new engine spun rod

[ove_98 TSI]

so this is what happened. rebuilt engine with all oem parts. start engine everything is fine i let idle for about 30 mins everything is good. next day i let idle for about 45 mins, then i take it around the block not going into boost. i get about 10 miles on it then i decide to boost some i wanted to have boost set at 10 psi, because of not having injectors. it goes steady to about 8-9 then just takes off to about 24psi. so i figured my profec was set to high i lower it to 0 (which is supposed to be wastegate spring boost) and it does the same thing right up to 24psi again. i begin to drive home to see if i have a stuck wastgate when i hear a slight ticking by the time im home (1/4 mile) it becomes a knock. i pulled the oil pan off and this is what i found

oil psi was at 30 at idle and about 90-100 when reving
afr were reading lean on my wideband

cyl #1 is flawless

#2 was getting no oil it was dry not a drop of oil on it, and the bearings were stacked

#3 has plety of oil but is scrached badly

#4 is scracthed lightly but also plety of oil

what went wrong? i want to avoid this on my next rebuild or possibly on my new block and crank if this one is damaged to bad

 

[tenn-gsx]

Clogged oil galleys probably. Or possibly your oil squirters were stuck wide open?

 

[alansupra94]

I don't think that the 24psi boost spike helped. As mentioned, check your oil galleys.

 

[ove_98 TSI]

would the boost spike really of caused all this? i figured it would take a bit more than that.
im going to check the oil galleries right now

 

[Redfwdsm]

so this is what happened. rebuilt engine with all oem parts. start engine everything is fine i let idle for about 30 mins everything is good. next day i let idle for about 45 mins, then i take it around the block not going into boost. i get about 10 miles on it then i decide to boost some i wanted to have boost set at 10 psi, because of not having injectors. it goes steady to about 8-9 then just takes off to about 24psi. so i figured my profec was set to high i lower it to 0 (which is supposed to be wastegate spring boost) and it does the same thing right up to 24psi again. i begin to drive home to see if i have a stuck wastgate when i hear a slight ticking by the time im home (1/4 mile) it becomes a knock. i pulled the oil pan off and this is what i found

oil psi was at 30 at idle and about 90-100 when reving
afr were reading lean on my wideband

cyl #1 is flawless

#2 was getting no oil it was dry not a drop of oil on it, and the bearings were stacked

#3 has plety of oil but is scrached badly

#4 is scracthed lightly but also plety of oil

what went wrong? i want to avoid this on my next rebuild or possibly on my new block and crank if this one is damaged to bad

man that sucks but if it helps you made my panic attack go away i sit here and look at everyones posts and then i look at my broke ass pos and start having panic attacks cause i wasted so much money haha well sorry to hear about your motor id check the gallys

 

[freeman 188]

did you check the clearances on your crank when you assembled it ,rod and main bearings . the first one I assembled the summer lasted for 80 miles and spun # 3 rod bearing , the rebuild kit was from topline and I didn,t check the clearances since it was all stock replacement , a mistake I didn,t do again .

 

[ove_98 TSI]

did you check the clearances on your crank when you assembled it ,rod and main bearings . the first one I assembled the summer lasted for 80 miles and spun # 3 rod bearing , the rebuild kit was from topline and I didn,t check the clearances since it was all stock replacement , a mistake I didn,t do again .

yes i checked clearances, but i think i did it wrong
i belive your absoultely correct as i look at the two bearings; the stock old ones and the replacement ,the replacement seems thicker im going to pick up some plasti gage tommorow and test them both

 

[kawboy]

You can't check them once they're blown

Was the block hot-tanked/jet washed?

 

[loba]

Out of curiousity - did you install a balance shaft eliminator? And if so, did you spin the bearing so it didn't leak out all your oil pressure?

 

[crimsondragon]

What type of oil was used? Synthetic? Dino? Did you change the oil after the 45 min idle? 30 psi seems like a lot at idle and then hitting 90-100 psi when revving? Doesn't sound normal to me. What have you done to the car? Removed balance shafts? Did you port the oil relief valve?

 

[lowexpectations]

What type of oil was used? Synthetic? Dino? Did you change the oil after the 45 min idle? 30 psi seems like a lot at idle and then hitting 90-100 psi when revving? Doesn't sound normal to me. What have you done to the car? Removed balance shafts? Did you port the oil relief valve?

That kind of pressure is from not porting the oil relief valve and haveing the balance shafts removed. Im gonna say that did not make a difference in his situation.

 

[crimsondragon]

If he did remove the balance shafts but did not port the oil relief valve, he will be looking at a higher than normal oil pressure.

 

[turbo23]

A boost spike like that (if not tuned for it) could put you into very hard detnation, which could have spun the bearing.

 

[kawboy]

If he did remove the balance shafts but did not port the oil relief valve, he will be looking at a higher than normal oil pressure.

While correct, that has nothing to do with spun bearings.

 

[ove_98 TSI]

You can't check them once they're blown

Was the block hot-tanked/jet washed?

yes i know, but i have an extra set of std bearings on hand,
yes it was hot tanked

Out of curiousity - did you install a balance shaft eliminator? And if so, did you spin the bearing so it didn't leak out all your oil pressure?

yes it was done and done the correct way

What type of oil was used? Synthetic? Dino? Did you change the oil after the 45 min idle? 30 psi seems like a lot at idle and then hitting 90-100 psi when revving? Doesn't sound normal to me. What have you done to the car? Removed balance shafts? Did you port the oil relief valve?

oil was pennzoil 5-w30
no oil was not changed, i was unaware this was neccessary
balance shaft removed, but not ported relief

i checked oil galleries and they looked normal, but im not sure what to really look for in them
can anyone explain how to check them?


so im thinking what went wrong was that the bearing size is what did it for the most part not allowing enough oil inbetween the bearing and the crank, and i belive the boost spike did not make matters any better. does this sound resonable?

 

[webconnect]

Did you get the crank cut or cylinders bored? Is it a stock rebuild?

 

[ove_98 TSI]

Did you get the crank cut or cylinders bored? Is it a stock rebuild?

nope all the same, it was a stock rebuild

 

[olmytsi]

Sounds like you didn't do your homework before building the motor...

You NEED to change the oil like 3 or 4 times in the first few hundred miles of the motor to get rid of any "crap".

The first oil change should occur after idling for a lil bit, before you even drive it.


Oh well, we all make mistakes.

 

[jdd1231]

The bearings you installed were stock (standard) size correct?

 

[freeman 188]

I seen a new rebuild 4g63 with about 10 miles on it getting detionation due to the fuel pressure vacum line not hooked up on 18psi and that motor is still running . detionation will usually hammer the middle of the bearing ,but it is always a possibility . but like I said before if the clearances are not within spec your motor won,t last .

 

[alansupra94]

Sounds like you didn't do your homework before building the motor...

You NEED to change the oil like 3 or 4 times in the first few hundred miles of the motor to get rid of any "crap".

The first oil change should occur after idling for a lil bit, before you even drive it.


Oh well, we all make mistakes.

And the filter if you want to be safe.

I will have to ask the dude about porting the oil relief when I get the engine tomorrow, didn't know you had to do that.

 

[webconnect]

My schedule is oil change @ 100 miles, 250 miles, 500 miles, 1000 miles, 2000, and then its all good.

 

[ryanman]

^^^wayyyy overkill on the oil changes dude^^^

It's pretty obvious that the clearances were wrong, plain & simple. You shouldn't have that much trash at all if you properly cleaned everything (like you should do) before assembling an engine. One oil change at around 100 miles & another around 1000 miles is just fine, don't use crappy filters (such as Fram). Porting the oil relief helps but is definately not necessary, I've never done it (built 30-40 4g63's with no BS's) and never had an issue nor has anyone else I've ever ran across. Extended idling after a fresh rebuild is NOT good, go drive it, 5/10/15 minutes is fine but no longer. As far as the oil galleys, blow them out with compressed air or if you have access to some long skinny wire brushes then use them and blow them out afterwards with brake clean or some other sort of cleaner. Your boost hitting 24psi is probably not a good thing BUT I don't think it's what caused your problem, only thing that'll affect is the seating of the rings but even then it takes alot to wipe them out. Good luck.

 

[jrohner]

so this is what happened. rebuilt engine with all oem parts. start engine everything is fine i let idle for about 30 mins everything is good. next day i let idle for about 45 mins, then i take it around the block not going into boost. i get about 10 miles on it then i decide to boost some i wanted to have boost set at 10 psi, because of not having injectors. it goes steady to about 8-9 then just takes off to about 24psi. so i figured my profec was set to high i lower it to 0 (which is supposed to be wastegate spring boost) and it does the same thing right up to 24psi again.

Idling for over an hour is definitely NOT the correct way to break in a new engine. Did you prime the oil before starting it?

 

[ove_98 TSI]

The bearings you installed were stock (standard) size correct?

yes

Idling for over an hour is definitely NOT the correct way to break in a new engine. Did you prime the oil before starting it?

yes i did prime it

i just checked clearances with some new bearings but of the same size and i got a .004 clearance, then i did it with the best bearing of the old bearings and also got a .004 clearance. In my haynes manual it says .004 is the service limit, does this mean that i would have need to use undersized bearings?