need to run safely! help

[96atgsx]

I have a 96 at gsx with a newly put in jdm motor. Current mods, T28 turbo, 17psi wastegate, 3 inch downpipe, MBC, ARP's, and K&N filter. The boost controller is set at the lowest level(17psi). I have no fuel mods whatsoever, so I am driving the car extremely carefully(not pushing at all). My question is what do I need to run 17-18psi safely? I know a lot of people are talking about loggers, SAFC, dsmlink, ect. I have almost no knowledge about these and what I would actually need. My goal is simply to have a reliable dd running 17-18psi on this turbo, while making a few 1/4 runs just to see what it runs. Can someone please help me out or point me in the right direction? From what I have gathered is I at least need a fuel pump re-wire, and possibly injectors? The part i am most confused about is the tuning/logging part. Thanks in advance!

justin

 

[Rob10_99]

There's two things more that you will need. A wideband and something to tune with.
Wideband tells you what your AFR's are so you don't melt something.
Tuning can be several things, from a cheap afc($200 maby?) to a full blown AEM or similar at around $2k.

There's plenty in between that can do all you need. I personally wouldn't waste my time with a afc,
Look in the tuning section on the forums for the in betweens as well as setup info.

 

[e85_4g63]

If you want to run that t28 at 18 psi safely I suggest:

Boost gauge (autometer, S/W, VDO, whoever you like)
Walbro 190 lph pump (rewired)
FIC (or other) 550cc injectors
Wideband, Logger, and a tuning device (SAFC, DS-Map, DSMLink, AEM, MoTech, whatever)
A GOOD clutch setup
2 1/2" exhaust
possibly a set of HKS 264 cams if you are really mid range RPM happy

As far as tuning goes, DSMLink is by far, the simplest to use. You need a logger (already build into DSMLink) to log what is going on with the engine, and then you need a tuning tool (SAFC, DSMLink, etc,) to make changes. You'll want a wideband for tuning as well. What is your HP goal with the car?

 

[96atgsx]

If you want to run that t28 at 18 psi safely I suggest:

Boost gauge (autometer, S/W, VDO, whoever you like)
Walbro 190 lph pump (rewired)
FIC (or other) 550cc injectors
Wideband, Logger, and a tuning device (SAFC, DS-Map, DSMLink, AEM, MoTech, whatever)
A GOOD clutch setup
2 1/2" exhaust
possibly a set of HKS 264 cams if you are really mid range RPM happy

As far as tuning goes, DSMLink is by far, the simplest to use. You need a logger (already build into DSMLink) to log what is going on with the engine, and then you need a tuning tool (SAFC, DSMLink, etc,) to make changes. You'll want a wideband for tuning as well. What is your HP goal with the car?

boost gauge - already have
fuel - thats about what i expected
any specific wideband/loggers? my goal is to invest as little as possible to obtain safe readings for a dd. (not meaning i want cheap ebay products, just that i don't care to go all out on top of the line equipment). With that being said, any reason not to go SAFC? I know the previous poster said he wouldnt waste the time, but I really don't have really high goals for this car.
clutch - i have an auto so i think im ok there
exhaust - i have a 3 inch downpipe, and i believe all the previous owner did was put an aftermarket muffler. Is a 2 1/2 catback completely necessary?

I don't have any particular hp goals. I currently drive an ls1 camaro ss daily, and would like to have similar power numbers, but won't be upset if its still not as fast. Ideally would like a 13 second car, but again not a big issue. The important thing is fun and reliable.

Thanks for the response!

 

[e85_4g63]

boost gauge - already have
fuel - thats about what i expected
any specific wideband/loggers? my goal is to invest as little as possible to obtain safe readings for a dd. (not meaning i want cheap ebay products, just that i don't care to go all out on top of the line equipment). With that being said, any reason not to go SAFC? I know the previous poster said he wouldnt waste the time, but I really don't have really high goals for this car.
clutch - i have an auto so i think im ok there
exhaust - i have a 3 inch downpipe, and i believe all the previous owner did was put an aftermarket muffler. Is a 2 1/2 catback completely necessary?

I don't have any particular hp goals. I currently drive an ls1 camaro ss daily, and would like to have similar power numbers, but won't be upset if its still not as fast. Ideally would like a 13 second car, but again not a big issue. The important thing is fun and reliable.

Thanks for the response!

There is nothing wrong with an SAFC. SAFC's are just more basic then other tuning tools. There main downfall (not the only one mind you) is that when using them, you have no control over timing. They simply lie to the computer about how much air is going into the engine. Usually that sets the car on the higher timing maps and cause's detonation issue's with pump gas. (not as bad since the 2g's don't have very aggressive timing maps anyway). You can pick up a used SAFC (I, II or Neo) for around $100, I may even have one I'd sell really cheap if your interested. I didn't realize you had an auto car, sorry for the clutch suggestion, as it's not needed. As for the exhaust, I'd at least look into getting a something other then the stock exhaust. I don't see why the previous owner would have installed a 3" down pipe and then just added a muffler. Unless he ran the car open downpipe maybe? I don't think you NEED a 2 1/2" catback, it'll just allow the car to perform better (if I can word it like that). Next thing: Logger. There isn't really a *great* logger out there for the 2g guys. There was something I saw about a 2g specific logger program a while back in the threads, I'm not sure exactly though, as I have a 1g. Basically all you need to do is get a good fuel system set up, and find something you (or the shop you choose) are comfortable using to tune the car with. These cars are pretty simple to work with. Alot easier to change spark plugs in then your SS too! (as I'm sure you know already)....

 

[96atgsx]

There is nothing wrong with an SAFC. SAFC's are just more basic then other tuning tools. There main downfall (not the only one mind you) is that when using them, you have no control over timing. They simply lie to the computer about how much air is going into the engine. Usually that sets the car on the higher timing maps and cause's detonation issue's with pump gas. (not as bad since the 2g's don't have very aggressive timing maps anyway). You can pick up a used SAFC (I, II or Neo) for around $100, I may even have one I'd sell really cheap if your interested. I didn't realize you had an auto car, sorry for the clutch suggestion, as it's not needed. As for the exhaust, I'd at least look into getting a something other then the stock exhaust. I don't see why the previous owner would have installed a 3" down pipe and then just added a muffler. Unless he ran the car open downpipe maybe? I don't think you NEED a 2 1/2" catback, it'll just allow the car to perform better (if I can word it like that). Next thing: Logger. There isn't really a *great* logger out there for the 2g guys. There was something I saw about a 2g specific logger program a while back in the threads, I'm not sure exactly though, as I have a 1g. Basically all you need to do is get a good fuel system set up, and find something you (or the shop you choose) are comfortable using to tune the car with. These cars are pretty simple to work with. Alot easier to change spark plugs in then your SS too! (as I'm sure you know already)....

Ha yes much easier than the ss!! I may be interested in the SAFC if you still have it. When you say detonation issue's what do you mean? At this relatively low boost level will I need to worry much about that? Like I said before the goal is to have a reliable daily driver, so I don't want to sacrifice reliability to save a couple $$.

Anyone else that has a 2g have any recommendations for a logger setup??

 

[LiquidX]

Never run higher boost than what your fuel is capable of. You'll run lean and detonate which are both bad. Higher the octane means it's harder to combust which in turn lowers the chance of detonation in high heat.

If you plan that you'll want to build the car up, I'd go with dsm link but you'll have to get the rare 95 eprom ecu to use it. You hook up a laptop or equivalent and it's a logger and tuner. You'll be able to run much larger injectors since the afc is only good up to 660s? Bigger turbo, needs more gas, more gas means bigger injectors. Buy it once.

 

[96atgsx]

Never run higher boost than what your fuel is capable of. You'll run lean and detonate which are both bad. Higher the octane means it's harder to combust which in turn lowers the chance of detonation in high heat.

If you plan that you'll want to build the car up, I'd go with dsm link but you'll have to get the rare 95 eprom ecu to use it. You hook up a laptop or equivalent and it's a logger and tuner. You'll be able to run much larger injectors since the afc is only good up to 660s? Bigger turbo, needs more gas, more gas means bigger injectors. Buy it once.

Thanks for the explanation! I actually have no intentions on going for more power than what is capable at around 17-18psi. I am more looking for the easiest and most cost effective way of making the car safe to run as a dd as soon as possible. Based upon that would your answer change?

 

[Nick2gGST]

This is actually pretty helpful so far, I'm new to the whole turbo thing all together so i dont know MUCH about what:
logger's
safc
DSMlink
DS-map
MAFT
afc
stuff like that is.... sounds stupid but at least i can learn and not break my shyt.

 

[LiquidX]

Thanks for the explanation! I actually have no intentions on going for more power than what is capable at around 17-18psi. I am more looking for the easiest and most cost effective way of making the car safe to run as a dd as soon as possible. Based upon that would your answer change?

That's also all dependant on the turbo too. The larger the turbo the more air it's moving at the same psi than a smaller turbo of equivalent psi. You can have say either 250hp or 350+ both at the same psi but on different turbos. Just something for you to consider unless you plan on running the stock turbo which at around 18psi it's running out of breath.

 

[96atgsx]

That's also all dependant on the turbo too. The larger the turbo the more air it's moving at the same psi than a smaller turbo of equivalent psi. You can have say either 250hp or 350+ both at the same psi but on different turbos. Just something for you to consider unless you plan on running the stock turbo which at around 18psi it's running out of breath.

Right. Well I am running a t28 right now and have no intentions of changing. I just want to have a tuned, reliable dd with probably ~300hp.

 

[rocketjr]

I would think with the T28 and DSMLink you could get in the upper 200hp maybe the low 300hp range. You would probably need a full exhaust and some other mods to help get it to that 300hp mark.

You definately want to get an upgraded fuel pump, injectors and DSMLink.

Do you have the stock MAF still? If so that is ok. Its actually good because it makes tuning that much easier once you get to that point. I have never used the SAFC but I have used the AEM. The AEM is a very powerfull tool but way overkill for what you are looking for. The DSMLink would provide you the ability to check CEL's if you happen to throw one while you are driving, tune the car to a safe operating range and you could do that much off of the tuning guides fairly easily. If you want to create dependable you need to have the tools to do it and you definately don't want to run short on fuel.

Good luck.

 

[e85_4g63]

This is actually pretty helpful so far, I'm new to the whole turbo thing all together so i dont know MUCH about what:
logger's
safc
DSMlink
DS-map
MAFT
afc
stuff like that is.... sounds stupid but at least i can learn and not break my shyt.

Well:

Logger: This is the device (or devices depending on your setup) that records what the sensors in your car are reading.

SAFC: (Super Air Flow Converter) This is what IS a tuning device. It lie's to the ecu and make's it think there is more or less air going into the engine then there actually is. That is how it get's the ecu to add or take away fuel. It's adjustable at many different RPM points, so if you need to add fuel lower in the RPM range and take some out in the higher RPM range you can do so.

DSMLink: This is basically an SAFC and Logger in one. With a couple extra features to boot!

DS-Map: This is, for lack of better terms, a really really inexpensive version of the AEM EMS. It doesn't have all the bells and whistles, but it's $1,000 cheaper at least.

MAFT: Mas Air Flow Translator: This is the device (little box) that let's you run a 3" (or 3 1/2" if you so choose) GM air meter on your DSM (1g / 2g). It also let's you vent your BOV to the atmospher for the 'oh so cool ricer hotness!

AFC: The oldest version of the SAFC that I'm aware of (Air Flow Converter)

It's all good man, we gotta learn from someone. Don't be afraid to ask questions! That'll keep your shyt from breaking!

 

[Nick2gGST]

cool thanks, hey i have a vented one! i dont want it, i'd rather have a recirc but i'm poor. Either way that was helpful.