Max HP on Auto with Shift kit and end clutch?

[Eclipsei95cl]

WOW!

I don't think I have ever seen my name being tossed around in a thread like this before.

Let me try to clear a few things up.

1) My tranny is not rebuilt every couple of passes. John rebuilt my tranny at the beginning of this year and took it apart once to inspect how it was holding up to my abuse. John has built me a very good tranny. I am very pleased with the results and would recommend that anyone considering building a high horsepower A/T seek him out.

2) My requirements for a tranny are quite a bit different from a street car. It needs to shift when I want and hold the power. This tranny does both of these things very well. I put down nearly 600hp and the tranny has not complained. BTW, I run the car up to 9000 rpm.

3) Sponsorship is when people give you money. No one gives me any money to run my car. Its sponsored by visa and mastercard. I however do have some good relationships with companies like IPT and ECM tuning. Without their help I would never have been able to have as much success.

4) There are no "secret" parts on my car. Everything can be purchased from the vendors listed on my website.

5) A 50 trim is NOT a big turbo

-Russ

Well you cant argue with that ....I also agree that a 50 trim isnt that huge of a turbo..I assumed u were sponsored because when you click on your site under sponsorship you list like 5 companies that you say help make it possible for you. Thats great that you arent sponsored and that you use your own cash, that gets mad props from me. Sorry for tossing your name around I wasnt going to say anything about u at first but 98talontsi brought it up and we kinda went on from there, Lots of the things that i have heard about ur car has come from other auto dsmers i guess things just get mixed up through everyone. Oh and john I only saw that ur only warranty in ur site was for 90 days so i just assumed that was for everything..My bad I didnt know. This Thread kinda of got carried away and i hope no one got offended or have beef with anyone..Because Im ordering a 9 1/2 billet converter next season and If i call and get a "no your a dick" response that wouldnt be cool hah j/k...But yeah Russ keep doing what your doing and maybe get into the 9s next season that would be so sick, and john ill be ordering a converter from you next season and keep you all updated on how far i have taken my car down the quarter mile with the IPT stuff I already have.. Im done with this thread good luck and peace out.

 

[Zex4g63]

A 50 trim is NOT a big turbo

-Russ

That is so true now. Just an update on my tranny. COMPLETELY original except shift kit, end clutches, and cooler. 142,000 miles on it. Drove it 1000 miles last week with a 50 trim at 22 psi. I'm not easy on it either. When its time to overhaul someday, I'll order from IPT.

 

[tom1995tsi]

Thank you Zex4g63 someone has answered my question!

 

[14.5 drift]

this has been a very enlightening thread

 

[transdude]

this has been a very enlightening thread

I just got off the phone with Russ a few hours ago- it appears that things in the auto trans DSM world just got a whole lot more interesting

I let him tell everyone what went down today, when he gets back from The Grove.

-John

 

[98TalonTSi]

I just got off the phone with Russ a few hours ago- it appears that things in the auto trans DSM world just got a whole lot more interesting

I let him tell everyone what went down today, when he gets back from The Grove.

-John

Any time I post on a message board I make sure my statements are almost always true. I don't talk out of my ass. John and I have a good friendship and talk often as well...so that's all the more that I don't BS.
And like John said A/T can be fast and reliable....with his proven trans.....Nuff said
Mike

 

[InvaderGSX]

I've been into automatic DSM's for 3 years now. I have tried everybody's product. I actually just bought an IPT rebuild kit. In my car I have blown up a Level 10 kit in 300 miles, blown up a level 10 TC in 100 miles, blown up a Protorque TC in 300 miles, wasted an Alto Red rebuild kit in 500 miles. I was running a big T3/T4 To4r compressor, 4" inlet, .70 A/R cold, .82 A/R hot side. The only trans product that I have ran that I am totally satisified with is a Precision Industry Billet Torque converter. Multi clutch and to me a bulletproof converter. The only converter that could hang in my car that never failed and the only company that gave me exact results. I said I want 4000 stall and for the first time ever with all the converters I have purchased it stalled right on the money. Which is very rare. All companies give you that stupid it depends on your setup quote and all those converters before were less reliable than stock and stalled maybe 300-400 rpm higher than stock. Which is not worth the price tag. The best thing about PI is they give you a 2 year warranty and that warranty is no BS. They'll give you a one time free stall change within 2 years. That's impressive. I have talked directly by email to Coxe and Kiggley who are the fastest non RWD automatic DSM's out there. Russ you personally told me that your car is track driven only and your tranny is dropped and inspected after 15 quarter mile runs. Which equates to just under 3.75 miles and on here you say you have not had it dropped since you have gotten the IPT tranny. But since you have had that IPT tranny how much mileage have you put on the car? Kiggley personally told me himself that after many tests no matter what you do to the DSM auto tranny it cannot reliably handle more than 500 hp without some sort of larger gearing or some sort. Which is why he converted to a manual. You two guys in the 3 years I have been in it are the only guys who have ran a turbo setup larger than mine on an automatic. I've never even heard about anybody running anything close. I mean I am sure the tranny will hold up for running it for 10 seconds and letting it sit and cool down for a long time. I haven't tested it out yet, but I am sure the IPT kit is probably the best available in the market, but it's not bulletproof . I personally want someone to design something different. Make larger gearing, design a custom valve body where the gears are extended, etc. Because anyone who really knows about these tranny's knows that putting in a translab shift kit and having clutches that are the same size, but different material is not going to make that tranny bulletproof. Better than anything available in the market? Definitely very likely. Eclipsei95cl has a good point about auto guys with big turbo's not being very common and believe me I am pretty much on every DSM auto forum around. If your an auto guy running in the 11's or faster you'd be on the forums or known as it's rare. I disagree with a lot of things posted in this thread.
1. Transdude who says there are several people out there with IPT trannies with big turbos and driving them on the street is not true or misleading. True that there probably is a lot of IPT Honda, Supra, etc trannies on the street with big turbo's, but not true with DSM's. Face it if your a DSM guy who is running 500+ HP or 11 sec's or faster on an automatic your going to be well known through the DSM community.
2. IPT is a great company, but you have to admit you have not been around that long, so how many auto DSM trannies can you have possibly built where you can say you have had only one ever fail?
3. And Russ I know your not sponsored where you get money from sponsors like Nascar, but you get a lot of free products or get products at cost as any company would be very willing to have there parts if your 10 second car. And that is why you have all those stickers on your car. You cannot say you have a typical situation like a typical person. You have the hookup and I am sure your going to support your people. And I'm sure your car has some secret parts like that crazy intercooler you got going in there. That is not something anybody can just go get. Your the man Russ no doubt, but don't sit there and try to say you are not sponsored and you pay the same dollar a typical person does for items because that's not true.
4. 98TalonTSi acts like IPT pays you for all the posts you write. IPT owes you a turbo upgrade to prove their tranny for all the compliments you write. But seriously, make some more power before you claim it to be the holy grail.

I don't want to sit here and start any arguements, but from what I read in this thread everyone is being a little misleading. I believe IPT is probably the best auto DSM tranny rebuilder around, but all in all the auto dsm tranny cannot handle power for crap and my true experiences are proof of that. I'm sure my tranny would be fine also if I only ran the car on quarter mile track passes and let it sit for a while before my next run, but the whole argument here is a street driven auto DSM with a big turbo with 450+ HP to the wheels. Can the IPT hang for at least 5,000 miles? Only time will tell as nobody can prove it yet. Simple as that. I'd pay $3000 anyday if I can go 5,000 miles on the tranny withstanding 450+ HP at the wheels.

 

[transdude]

I realize that this America and that everyone has a right to their opinion but when someone who is totally lacking factual information is going to say,
"Transdude who says there are several people out there with IPT trannies with big turbos and driving them on the street is not true or misleading" is crossing a line.

We have strived to build our business on honesty and integrity and our customers (with the possible exception of you) seem to regard us as one of the "good guys" in the performance aftermarket industry. If you would like to check this out, search the web and talk to people- I challenge anyone to find someone out there who has had a negative experience with us of feels that I have lied to them.

As I said earlier, just because someone doesn't visit this little corner of cyberspace to boast about their car doesn't mean that they don't exist.

Secondly, you are making statements like "In my car I have blown up a Level 10 kit in 300 miles...wasted an Alto Red rebuild kit in 500 miles". While you may have had transmission failures, you certainly didn't "blow a rebuild kit"- you blew a transmission.

Because some companies (who I won't mention) make the asinine claim that their rebuild kit is "bulletproof" and that their kits are "good to 750 horsepower" doesn't mean that people should be dumb enough to believe that crap. There is a lot more to a good transmission than a good rebuild kit.

Much like an engine, if you are given the best quality rebuild kit (rings, bearings, gaskets, etc) available- that is certainly no guarantee of the end result being a good engine. I don't think that I need to go into the reasons for this because I feel that they are pretty self explanatory to just about anyone.

I have no doubt in my mind that you possess the necessary skill to "blow" your IPT Rebuild kit sooner or later as well.

Thirdly, you say, "IPT is a great company, but you have to admit you have not been around that long, so how many auto DSM trannies can you have possibly built where you can say you have had only one ever fail?"

Actually, I have been rebuilding performance transmissions since 1987 when I started in the transmission business. I have countless seven second domestic transmissions under my belt, although these individuals generally don't visit internet forums.

I overhauled my first Mitsubishi transmission in 1988, at the age of 18, in my garage/driveway. While it wasn't a performance transmission, even then I was trying to find ways to make it better.

I have been doing performance import transmissions on the local level (NYC Metro Area) since I discovered that there was a need for them, which is about 5-6 years. So again, without facts, don't claim to know how many Mitsubishi transmissions we may or may not have done.

If you want to say that, “I personally want someone to design something different”. We just broke our own record for ET in an A/T DSM by a substantial margin by running a 9.70 last weekend. How do you think that real development work gets done?

In your post you state, "I don't want to sit here and start any arguments", however, when you call me a liar, call Russ a liar and unfairly attack a person and a company, I can see no other motivation for your post.

In conclusion, if you would like to go on the internet and say what a shop's transmission can and cannot do or what it can or cannot hold up to- at least have the facts.

If you don't actually own one of our transmissions, any statement that you may make about their quality or suitability for a particular use really lacks any sort of credibility.

Good day.
-John

 

[98TalonTSi]

4. 98TalonTSi acts like IPT pays you for all the posts you write. IPT owes you a turbo upgrade to prove their tranny for all the compliments you write. But seriously, make some more power before you claim it to be the holy grail.

You got some balls man....why don't you run his trans daily making decent power and then open your mouth.
Are you making over 450+ horsepower at every rpm level....not even close...even over a few thousand rpms...i seriously doubt it...that's a peak power level, one where I doubt you'll ever get to in daily driving especially if you're from NJ lke me, then the only time you can go WOT is late at night...
Furthermore, I may not have made much power then, but I have a lot of mods, and a lot of potential, like anything else it takes time, money, and learning to get your car where the power potential is, ask Russ after his three years he spent in the 10s....John is a good friend of mine, but on top of that he is a hell of a mechanic and trans rebuilder I don't make false claims...if I did I'm sure others than just you would be blasting me, but funny you're the first.
I drive my car everyday for many miles, in lost of traffic...it holds up incredibly, I also take my car to the track and beat on it, launching at 4000 rpms with FWD consistantly without problems. John also looked out for me when Level 10 tried to sell me a 5000 rebuild kit but turned me right away when I said it'll be tough to afford it, John on the other hand spent an hour looking over my car and bought me dinner, which I went back 6 months later for minor trans work, and a year later for my full rebuild.
In time, I will make more power, it's not John's job to buy me a turbo it's my car....we'll see what I do then, and we'll also see how you will come and go with your comments.
No arguments..case closed.
Mike

 

[InvaderGSX]

Once again everyone likes to take everything the wrong way. I sat there and said IPT is probably the best available auto tranny place for DSM's around. And I never said anything bad about your quality of work at all. I just pointed out a few misleading points that I found in the thread. I didn't mean you haven't been rebuilding trannies for that long. I was saying since you designed your own clutches. Before which was not that long ago you were using the same Alto clutches that Level 10 uses. Now you have your own. Since you came out with those new dseign clutches how many DSM trannies have you built? You don't really have to answer that question, but I just don't believe that number is high. And yes I know it's factual when I can say if your an auto DSM guy running 11's or faster or 500+ HP at the wheels people in the auto community will know who you are. You say back that statement up with facts well since you put me on the spot with that I say the same to you. Name the people because you claim they exist. I know they don't. You guys sit there and reply to what I said saying that my post is not factual. Name a thing not factual that is not misinterpreted. You can't. Transdude has valid points and I never said anything bad about your company. I'm just pointing out that currently there is no street driven Auto DSM in the 11's or running 450+ HP rolling with an IPT tranny. And instead of calling me a liar about that statement, prove it. Those are facts until you can name a single person to disprove me. Plain and simple. My post about Russ. He cannot tell me that is not true because it is. And my only point which I am trying to get across is can this tranny hold up to a car making 450+ HP to the wheels. I didn't say it couldn't I just want to see it happen. And what is up with 98talontsi talking about making 450+ HP at every RPM level. Well no crap it's peak power. I thought that was a given buddy. With a Big 16G on an automatic with no n2o you'll be lucky to reach 300 hp with whatever supporting mods you have. So whatever you say in this thread doesn't apply to you. I beat on a stock tranny with a Big 16G for a year and never blow it up, so what's your point? I'm not trying to talk bad about anybody, and if you reread my posts a couple times before you go nuts you'll see that I am just pointing out a few things and my main point is a street driven 450 HP+ auto dsm with an IPT tranny is what needs to be seen. Prove that there are so many DSM IPT trannies wtih big turbo's on the street as you imply that there is by saying there isn't is a lie because not everyone is on the net. Well prove me wrong. You guys tell me to back things up with facts. What you guys claim is easier to prove. And if you could you would. 98talontsi brought up Russ in this thread not me. If you can prove anything I said to be false then prove it otherwise there is just no point to argue about it. Yeah it's a big statement I made that there is no street driven 450+ HP to the wheels auto DSM with an IPT auto tranny, so make me look stupid and prove me wrong.

 

[transdude]

Whatever man.

I'm not going to sit here and get into a flame war.

I'm a little too old to play kiddy games on internet forums. I have a business to run, which among other things includes building the world's fastest DSM automatic transmissions.

I always believed that actions speak much louder than words, so I will let my products and workmanship speak for themselves.

-John

 

[LandoAWD]

Whatever man.

I'm not going to sit here and get into a flame war.

I'm a little too old to play kiddy games on internet forums. I have a business to run, which among other things includes building the world's fastest DSM automatic transmissions.

I always believed that actions speak much louder than words, so I will let my products and workmanship speak for themselves.

-John

Well said John.

Lets keep this factual and stay away from the back and forth bickering. Something to say about IPT? Offer proof. IPT responding? Offer proof.


I will not let this continue and turn into vendor bashing, or product bashing without some sort of factual basis.

Continue for now...but be warned...

Also, if you DO provide basis for statements you make, it is quite hard to find them in an unformatted post. It is VERY hard to take someone seriously who can't find the "Enter" key on the keyboard.

 

[98TalonTSi]

Peak power...exactly my point, so what's makes you think that driving a car daily that you'll ever see that power, get it now. Leo from Carbonwerks is running low 12s on a daily driven small 16g AWD 2G, and I know he drives a distance to get there. And what makes you think that you can't get to 300 hp, why not? It's all in the tuning so who knows, only time will tell.
If you weren't attacking anyone than you should have reread it yourself instead of telling me to, then think how someone else would take it.
But the question of this thread was max HP on AT with shift kit and end clutch, so let's stop talking about fully built trans' here. The answer is who the hell knows and frankly who cares, the stock trans internals were not made to hold huge power, so enjoy the trans while it lasts.
Mike

 

[tom1995tsi]

Like i said ill find out for myself. I dont have the will to put $2800 into an auto when i could convert it to a manual for that price. So Ill see how it all works out.

 

[Eclipsei95cl]

But the question of this thread was max HP on AT with shift kit and end clutch, so let's stop talking about fully built trans' here.

Not to start an argument, but Russ Coxe is making some serious power, and puts his trans through hell....when John at IPT pulled it apart, there was nothing wrong with it... Not saying it's bulletproof, but you do the math....

Yeah no one talked about built trannys until you did..But when it comes to this subject built trans and other stuff to make your tranny hold more power will come into play

Ok everyone Russ,John,98talontsi me and invader arent in any way believe IPT builds $hit trannys. If you look in our other posts we said IPT is the best dsm auto tranny builders out there and no one comapares. So you guys act like were flaming IPT trannys when were not. The only question we are asking is can a street driven IPT trans last on a car that drives to work back and forth,make track passes, has around 400 or more hp to the wheels, and last for 5k miles with no problems? Then it seems you guys say yeah when no one is actually puttin that power down with your tranny besides russ. Who is a drag car and we are talken about street driven cars. I mean you say why do we question your trannys, well its like this if im gonna spend about 3 grand to get the full ipt treatment im gonna want to ask questions and see proof that it last on high hp cars. So far we havent seen anyone with a 400+ hp street driven dsm with a full ipt trans with no problems. We cant just assume that your trans can hold 400 or more to the wheels problem free..Just like how you said john that Level 10 claims a bulletproof trans and supports 750hp, and we obviously cant assume that right..? Because there isnt no proof. We cant assume anything without seeing any of those people out there making that power on ipt trans. Also I dont doubt your trans building skills john and I dont doubt that your trans could hold that power but we just wanna see proof because there isnt anybody so far. Remember its not that we think its impossible just nice to know if there are guys out there making that power without troubles like you said.

Whatever man.

I'm not going to sit here and get into a flame war.

I'm a little too old to play kiddy games on internet forums. I have a business to run, which among other things includes building the world's fastest DSM automatic transmissions.

I always believed that actions speak much louder than words, so I will let my products and workmanship speak for themselves.

-John

NO flaming has been intended here, actions do speak louder than words and your products should speak for themselves, I strongly agree with that statement but there isnt anyone out there so far that we know of that puts the big hp numbers on a street driven dsm.So how can your products and workmanship speak for themselves when we havent seen anything with a street driven hp monster. Im sure they exist like you say but where are they? So in closing yes IPT is the best, and does build the worlds fastest dsm automatic transmissions but do you guys build the worlds most reliable dsm transmissions?

Like invader said we just want proof and if you do thats great and would be better for your business for people to know that your trans can hold the power and be a daily driver. Then we can say ipt is as bulletproof as you can get.

The answer is who the hell knows and frankly who cares

Ok lets spend a crap load of money and have the trans break. You there just questioned the fact that you dont even know if the trans will hold up and you dont care if it does?

Its just i dont want to spend the money if i dont know if it can last that long when there isnt anyone we have seen out there that has ran the full ipt tranny with 400+hp..and I wouldnt wanna be the guinea pig to experiment with it. Remember IPT is great, russ and john your definitley respected in the auto dsm game so dont misinterpret this that were attackin you guys personally.

Thanks Lando for keeping this thread open as this is not a flaming war but a question to see if IPT trans are as bulletproof as they get and if they can withstand the punishment of daily driving and with 400+hp. Sorry for the long post

 

[InvaderGSX]

Finally someone understands what I was getting at. That one simple point to prove that there is street driven 450+ HP DSM sporting an IPT tranny is the only question that needs to be answered. It would have been real easy to prove me wrong if they exist, but instead I guess I am playing kiddie internet games. Insulting me was another way of simply admiting they do not exist at this point in time. I never insulted transdude in anyway. I just simply pointed out that there is not any 450+ HP street driven Automatics sporting an IPT tranny. He implied in the post that there is, so I asked him to prove me wrong which would be very simple to do if they exist. So instead I get insulted rather than just admiting they don't exist. 98talontsi for some reason doesn't understand my point. You come back with a post name dropping a place that is running a small 16G that runs 12's. Didn't I say 11's and 450HP a thousand times in my posts? So once again that has nothing at all to do with proving me wrong. Big Turbo + Street Driven + 450+ HP + 11 seconds or faster + automatic IPT tranny is the simple equation. Out of that equation you get street driven and the automatic IPT tranny. That's it. When you said: "Are you making over 450+ horsepower at every rpm level....not even close...even over a few thousand rpms...i seriously doubt it...that's a peak power level" that made me laugh as that is very very common sense. I know for 100% fact no automatic DSM can make 450 HP in every RPM level. You have to make boost to make power buddy. Obviously in a DSM the power is on the top end as our cars lack on the bottom. Street driven just means a car that is driven on the street. You can also go to the track, legally drive it on the highway, etc. A car that is towed to a track and never driven on the street is called a drag car. It's not a hard concept to understand. Automatics lose a lot of power to the wheels compared to a 5 speed. I am talking about power to the wheels not the crank. So yes it is very very difficult to get to 300 HP with a big 16G in an automatic, but I never said it was impossible. I know your not making 450+ HP was my point, so I was wondering why you keep arguing about something you have no idea about. I've been there and done that. From a Big28 turbo, 20G, 50 trim T3/T4, T61 T3/T4 to a To4r T3/T4 and all on a 2G. Carbonwerks running low 12's on an automatic 2G with a small 16G is very very impressive. No doubt about that. But even running low 12's I really don't think it is making 300+ HP unless it spraying. 1G's are more likely, but 2G's are more difficult. I personally know a friend locally with a 1G 5 speed running the stock 14B and even the stock 1G MAS that ran a 12.8. Which blows my mind as his car only dynoed at 190 hp. And yes I do have balls for making the statements I did because I knew that they don't exist and when I saw that it was implied in the thread that they do exist I had to get involved. Fast DSM automatics are a rare breed and a very small minority. I'm one of the very few that has stayed with an automatic running a big turbo as most get sick of that damn thing breaking and going to the darkside. And I am pretty stupid because TRE is an hour away from me. They probably could name 1000 people running 500+ HP manual DSM's!!!

 

[RuBiCaNT5X]

InvaderGSX - I will tell you why there are no people running big turbos with AT's.. No one wants to spend the time nor effort to make the car fast. How many have either sold thier car or swapped it to a 5speed. I am willing to bet the number is quite large. Hell, I even had my car on the block to be potentially sold. When it didn't, I decided to keep it.

Here is why DSM people drive 5 speeds

1) It's more fun to shift gears than to let some computer do it for you
2) Not as much power is robbed in a MT as compared to a AT
3) MT's are easier to work on than AT's
4) Import AT's are generally considered weak and laughable

Now, how many people out there with 5 speeds blow up thier transmissions? I am willing to bet that the ratio of AT's that fail vs MT's that fail is quite a bit different favoring the automatics. I am also willing to bet that most of the reasons that AT's fail is because the driver is a moron. Neutral drops, brake torquing past the stall speed of the TC, poor tranny maintenance or modding the valve body when they don't have a clue are the prime reasons that they break.

As far as Russ Coxe is concerned, he has done great, great things for people with AT's in that he proved that properly built AT's can handle a HUGE turbo at high boost. The last 2 times I heard or saw him race, ('04 DSM Shootout and his most recent trip) his engine failed and NOT his transmission. In fact, I have not heard one peep from him about any sort of tranny problems.

IPT is probably one of the best transmission companies on the east coast, if not in the country for import AT's. In my many conversations with John, he knows his stuff and posts his expertise on ATDSM.com as well. The performance shops that deal in AT's come to John for help when they get stumped on a problem. Discrediting a shop because someone took a rebuilt kit and f'd the install is wrong as well...

Until there is solid proof that AT's fail and Russ Coxe himself is saying, "F' this AT thing, I am swapping to MT beacause this thing (built AT) breaks way too much..." Then I wil consider crediting your claims...

 

[98TalonTSi]

Ok lets spend a crap load of money and have the trans break. You there just questioned the fact that you dont even know if the trans will hold up and you dont care if it does?

Its just i dont want to spend the money if i dont know if it can last that long when there isnt anyone we have seen out there that has ran the full ipt tranny with 400+hp..and I wouldnt wanna be the guinea pig to experiment with it. Remember IPT is great, russ and john your definitley respected in the auto dsm game so dont misinterpret this that were attackin you guys personally.

Thanks Lando for keeping this thread open as this is not a flaming war but a question to see if IPT trans are as bulletproof as they get and if they can withstand the punishment of daily driving and with 400+hp. Sorry for the long post

So I was the first one to bring up Russ' built trans, then I stand corrected. Now you're comparing a built trans to last when the initial question is not about a built trans. That's what my " Who the hell knows and who the hell cares" comment stems from, the fact that a shift kit and end clutch is not a fully built IPT trans...hell if you bought a rebuild overhaul kit from John, it's still not the built IPT trans. His trans' entail a lot more than just what's stated on the site.
So again, who knows how much power only a shift kit and end clutch trans can hold. Many things can fail on a stock trans with those mods, and frankly it's sometimes the stupidest of things...namely heat.
Why do you need other proof besides Russ' trans. I make the statement again, obviously common sense, no one is making 400+ whp across a huge rpm band, and if you drive it daily in traffic, and again like me in crowded NJ, how the hell are you ever going to get to the power level anyway?? The answer is you can't, and I can gaurantee you that if you go WOT driving it daily or at the track, and you take care of the trans properly, then something else will blow before your trans.
Also, why are you so obsessed with this 11 sec/400+ hp number. You yourself, claiming experience should know that it is not easily attainable. When I dynoed my car, I didn't have a WB 02 and had a bunch of other problems, including a failing trans. Now having fixed my trans, and taking care of some tuning, I easily put enough torque and HP to destroy a stock trans. Is it hard to believe that only making 75 + hp over stock is enough to but the stock trans to bed. I flow easy 30 lb./min at 17 psi =~300 hp, take out 30% and that's still suggestive of 270 whp. I have no trans problems yet and trust me I beat on my trans, to the point where John yells at me that I'm gonna hurt stuff when test driving it out of his shop.
And finally, I understand the concern for spending the amount without proof, and the fact that your not flaming or doubting an IPT trans. But I think point and case is that what other options do you really have? So keep blowing up stock, shift kitted/end clutched/coolered, and Level 10 transmissions. Funny how you took other people's word for it once, without an ounce of proof, now you have proof, and a stand-up guy to back up his work, and you're doubtful? Just to give you an idea about John...a good amount of his customers become his friends, myself included, and there's a reason for that.
I'm done with this thread.
Mike

 

[InvaderGSX]

First of all for Rubican I never discredited IPT about a rebuild kit going bad. I have no idea where you read that from as I never blew up his kit. And I went over and over saying that IPT is probably the best around for AT DSM's. I just pointed out that transdude implied on here that there are a lot of street driven big turboed AT's sporting an IPT tranny and all I asked him to do was back that up. And for 98talon once again your not getting the point. I am obsessed with the 450+ HP street driven car as my car has that potential if I can keep a tranny alive. I have all the supporting mods for that. So yeah I could care less what you say because you are running a Big 16G. Handling 270 HP for your estimate of your car is not the info I need. So yeah being done with this thread for you would make sense because everything you are saying does not apply to you. Saying that you cannot make 400+ HP on the street is ludacris. Point is your car is taking more of a beating if your max power is 450 hp compared to a car that maxes at 300 hp no matter how fast or slow you are driving. And yes my car has broken nearly everything on my way up the scale, but since then everything else is pretty much built strong. In the last year I have not broken a single other thing besides the tranny. The tranny is the weak link. All I was doing is pointing out things that people said on here that was either misleading or false or doesn't pertain to them. I had one simple question that I wanted answered to back up what someone claims and he couldn't do it and that is all I was getting at.

 

[98TalonTSi]

Ok, just because my car doesn't personally make that power yet, doesn't mean my ideas are discredited. There's a logical reason for my turbo choice, it's a quick and cheap replacement for the plagued T-25. I've had my car all of a year and a half. If John doesn't want to dig up customers with large turbos then so be it. If you can make the power, and haven't found an example to follow, then stop the internet BS, and lead it...and I don't have to tell you who's trans will obvious hold the power, since you already agree IPT is the way to go.

 

[tom1995tsi]

So how about a estimate of what a shift kit, end clutch, and tranny cooler could hold hp wise? Do you think it could hold up to a to4b turbo with a fmic, 650 injectors, ect. ? Just trying to get back on track here.

 

[InvaderGSX]

To 98Talontsi. You basically contradict yourself. In this situation your ideas are discredited. I asked a question that is for people that have been there and done that, not an idea or assumption. Someone with the experience who has taken their car to that level. You just admited you have only been in the dsm game for a year and a half and admit that you only run a Big 16G. So yeah anybody can sit there and say they have ideas. I'm not looking for an idea or a biased customer who has gone out to eat and worships the owner of IPT. Your a guy who I have seen post so many replies and answers on this AT forum answering questions that you have personally not experienced. You have been in the game for a year and a half, run a 14 second big 16G automatic 98 Talon and you act as if your the man with all the answers. I checked out your list of mods. 13's should be very simple with what you have. Sell your 272 intake cam and go with a 264 as that is way too much on an auto running a Big 16G. When you actually pull down some more power in your car you'll see that a 4000 stall converter is too high for your Big 16G. I am assuming you have a FWD since you had a LSD installed. When you actually have your car tuned in and try to launch at 4000 you'll see that your losing way too much traction. With a GM MAFT and dsmlink that Big 16G would already be at full boost by 4000 rpm. Your just losing traction on your launch. I had a 4000 stall on my big laggy turbo with a stroker 2.3 shortblock and 4000 was plenty for a turbo that didn't even get any boost until 3000 rpm. So when you sit there and say you beat on the tranny all the time it doesn't answer my question because I know how weak an auto 2G DSM feels with a Big16G turbo and I personally never had a problem with my tranny even when the tranny was stock when I was running the Big28. I never had any problems until I went 20G and above. You'll know what I mean when down the road you upgrade your turbo to something bigger. I couldn't get into the 12's with the Big28 and the big28 is very similar to the Big 16G. It just didn't do me any justice. I only had the Big28 for 3 months. 20G for another 3 months. Finally a big 4" inlet T61 T3/T4 put my ass back in the seat. I didn't even care anymore how crappy it was down low. Because once I hit 45 mph and around 4500 rpm I was out of there. That is the kind of power I am talking about supporting on the trans. So yeah, to me, what you are saying doesn't matter as you have not reached that level yet. Can you understand my point now???

To Tom1995tsi: I am not familiar with a T04B. I take it as a T3/T4. An end clutch fix is good for the over drive. And while you are racing you don't want to use the overdrive. I just really doubt it will last very long with that setup. Everything depends on how many miles are on the tranny, how much abuse it went through before you owned it and while you owned it. So to answer your question adding a shift kit and adding the end clutch fix really isn't going to make it handle the power you'd be running. I personally never used the overdrive on boost. On the highway I would get up to the speed limit while cruising and then click on the overdrive. With the end clutch fix you don't have to be that paranoid about it. But hey there are people that have been very lucky with the stock transmission. I however have not been lucky with an auto period. In your post your talked about for $2800 you can convert to a manual. In a FWD your could, but in an AWD it costs a lot more than you think. If you have an AWD I recommend selling the car and just buying one with a 5 speed in it. Why? Transfer case is different, rear end is a little different and a 2G AWD 5 speed tranny is not cheap even for a used one. You'd still have to have it built up a little or you can get lucky and find a 97-99 5 speed with the double syncro 2nd gear. 95-96's don't. It's just a lot more complicated to convert an AWD auto to an AWD 5 speed compared to a FWD. FWD is really simple. Even in the FWD's the axles are different also from auto to manual. Aother thing bad about making a lot of power with a manual is your gonna need a 6 bolt block eventually. Throwing in an ACT 2100 or 2600 your bound to crankwalk. There's fricken so many positives and negatives with everything especially for the 2G's. There really is no perfect solutions. It's a DSM......

 

[tom1995tsi]

http://www.bullseye-power.com/product_info.php?cPath=37&products_id=38

 

[98TalonTSi]

Invader...I've always seen you're point, but this is really a stupid internet ghey argument. What the hell is the difference if I've never made the power yet or other BS. And in the year and a half I've experienced a lot so far, and I do all my own work except rebuilding a transmission. As far as setup goes, you don't have the slightest clue as to what my goals are, I learned early in the game, to set something realistic and not try and do something twice. A large turbo isn't too far down the road as well as a few other parts.
You also don't have to tell me about traction, I know too well on street tires, but I've got slicks, so the higher the RPM, the better my 60'. And do you think that 14.2@102 was with half those mods? Literally all I had was an exhaust, intake, and B16g...so a 2.3 is not that bad a 60' for FWD AT and neither is a 102. No contradiction here.....
You could've simply answered you don't know to his question.....No one does. Sorry Tom, that's just one of those questions, but for the price of those mods, it's worth it, and it will hold a more than stock, but who knows for how long. I've heard nothing about bullseye, so can't comment.
Well, since all that's going on is insults, and you're the first person to bust me for trying to always help people, now I'm really done with this thread. I'm the type of guy to ask the questions and that's how I know the answers, get it. My conversions with John go far beyond than what I'm sure you can comprehend just by your posts.
Mike

 

[95TSiNewbie]

great thread, very imformative information based on fact, experience, and opinion.
Tom: If you try and pick some of this apart, a stock A/T w/ shift kit, clutches and tranny cooler can with stand upwards of 300hp easily...IF the tranny is in good shape. I personally know a guy running a 50trim at 22psi (est. 375whp with along list of other mods) daily on a stock tranny(110k miles) with just end clutchs. Everyone has there own expiences with A/T, the kits from IPT are great, if your tranny fails from riding it to hard. Remember its the tranny not the clutches or shift kit you added....and if it is, im sure IPT would glady replace if it wasnt installed wrong. But that is my personal OPINION and experience.