MBC... Tee'd to BOV!

[staticbrainwash]

You could always drill out a larger hole, or re-tap for larger threads. And JBWeld is your friend, and should be used even if the fitting screws in tight, and doesn't leak initially. The compressor housing is a good place, but the outlet elbow will also do... I know very few aftermarket j-pipes have vacuum nipples[/sarcasm], but if you can't drill a hole and fit (essentially) a bolt into it, you might want to reconsider automotive modification for performance as a goal.

Haha, and how! I've done it like 4 times now as i've been moving stuff around and modding. It's not a hard thing to do really.

 

[Slippi84]

You could always drill out a larger hole, or re-tap for larger threads. And JBWeld is your friend, and should be used even if the fitting screws in tight, and doesn't leak initially. The compressor housing is a good place, but the outlet elbow will also do... I know very few aftermarket j-pipes have vacuum nipples[/sarcasm], but if you can't drill a hole and fit (essentially) a bolt into it, you might want to reconsider automotive modification for performance as a goal.

This is steppin on that line again between personal comments but I won't go there agian. Besides the guy earlier who didn't tightend the vaccume line enough should prove anything in possible. Not to mention the idea of jbwelding a nipple to my $1300 turbo doesn't seem like good times.

 

[staticbrainwash]

This is steppin on that line again between personal comments but I won't go there agian. Besides the guy earlier who didn't tightend the vaccume line enough should prove anything in possible. Not to mention the idea of jbwelding a nipple to my $1300 turbo doesn't seem like good times.

SO DO IT IN A J-PIPE! It doesn't HAVE to be IN the turbo, just as close as possible.

 

[SBR Joe]

Uhhh my MBC is definitely tee'd off my BOV line and will stay that way .

Survey says...........



Joe
SBR

 

[Slippi84]

SO DO IT IN A J-PIPE! It doesn't HAVE to be IN the turbo, just as close as possible.

I never said I was doing it at all. Everything I was saying was hypothertical as I have already ran both and it's not even worth the trouble for going threw all that as nothing changed.

 

[SBR Joe]

Running low 10's on pump is extremely impressive but it doesn't mean you're right all the time. Case in point, I have had to correct many members in the past on the need for an AFPR with larger pumps because they were told by AMS that it is not needed, AMS certainly has their share of fast cars. Can one get into 10's with FPR overrun? Certainly. Does it make it right? Certainly not! Have you actually gone through the trouble of testing whether your BOV is open under WOT? Who is to say you won't get your 9's if you get off the BOV line.

Your points are well made, but what works and what is right is kind of 2 different things. If someoen is running 10s on stock fpr and isnt running out of injector then whats the point? If it works, whats it really matter if its "not right".But on the other hand, my buddy Pat (the 16g record car) with E85 was seeing wicked high DC with 1000's, he put AFPR on it and brough it down, but i find that hard to compare to the BOV situation at hand. If Andrew is running 10's this way, i see it very far fetched that 9's is even in the picture with hooking the MBC up differently, i couldnt see it changing a thing.


Joe
SBR

 

[oldman]

Your points are well made, but what works and what is right is kind of 2 different things. If someoen is running 10s on stock fpr and isnt running out of injector then whats the point?

Because drivability and reliability are equally, if not more important, than performance for most of us. It's really not as hard to go fast, given enough money, than to go fast and keep it on the road as a DD.

If Andrew is running 10's this way, i see it very far fetched that 9's is even in the picture with hooking the MBC up differently, i couldnt see it changing a thing.

If in fact his BOV is open under WOT, which I suspect, without him knowing it, it will make some difference especially if he is still venting with a 2G MAS.

 

[hottboost]

There has been multiple thoughts on this subject! ( mine included ) I have never had a problem T'd to the compressor housing. Every time I have had a problem, for the sake of expierment, I would try the bov line to see what happens........ Results were that if their is an underlying problem then the bov line would help it settle. Now in the long run, IN MY OPINION this is bad for our cars. If you have a problem, shoud you fix it or mask it. FIX IT. From MY PERSONAL expierence t'ing to the bov line may help settle a spike or hide a boost leak, but in the meantime it is over working your turbo. As oldman has stated many times now if you have a boost gauge, you WILL be reading the manifold preasure. Again I posted this question to help trouble shoot my problem. Now i havent even touched on the effect on the bov! Great debate guys.

Carl

 

[SBR Joe]

Because drivability and reliability are equally, if not more important, than performance for most of us. It's really not as hard to go fast, given enough money, than to go fast and keep it on the road as a DD.


If in fact his BOV is open under WOT, which I suspect, without him knowing it, it will make some difference especially if he is still venting with a 2G MAS.

Well both cars were mainly speaking of, Andrews and Pats are very capable of being DD, but who really wants a 10 second car that their designated DD anyways, neither of which i have seen (especiall pats car becuase i have personally driven it) sacrafice any sort of drivability/reliability. And im sure the bov isnt opening under WOT, that would be something that would most definately wouldnt go un noticed especially if venting to the atmosphere on a stock maf, the car would feel like a bucking bronco.


Joe
SBR

 

[dsm-onster]

I doubt serously that any car described has been tuned w/out a wideband. Thus any overly rich condition due to cracking a BOV at WOT while running a drawthru MAF would certainly be noticed and delt w/.

Now, I'm not saying that I will not pay particular attention to my set up considering that I'm running off my BOV line. I will certainly alter my lines if such symptoms arise. It's foolish not to considering the numbers of setups that have in fact had these particular symptoms. I just had to mention that my car does not display such symptoms. Thus there must be SOMETHING that is distinguishing it from those that do. I was supposing that the form of MBC may be the cause. But alas! not according to Bruce's experience.

 

[Talesin]

Unless he has his tuning solution decreasing the flow values far enough not to bring on cut, and tuning on fuel pressure to compensate. Or one of those crappy 'fuel cut defencer' units. Or he might have switched back to recirculating, so the metered air isn't lost.

My comment wasn't meant as a personal attack... it's the same idea as if you are unable to cut cards, you may not want to practice stage magic. It's an exceedingly simple task... trivial to the point of mentally equating 'I can't do it' with 'I don't want to bother doing it', at least in my mind. Sure, there are people who cannot physically perform the act. They may want to consider other hobbyist paths.. plastic botany comes to mind.


edit- Now I'm curious as to the average pressure the intake system undergoes upon throttle plate closure while under full boost. I'm almost tempted to tap in for a second boost gauge just to see what the compressor-elbow pressure level ends up being, but remember reading something about it spiking far past any 'normal' read, and potentially damaging a standard 30psi/30in-hg boost gauge.

 

[Slippi84]

Unless he has his tuning solution decreasing the flow values far enough not to bring on cut, and tuning on fuel pressure to compensate. Or one of those crappy 'fuel cut defencer' units. Or he might have switched back to recirculating, so the metered air isn't lost.

My comment wasn't meant as a personal attack... it's the same idea as if you are unable to cut cards, you may not want to practice stage magic. It's an exceedingly simple task... trivial to the point of mentally equating 'I can't do it' with 'I don't want to bother doing it', at least in my mind. Sure, there are people who cannot physically perform the act. They may want to consider other hobbyist paths.. plastic botany comes to mind.


edit- Now I'm curious as to the average pressure the intake system undergoes upon throttle plate closure while under full boost. I'm almost tempted to tap in for a second boost gauge just to see what the compressor-elbow pressure level ends up being, but remember reading something about it spiking far past any 'normal' read, and potentially damaging a standard 30psi/30in-hg boost gauge.

True but it's not easier than tightening a vacume line which has been shown to not be a given.

 

[Maglin]

Wow. What a pissing contest. If you wanted to see the pressure spikes you would want to run a 60 or 90 PSI gauge. Depends on the turbo used. The larger the turbo the larger the spike. And the higher the boost also higher the spike. Why a BOV might be good at 25 PSI but once you are pushing 40 PSI compressor stall starts happening. 35 PSI on the HX35 on a modded BOV was enough for me to get stall on occasion. If my 1G BOV wasn't modded it probably wouldn't be a problem as it would open much sooner but then it would leak past 20 PSI. Give and take their. I do know that when I did let of and the BOV opened everyone in a 50 foot radius would snap their head over. That is on the highway btw. Very loud and was a very long blow off.

I just say do what you want. I'll correct people but that is as far as I can go. It's up to them to digest my info and do something about it if anything. Plus I'm not always right.

 

[fallenauthority]

I don't get why people tee into the bov line AT ALL, but especially not for a gauge. Thats just silly. You want boost and vac typically, and that will not give vac.

A VACUUM line from the intake manifold to the BOV wont give you vac eh?

 

[dsm-onster]

Plus I'm not always right.

Jeremiah, you're right often enough to make one stop and think . What's the old saying, 'A word to the wise is sufficient'. I think I'll be swapping my MBC boost reference in a bit to verify nothing is going wrong. Who knows? I just may keep it in that new spot .

 

[dsm-onster]

I don't get why people tee into the bov line AT ALL, but especially not for a gauge. Thats just silly. You want boost and vac typically, and that will not give vac.

A VACUUM line from the intake manifold to the BOV wont give you vac eh?

I think he's already realized that statement was wrong.

 

[fallenauthority]

I think he's already realized that statement was wrong.

Yea, i went back and realized it was pointed out in one of the posts my bad.

 

[staticbrainwash]

Thanks for nitpicking and not actually adding anything. It was a mistake, you have to forgive me, i've been moving my parents into a new house in 90* weather for the past 3 days. So i'm just exhausted, and not quite as eloquent as per usual.

There's SO much information in here now about how this is potentially bad, and the only thing i've read in opposition is "i've done it on my car and it's fine". I'd like to see PROOF that it's fine.

We've given so much information, personal experiences, ect. and nothing seems to make a dent. But when we ask, it's thrown back on us like we have to prove everything for you.

Regardless though, there's a trove of information in here. It's an excellent read from all sides. I just know that i will stand where i always have and nothing will move me from it. Entirely too many risks even in theory to change how i have things. And really, do a pro con list of it. There's not really many pro's to the bov line. Except if you're lazy and don't want to move it. Just seems like everyone is fighting to be right so they don't have to change anything. But really, logically, one is much more "correct" over the other.

 

[fallenauthority]

Ive done it to my car, it runs FINE. I have many logs from DSMlink where its running proper a/f ratios, turbo is still doing perfectly fine, bov holds boost PERFECT. I put down 300whp on it like a month ago and its FINE. Its all personal preference.
There I added something, stop crying.

 

[staticbrainwash]

Oh gee thanks, now i can grab my blanket and climb into my crib.

Do what you want.

 

[Slippi84]

Oh gee thanks, now i can grab my blanket and climb into my crib.

Do what you want.

be cool man.

I understand yoru frustrated but I think your a little to head bound on changing EVERYONE's mind. All you can do is say what you think and how you feel and yoru experience and see if people will follow or take note of what your saying if not then odn't worry about it. Like your trying to push people to change their cars some people will get defensive for that alone. I feel what your saying I really do I just don't agree so you have to respect that. Don't come on here and go Do what you want if your car blows your car blows that's just asking for people to keep saying stuff back makin it worse. Lets just agree that information on both sides has been presented if anyone feels that one way or the other is better choose to do so with yoru personal car or in joe's case your customers cars if they ask you what you think.

 

[staticbrainwash]

I've tried to let it go. And i am just saying what i think, and know, and have experienced.

Not trying to change everyones mind, i just don't understand why this information seems so far fetched. But then again, even knowing there is a slight (even if VERY slight) possibility i'll mess something up, my neurotic nature kicks in and i do it the way it's been proven as much more safe (even if just slightly more).

It's like debating the chicken and the egg. No one will ever know what came first because the farmer keeps screwing the chicken. There's just entirely too many variables. It's like benchracing for hp or times. You just never know.

 

[dsm-onster]

Yet you've asked for it:

There's SO much information in here now about how this is potentially bad, and the only thing i've read in opposition is "i've done it on my car and it's fine". I'd like to see PROOF that it's fine.

I understand. Just dealing w/ my parents w/ trivialities can be a chore. I understand. Let it rest. there's proof but you don't care and for your own good(not being sarcastic here) reasons. . .

Yea, bench racing is saying you'll probably get X hp w/ Y mods. Kind of like, you'll get X results running Y manual boost controller configuration.

 

[nightspeed87]

I feel like this thread is going in circles. Everyone stated their personal experiences, opinions, and beliefs and now anyone whos wants to read this thread can stand on which ever side of the fence they want. Poll has it that 99 percent of the time there will be no significant issues from teeing to the bov line... But suppose you do and you happen to be in that 1 percentile then you can always look back to this thread as to why your turbo is F'ed up or why your having other issues and perhaps a few ppl on here will be able to say I told you so... I perfectly understand staticbrainwash and old mans' opinions upon the matter . If there is any possibility of issue from teeing to the bov line why do it when there are some other places were this could be done w/ out any possible problems. But some people are trying to "solve" there problems of spike by doing this so depending on your situation. But if you arent having spike issues at the compressor/jpipe etc. then id say theres no reason to tee to the bov line personally feel it should be a last resort... Ymmv

 

[GVR4592]

Ok kids, do you think this has gone on long enough or do you want to keep making asses out of yourselves?