New head gasket better than Cometic!

[coltboostin]

Coltboostin


he probably had God build the engine for him 708 to the wheels is incredible... Hes probably trappin over 140 or something, huh?

I went 148.5mph@30psi. I made 708@33psi.

No, god, just me. The motor included used eagle rods out of a blown motor, new wiescos, STOCK main studs, and STOCK head bolts. Yes, stockers.

As for the secret-the stock 1g head bolts are not torque to yeild. They are hardend steel, an dlarger than most other stuff out there (adn overdone for our little motor).

So the secret is in the torque-I take them to no less than 105 ft lbs. If you feel lucky 110 and 115 are not out of the question. Stock head bolts@ 105 with felpro composite gasket held up to daily abuse-and I mean pulls at every open stretch of road-until the car's demise a few weeks ago. It never pushed coolant, and shouldnt in its new home.

 

[project_tsi]

What do you reccommend torquing a composite with ARP studs?

 

[RiceKiller_TSi]

25psi with mls, head bolts (arp) torqued to 97lbs and no leaks no problems for 10 months and counting. Composite also worked fine before engine rebuild holding 22psi on stock head bolts.

Boost higher than that then idk.

 

[coltboostin]

What do you reccommend torquing a composite with ARP studs?

I would say at least 105 as well. ARP's are made to take the stres. I use the same torque procedure with both stockers and ARP's- Take them to about 80 ft lbs- and then add a fiay torque of 105. Make sure you tape the head bolt holes, and oil the threads of the bolt or stud before you do this to ensure your getting an accurate torque # on the bolt.

 

[pneumo]

That's consistent with ARP's instructions for the 12mm studs. They say to use 105 ft-lbs when lubed with oil.

They also say to use 81 ft-lbs when torqued with Moly lube.

Coltboostin- I think you mean 'tap', not 'tape' right?

 

[coltboostin]

Tap'd yes.

That's consistent with ARP's instructions for the 12mm studs. They say to use 105 ft-lbs when lubed with oil.

They also say to use 81 ft-lbs when torqued with Moly lube.

Crazy-Looks like that message from God way back when telling me to take the stockers to 105 was sponsored by ARP.

 

[project_tsi]

Coltboostin, or anyone else, do you have an opinion on a HG from Napa? I work there and picked one up today for about $25, and to me, it looks to be made about the same as the felpro part. Let me know what you think. It is suposed to have some type of sealer on it, although I'd probly put some copper spray on it.

 

[steel_3d]

On a related note, it seems my block is warping differently with a stock composite mitsu gasket than with the ITM junk gasket it was machined with (out of round, etc), so I'm considering putting it together with another ITM. Looks decently constructed, I don't know how much variation there is in composite gaskets.

 

[coltboostin]

It looks darker in color than the felpro, but I could not tell you why (the difference in material..ect)-but Im sure it does not matter.

Run it!

 

[nightspeed87]

I went 148.5mph@30psi. I made 708@33psi.

No, god, just me. The motor included used eagle rods out of a blown motor, new wiescos, STOCK main studs, and STOCK head bolts. Yes, stockers.

As for the secret-the stock 1g head bolts are not torque to yeild. They are hardend steel, an dlarger than most other stuff out there (adn overdone for our little motor).

So the secret is in the torque-I take them to no less than 105 ft lbs. If you feel lucky 110 and 115 are not out of the question. Stock head bolts@ 105 with felpro composite gasket held up to daily abuse-and I mean pulls at every open stretch of road-until the car's demise a few weeks ago. It never pushed coolant, and shouldnt in its new home.

damn the cars demise? What happened to it...?

 

[coltboostin]

damn the cars demise? What happened to it...?

Found out it was not stable @ 200mph the hard way.

 

[jrpmp69]

Thank god i found this thread, i was planning on re-using my SCE copper head gasket eventhough my car is leaking oil like crazy right now with this HG. My block is o-ringed, and i was wondering if i could use a different head gasket? I didnt think i would be able to use any other head gasket with an o-ringed block but i guess i was wrong after reading all these post of ppl with o-ringed blocks using composite head gaskets. I dont want to spend more than $100, so which HG would you recommend for me? I will be running a ported 1g head, 60 trim turbo with 25psi of boost and ARP's. Also, what should i torque the head bolts to with such gasket?

 

[TSIfreek]

Thank god i found this thread, i was planning on re-using my SCE copper head gasket eventhough my car is leaking oil like crazy right now with this HG. My block is o-ringed, and i was wondering if i could use a different head gasket? I didnt think i would be able to use any other head gasket with an o-ringed block but i guess i was wrong after reading all these post of ppl with o-ringed blocks using composite head gaskets. I dont want to spend more than $100, so which HG would you recommend for me? I will be running a ported 1g head, 60 trim turbo with 25psi of boost and ARP's. Also, what should i torque the head bolts to with such gasket?

With and oringed block I would use the stock HG from mitsu. I would torque the head to what ever the machinist torqed it to with the torque plate 80-85 ft lbs?? Anyway you blow out a stock HG with an oringed block you got some serious problems with detionation. In my oppinion the stock HG seals the oil and coolant better than any aftermarket HG out there. 25 psi is nothing with an oringed block. Stock HG can take you along way even without an oringed block.

 

[jrpmp69]

With and oringed block I would use the stock HG from mitsu. I would torque the head to what ever the machinist torqed it to with the torque plate 80-85 ft lbs?? Anyway you blow out a stock HG with an oringed block you got some serious problems with detionation. In my oppinion the stock HG seals the oil and coolant better than any aftermarket HG out there. 25 psi is nothing with an oringed block. Stock HG can take you along way even without an oringed block.

Are you talking about a mitsubishi graphite HG or a composite HG? I remember the last time i rebuilt my head, the head gasket set came with a graphite HG that looked like it was made out of led or something like it.

 

[TSIfreek]

Are you talking about a mitsubishi graphite HG or a composite HG? I remember the last time i rebuilt my head, the head gasket set came with a graphite HG that looked like it was made out of led or something like it.

What ever the stock head gasket is??? Mitsubishi makes 2 HG for our engines the stock or the MLS.

 

[RiceKiller_TSi]

MLS= Multi Layer Steel and its a little thicker than the stock headgasket. Costs about $98 bucks from the dealership.

 

[DSM90AWD]

MLS= Multi Layer Steel and its a little thicker than the stock headgasket. Costs about $98 bucks from the dealership.

I've heard that NAPA will soon be stocking the OEM Mitsu MLS (made by Victor Reinz)

 

[GVR4592]

MLS= Multi Layer Steel and its a little thicker than the stock headgasket. Costs about $98 bucks from the dealership.

It's a lot thicker than stock, thick enough to drop comrpression 2/10 of a point. So if you have 7.8:1 and you get the Mitsu mls, you'd be down to 7.6:1. It's .067" compared to the stock composite's .042"compressed. The only time that gasket should be used is if you're taken a lot of material from the head or block.

 

[Suparata]

Mitsu MLS is .053" compressed and it is one of the best out there. Two perfect surfaces clamped together correctly with that should hold better than most of the guys need out there. I wonder when will people realize that they don't need o'rings for their application!
I believe the FelPro MLS gasket is best (though twice the price of a Mitsu MLS) followed by the Mitsu MLS, HKS.
Just as an example Vassil Vutov is running a Mitsu MLS with no other sealant sprays or anything, pushing the FP3052 beyond his capabilities to 10sec runs all that with almost 30K miles on the engine. And if that's not abuse I don't know what is.

 

[nanokpsi]

Thank god i found this thread, i was planning on re-using my SCE copper head gasket eventhough my car is leaking oil like crazy right now with this HG. My block is o-ringed, and i was wondering if i could use a different head gasket? I didnt think i would be able to use any other head gasket with an o-ringed block but i guess i was wrong after reading all these post of ppl with o-ringed blocks using composite head gaskets. I dont want to spend more than $100, so which HG would you recommend for me? I will be running a ported 1g head, 60 trim turbo with 25psi of boost and ARP's. Also, what should i torque the head bolts to with such gasket?

What material is your o-ring? With copper wire I am running the cometic still. It was recomended to run the evo 3 gasket though, but they don't have a big enough bore for a 2.0 application. I'm still waiting for the motor's return from Polk Performance.

 

[GVR4592]

Mitsu MLS is .053" compressed and it is one of the best out there. Two perfect surfaces clamped together correctly with that should hold better than most of the guys need out there. I wonder when will people realize that they don't need o'rings for their application!
I believe the FelPro MLS gasket is best (though twice the price of a Mitsu MLS) followed by the Mitsu MLS, HKS.
Just as an example Vassil Vutov is running a Mitsu MLS with no other sealant sprays or anything, pushing the FP3052 beyond his capabilities to 10sec runs all that with almost 30K miles on the engine. And if that's not abuse I don't know what is.

Mitch, did you measure a Mitsubishi MLS? Every source I can find all say it's .067" compressed. It's not that I don't believe you, you're definitely one of the most reliable sources of accurate information on this site, I've just always heard .067".

 

[Suparata]

.053" measured.

 

[GVR4592]

Thanks, for the info.

 

[4SFED4]

That's consistent with ARP's instructions for the 12mm studs. They say to use 105 ft-lbs when lubed with oil.

They also say to use 81 ft-lbs when torqued with Moly lube.

Coltboostin- I think you mean 'tap', not 'tape' right?

I have always used Moly Lube on my ARP studs. I have also torqued them as high as 120ft/lbs, it holds no better than if you torque them at 85 ft/lbs. Bottom line is if you detonate the motor too hard the head is going to lift, reguardless of how high you torque it or what head gasket you use. Overtightening the fasteners will do nothing but crush the head--information from a well known reputable 4G63 engine builder--Reason being I only torque mine to 85 ft/lbs now.

 

[jrpmp69]

What material is your o-ring? With copper wire I am running the cometic still. It was recomended to run the evo 3 gasket though, but they don't have a big enough bore for a 2.0 application. I'm still waiting for the motor's return from Polk Performance.

I'm guessing its copper, its kind of orange in color. What material is best to use for o-rings?
This guy at roadrace told me to get rid of the o-rings by filling them with JB weld. I bought one of their composite head gaskets but i forgot to mention that my pisotns are 20 over, will this gasket still fit?