Looking for experience with 1G AWD inner front CVJ wear!

[TrevorS]

Jacked the passenger side nose today in hopes of finding goodies stranded in the lower engine compartment and happily found the base timing adjust connector cover I lost yesterday ! It had fallen onto a lower brace in the battery area. Unfortunately, still no sign of my 13mm deep socket from a few days further back .

However, I think I've identified a lot of the loud clunk I frequently hear when changing between reverse and forward. When I hand rotate the rear drive shaft, the driver side inner CVJ makes a very obvious clunk. Since the passenger wheel was off, I tried listening to the passenger side while rotating the hub, and it also clunks, though not as loud. So, both inner CVJs have a few degrees of play, though more driver side than passenger, both are still OE, and both boots are fine. Guess at aprox 130Kmi, they're both just worn, though didn't notice any sound from the passenger outer CVJ which is also OE, but was repacked with grease same time the driver outer CVJ was replaced.

I also listened at the transfer case, but couldn't hear anything. However, since the rear wheels were down and I was still able to rotate the drive shaft a few degrees to cause the front CVJ noise, I think the rest of the clunk is probably the rear differential (car has always clunked towards the rear).

Any thoughts on the inner CVJs?

 

[TrevorS]

Guess, I should try again ! I've 130 Kmi on my GSX and it's been pretty conservatively driven (no racing, very occasional quick acceleration). About 8 Kmi ago my front drivers outer boot ripped and the CVJ became contaminated. My dealer replaced the CVJ and boot and I wanted the passengers boot replaced as well (thinking preventative maintenance), so he repacked the right and installed a new boot. I was recently under the nose and thought I'd try to locate the source of the increasingly loud clunk I frequently hear when changing between forward and reverse. The familiar drive shaft lash was still there (was always a clunk from under the center/rear of the car), but I noticed a definite clunk from the drivers inner CVJ when the shaft reached its limit in both directions. The passengers wheel was off so I tried rotating the hub and could also hear a slight clunk from that inner CVJ. I listened to the joints individually. Didn't hear anything from either of the outer joints.

So, what I'm thinking is that the current "clunk" is a combination of all three sources of lash which is why it's become louder. Thing is, the passenger's outer CVJ is just as old as the two inner and only a short time ago re-greased, since the outer are stressed more (due to turns) is it reasonable the inner could be beginning to fail or might it be something else? What's normal life for these front inner and outer joints given good boots and non-performance driving?

=======================A LITTLE LATER=========================

Just came across this discussion which probably answers my questions. It says normal CVJ life is 100 Kmi or more. If so, then it looks like my ~130 Kmi may be perfectly reasonable. It also says repacking a joint with grease doesn't do much good since that doesn't fix the wear within the joint, though I guess it could help slow further wear down a little. Plus it says inner joints don't click, just the outer.

My interpretation is if an axle has 80 Kmi or more and there's a CVJ problem, the entire axle should be replaced, not just a single joint. Also, it doesn't make sense to replace a still good boot regardless of miles. I just didn't know what lifetime to expect for CV joints, was under the impresion they would last indefinitely given good boots! Obviously not true ! So in my case, the inner joints are clunking due to normal wear and need to be replaced. The repacked outer isn't clunking by hand, but probably only because the grease is hiding it -- engine torque would probably result in something audible. Guess I just need to replace the two axles.

http://autos.yahoo.com/maintain/repairqa/t.../ques111_0.html

 

[Lofty]

Any moving parts will indefinitely fail!


I would just go ahead and replace them all, it's not too bad of a job.


How do your carrier bearings look? Are they cracked? Or do you have any driveshaft slop? This will also be a part of your clunking you hear.


I wouldn't mess with repacking as they are really old Axles!

130k miles? Wow!

--Scott

 

[TrevorS]

Any moving parts will indefinitely fail!


I would just go ahead and replace them all, it's not too bad of a job.


How do your carrier bearings look? Are they cracked? Or do you have any driveshaft slop? This will also be a part of your clunking you hear.


I wouldn't mess with repacking as they are really old Axles!

130k miles? Wow!

--Scott

I bought the car new and even back then I'd occasionally hear a distinct clunk when changing between forward and reverse (starting from stop with light throttle). Back then, I heard it was the normal AWD clunk ("Yeah, they do that ") and when the car was being worked on a few years back (~10 Kmi), I asked the dealership to check the rear drive train because of the clunk (always seemed a little odd to me that a car would do that) and they said it was fine. I think the rear lash is in the differential, not the shaft (FWIW it's the viscous LSD type). The clunking from the front is relatively recent, not sure when it became significantly audible -- the windows have to be down to clearly hear it.

I've tended to be a fairly easy driver and so I'm guessing that's why the axles have lasted pretty well (a little less easy since a few mods the last couple years . Haven't looked into the carrier bearings, though as I said, the rear clunk has been there since new. I can definitely hand rotate the shaft a few degrees near the transfer case with the rear wheels down, that's how I was listening to the left front inner CVJ. A couple years back I checked at the differential for drive shaft lash, but I was actually looking to see if it was at the front as well, and it was, but I didn't pursue it at that time (that may actually have been the inner CVJs). My understanding has been differential lash is just the way these cars are.

 

[TrevorS]

I bought the car new and even back then I'd occasionally hear a distinct clunk when changing between forward and reverse (starting from stop with light throttle). Back then, I heard it was the normal AWD clunk ("Yeah, they do that ") and when the car was being worked on a few years back (~10 Kmi), I asked the dealership to check the rear drive train because of the clunk (always seemed a little odd to me that a car would do that) and they said it was fine. I think the rear lash is in the differential, not the shaft (FWIW it's the viscous LSD type). The clunking from the front is relatively recent, not sure when it became significantly audible -- the windows have to be down to clearly hear it.

I've tended to be a fairly easy driver and so I'm guessing that's why the axles have lasted pretty well (a little less easy since a few mods the last couple years . Haven't looked into the carrier bearings, though as I said, the rear clunk has been there since new. I can definitely hand rotate the shaft a few degrees near the transfer case with the rear wheels down, that's how I was listening to the left front inner CVJ. A couple years back I checked at the differential for drive shaft lash, but I was actually looking to see if it was at the front as well, and it was, but I didn't pursue it at that time (that may actually have been the inner CVJs). My understanding has been differential lash is just the way these cars are.

If anybody can shed any light on why my '90 AWD has always had lash in the rear drive train, I'd appreciate learning more. If it actually wasn't normal despite what I was told going back to it's early life, then I'd like to know about that. Since it's never developed into a problem over 130 Kmi, it's easy to believe it really is normal, despite being a little bizarre.