Question on dash speakers

[Dsmj89]

I couldn't exactly find the answer to my question elsewhere so i will ask here.
My question is, since i ordered today a new cd player, it came with a booklet that explains how to change speakers and a cd player on a 2g.
Now when turning the page i saw a guide on how to change our dash speakers, but the diagram showed we have them under the dash panels ? I don't know if the diagram is wrong but i always thought we had them on the top part of the dash close to the windshield. The diagram pictures these speakers to be behind the lower dash vents inside.
Anyone know if this is true ? I am looking to check this out tomorrow.

 

[chico904]

The book is wrong. They are on our dashboard in opposite corners. Just use a screwdriver, put it under the edge of the speaker grille, and pop up. They are connected by a single connector.

 

[Dsmj89]

Thanks for clearing that up, i thought it was that way also.

 

[RedTurboEclipse]

lets bet after you install that new deck your dash speakers wont be working anyways

unless you search and see all my replies regarding this very issue

if you need help when you find they dont work just reply.

 

[Dsmj89]

Hehe, do you mind sharing here what happens ?

 

[RedTurboEclipse]

yea since you have a gst 99.9% chance you have the infinity sound option. which means you have a stock amp under your passenger seat.

think of the stock speaker setup in the front as components. mid bass in the doors, highs in the dash. components have passive xover sincluded in them. in the stock seutp case, they are BUILT IN to the stock amp. now when you remove the stock deck, the 6-pin proprietary wiring is removed also, and you see this leads to the stock amp.

think of this wire like a 4 channel rca output signal for the deck, and since that is removed, the stock amp no longer has an input signal which means no more sound for the built in xover to split between the dash and door speakers.

however you will ask then why will the speakers still work if i install an aftermarket?

its because they are wired in parallel. because the lowly N/T and base model people need sound too. but you will notice your dash speakers no longer work, because of what i just mentioned above.

what you can do is wire them together but then the dash speakers will get the same frequencies and might/usually blow.

the right way is getting bassblocker, or getting xovers, or the best way getting a set of components.

 

[Captainredeyez]

Excellent explaination redturboeclipse, I went got a set of components for my 2G and they work fine.

 

[Dsmj89]

yea since you have a gst 99.9% chance you have the infinity sound option. which means you have a stock amp under your passenger seat.

think of the stock speaker setup in the front as components. mid bass in the doors, highs in the dash. components have passive xover sincluded in them. in the stock seutp case, they are BUILT IN to the stock amp. now when you remove the stock deck, the 6-pin proprietary wiring is removed also, and you see this leads to the stock amp.

think of this wire like a 4 channel rca output signal for the deck, and since that is removed, the stock amp no longer has an input signal which means no more sound for the built in xover to split between the dash and door speakers.

however you will ask then why will the speakers still work if i install an aftermarket?

its because they are wired in parallel. because the lowly N/T and base model people need sound too. but you will notice your dash speakers no longer work, because of what i just mentioned above.

what you can do is wire them together but then the dash speakers will get the same frequencies and might/usually blow.

the right way is getting bassblocker, or getting xovers, or the best way getting a set of components.

Thanks for that great explanation. I won't even bother replacing them then.

 

[kenamond]

yea since you have a gst 99.9% chance you have the infinity sound option. which means you have a stock amp under your passenger seat.

think of the stock speaker setup in the front as components. mid bass in the doors, highs in the dash. components have passive xover sincluded in them. in the stock seutp case, they are BUILT IN to the stock amp. now when you remove the stock deck, the 6-pin proprietary wiring is removed also, and you see this leads to the stock amp.

think of this wire like a 4 channel rca output signal for the deck, and since that is removed, the stock amp no longer has an input signal which means no more sound for the built in xover to split between the dash and door speakers.

however you will ask then why will the speakers still work if i install an aftermarket?

its because they are wired in parallel. because the lowly N/T and base model people need sound too. but you will notice your dash speakers no longer work, because of what i just mentioned above.

what you can do is wire them together but then the dash speakers will get the same frequencies and might/usually blow.

the right way is getting bassblocker, or getting xovers, or the best way getting a set of components.

Hahahhaha. When I ordered my Talon from the factory 13 years ago, I knew I was gonna immediately upgrade the sound. So I only ordered the basic 6-speaker setup with the cassette deck. I always wondered about the tweets in the dash. I had very little treble up front. All the other speakers were replaced (MBQuart 6.5" midbass in the doors and MBQuart 6x9s in the rear and a sub box (2x10") in the back). I still have some BA tweets that I never installed (13 year old but still in the box ). I had a harness adapter, and figured out which wires went to the doors and tweets and connected the speaker wire from the new amps in the trunk into those through the adapter (so I didn't cut anything stock). I always wondered if the doors and tweets might be in parallel with higher ohms and that was resulting in less going to the tweets.

So is there a "proper" way to wire the aftermarket door speakers with the stock dash tweets? I haven't had to touch that wiring in 13 years, so I forget all of the details behind the head unit, and I think I'd have to break something to get the center console cover back off (the stock cubby hole under the head unit had to be forced to get it to fit under the lip of the Alpine head unit I added, so I haven't tried pulling the head unit out since I put it in). I think that I can get at all of the speaker wiring from behind the head unit (in through the sides by your feet).

 

[Dsmj89]

Would replacing the dash speakers with tweeters work out better ?

 

[RedTurboEclipse]

with components, or if just happen to get a hold of any xovers and want to wire it up the "proper way".. like stock setup.

assuming you already changed the deck.

this goes for if you are having the deck power the speakers or have an aftermarket amp.

when you remove the stock amp, the harness down there that plugs in to it, this has ALL the leads to all the speakers in the car, dash, doors, rear. obviously, like i said think of this stock amp as a 4 channel amp with xovers built in there.

the wiring diagram for it can be found through a search, in a rush, but ill find it later if you cannot.

i usually just cut the harness because i know ill never use the stock amp again, and just cap the rest.

the xover will be located here and wired accordingly. the input on the xover is connected to either your aftermarket amp (if thats what is going to power the speakers), or the deck's speaker output wire, then the rest is obvious. midbass wire from xover you wire in with the door speaker wires from this harness under the seat, and the tweeter/high wire from the xover would be the dash speaker wiring in the harness.

now all you have to do is replace the door speakers with the midbass you got from the component set

and the dash speakers just put the tweeters in there and voila

now for the rear speakers, since those really aren't anything special you can simply wire those from behind the stereo up front.

however yes speaker leads to the rear are also in that very harness under the seat (again think stock amp was 4 channel and powered those as well). it is not necessary to wire them up here when the convenient wiring is up by the stereo's original harness. however this is a convenient acesss point if you are running an aftermarket amp to also power the rear speaker and have it under the seat here. no need to runt he wire to the rear speakers or to behind the stereo.

 

[Dsmj89]

For now i have pioneer 6.5's front and 6x9 rears and the stock amp is still under the seat. Would you recommend for the time being to disconnect my stock amp and let the built-in amp on the receiver power my speakers ? Or should i connect the stock amp ? Would it matter that both amps are powering my speakers ?

 

[RedTurboEclipse]

oh i forgot to say, once you remove the stock deck, your stock amp is already disabled. so if you upgraded your deck, your deck is already powering the speakers.

and you can confirm this if your dash speakers are no longer working at the moment.

the only way you can still have the stock amp power the speakers WITH aftermarket deck is to purchase the MITAH adapter install kit.

also for optimal setup of this, you need to have a deck that has a 4channel rca output front and rear pair. the MITAH adapter will convert those 4 channel rcas to the proprietary din cable that connects to the stock amp along with a remote turn on wire..

now you know why i said to think of the stock amp like a 4 channel amp, getting the MITAH adapter illustrates this perfectly.

with the MITAH adapter you really only have to connect 3 or 4 wires, power, ground, memory, and remote turn on wire. probably antenna wire if you have power antenna. but you DO NOT have to wire up the speaker leads from the deck because again you are using the stock amp to power the speakers and the rca outputs are to only be used because the stock amp already has the speakers connected to it---------- remember that harness connected to teh stock amp, now you know why it has leads to all the speakers and why its convenient when installing and tapping any aftermarket audio to this area.

as for connecting them together,, i did not want to risk doing that haha

as for which sounds better.. this was really a difficult choice because your ears play games with you. here is why..

if you chose to just have the deck power the speakers without proper wiring/components to make the dash speakers work.. meaning just straight stereo harness to car harness install.. it will SEEM to sound worse because you just lost 2 extra speakers up high which provide highs and for a better soundstage. you will notice that the rear seems more powerful..

now if you get the MITAH adapter and have it power your speakers with aftermarket deck, this will automatically make you think it sounds better because the soundstage is much better, you have the built in xover sending highs to the dash speakers which obviously now work, and midbass only to the doors. obviously no one knows the xover point of this amp, but still arguably better than not having one.

so based on those 2, ive noticed the MITAH adapter setup "sounds" better.

but as for what actually is giving more power..

since no one knows any FACTS on how much RMS the stock amp puts out.. after several setups. the deck powering the speakers still "seems" to give off more "power" AND could "sound" better as well if you hook it up properly to where the soundstage is correct and the dash speakers are working. the first comparison above was really unfair because the MITAH adapter was running all the speakers where as the deck setup the dash speakers were not working.
now setup the deck with components and xovers and wired correctly. it sounds better.. so that is my recommendation.

 

[Dsmj89]

Thanks alot redturbo, very helpful.

 

[Defiant]

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/app...ts-merged-11-7-tweeters.html?highlight=tweets