes on certain vehicles they ascertain as being "collector" vehicles no matter what their condition. Try registering a GMC typhoon in Washington state. They want $900 in state taxes no matter WHAT you paid for the vehicle, no matter what the condition. They want taxes for the $10,000 in collectors value they automatically put on it right off the top, and a GMC typhoon doesn't even book at $10k unless its damn near perfect! (The typhoon notoriously books for much lower than it actually sells for.) This is because the DMV recognizes that in many cases actual market value often exceeds book value. Banks also use appraisers for the same reason. So yes, market value as opposed to book value does exist in the financial world. Please don't be abusive to people who know something about how these things work. I'm sorry if you suck at holding your ground and standing up for your rights with your insurance company, but please don't let your bitterness and anger at your own situation prevent others from helping the OP have a better experience than yourself.

Now if the average market value of the car were BELOW what the OP were trying to get out of his car, or if the OP had paid way too much in cash for his car and were trying to get what he paid back, then he'd be S.O.L, because the insurance company's not going to pay over what it would cost to replace the car. They will also be hard pressed to pay for any aftermarket mods unless ALL receipts for parts, services, warranties, etc.. could be provided.

OP, find the most equivalent cars for sale in your area, and start saving those ads. Same mileage, same year, same options, same model, same paint even if you can find them. Whatever the equivalent cars are selling for in your area is, that's what you can expect your payout to be.
After all is said and done, if you stand your ground and get a good price for your car, and you can buy it back for cheap then part it out or keep it for parts, this could be financially a good thing for you. At the expense of a nice, clean 1g though... :-(