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Lets talk Difs.

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^^ True, but the C6 guys dont have troubles with lifting a wheel going through the twisties, at least not that Ive heard about or seen. If youre referring to the post by ACM, he didnt say he broke a Quaife; he was referring to using the EVO rear dif with the wrong inner axles on his car, which caused the splines to shear off. Quaife difs for the DSM are decent, but I wouldnt use a Quaife center dif because they are known to grenade in a DSM where they mesh with 3rd gear. Whether this is due to improper installation, or the dif simply cant handle massive amounts of torque, or maybe its happening when launching, but the failure rate is high enough that Quaife ceased the lifetime warranty on the center difs for the DSM.:p
 
You wouldn't want a helical diff in the rear of an AWD (2G) DSM - hard cornering unloads the inside rear and it will often come up off the ground, at which point a helical LSD becomes an open diff.

If you're picking up the inside rear at corner *exit*, then your diffs aren't the problem. What you've written is a good argument against a helical front, tho'.

Or are you actually arguing for a 2-way rear so that the diff helps keep the car pointed in the right direction on entry?
 
Several Honda users I know use them on their full blown drag cars with 25-26'' slicks running 9's @ 150's breaking the rear Quaife diff will not void any warranty they will fix / replace it for you. (in rear diffs)

I didn't state he broke one I've asked if he's broken one I keep hearing that line about Quaife's breaking they are nice differentials a step up from viscous IMO.
 
Why no center VC?

yeah i wasn't quite understanding it either. i thought having the center lsd would distribute the torque bias between front and rear wheels when tackling corners. And having center lsd would stop/reduce your front wheels from spinning at the drag strip for awd cars.
 
Stock center VC is slow reacting the quaife does a much better job but it's a 50:50 bias if only it were like the quaife for 3000GT's they are 20:80. Better than no VC though.
 
The Quaife center diff on the 2g at least is guaranteed to blow up and Quaife will not do anything for you. I would not put one into in my car in the center postion.

I think I read were a member on GVR4 forums called/email Quaife and the rep said there was no such warranty claim like that on the center diffs its the same P/N for 1g and 2g.


I'll email Quaife UK and ask them about that.
 
...if only it were like the quaife for 3000GT's they are 20:80.

Complete and utter nonsense. All helicals are 50/50. The OE center in a 3000GT is rear-biased, tho' (something like 45/55). I'll be charitable and assume that that's what you're thinking of.

Edit: Ah, I think I can see where this 20/80 idea came from. A lot of Quaifes are limited to 4:1 ratios, so the best that a Quaife can do is 20/80. But that doesn't make it a 20/80 diff. It makes it a helical that can only manage a 4:1 ratio. Hugely different.
 
yeah i wasn't quite understanding it either. i thought having the center lsd would distribute the torque bias between front and rear wheels when tackling corners. And having center lsd would stop/reduce your front wheels from spinning at the drag strip for awd cars.

The thinking behind a rear-biased center and a center VC is very different. You put in a rear-biased center diff to avoid tire-slip. You add a VC to the center to reduce tire-slip after it has already started. In theory, there is absolutely nothing to stop you from having both. This could be especially useful if you sometimes have to drive your rear-biased car on, for example, ice, where suddenly you'd be much better off with a front-bias, instead.
 
I think I read were a member on GVR4 forums called/email Quaife and the rep said there was no such warranty claim like that on the center diffs its the same P/N for 1g and 2g.


I'll email Quaife UK and ask them about that.

Then that is new. I personally talked and looked it up on the Autotech sport tunings website a few years back. I was both told and saw it in plain writing.
No warranty.
 
Unless it has recently started snowing at Satan's house, Quaife ain't warrantying their center diffs for DSMs.
 
Then that is new. I personally talked and looked it up on the Autotech sport tunings website a few years back. I was both told and saw it in plain writing.
No warranty.

I too have seen this on Quaife's site. I was going to get one for my car until I found out about that, because I like to drag race sometimes as well as road course and auto x, but id rather just have a 4 spider and be done with it rather than worry about grenading a Quaife. Just to be clear, the durability issue is with the Quaife CENTER dif only, not their front or rear difs, and specific to the DSM. The failure always seems to be specifically where the gear on the dif meshes with 3rd gear in our transmissions, and this is because 3rd is always under load, and the teeth on the center dif are prone to catastrophically shearing off the dif- which will more than likely destroy the rest of the guts. Ive spoken to Jack's Transmissions and TRE as well, and they both say no to the Quaife center if youre launching the car. Would this happen in a sub 500hp car that doesnt see any drag launches? Noone seems to know, but Id rather have the more durable 4 spider so I can drag the car if I want to, and people seem to be getting good results at the road course with the VC center when paired with the EVO rear and rip grip or quaife front, and the 4 spider is half the price.
 
I'm currently in the process of warrantying my Quaife center differential. So far it is taking forever but it seems like they will be fixing it. They only will not warranty it if the differential is taken out by other parts of the trans failing. In my case the differential was manufactured with improper tolerances on the gear teeth on the differential case.

Also of note is that Autotech no longer sells Quaife parts and their current US distributor is Motovicity in MI.
 
Complete and utter nonsense. All helicals are 50/50. The OE center in a 3000GT is rear-biased, tho' (something like 45/55). I'll be charitable and assume that that's what you're thinking of.

Edit: Ah, I think I can see where this 20/80 idea came from. A lot of Quaifes are limited to 4:1 ratios, so the best that a Quaife can do is 20/80. But that doesn't make it a 20/80 diff. It makes it a helical that can only manage a 4:1 ratio. Hugely different.

That was a guess off the top of my head from the last time I've read it he does advertise 40/60 assymetrical split to auto biasing 60/40 and 20/80 not a 50:50.

Supercar Engineering

So I did read that right someone on the GVR forum spoke to Quaife they do actually warranty the center.
 
That was a guess off the top of my head from the last time I've read it he does advertise 40/60 assymetrical split to auto biasing 60/40 and 20/80 not a 50:50.

Seriously, stop. We don't want your guesses and you clearly have no idea how a helical works. They are all GEARED to be 50/50. They can distribute torque anywhere from 20/80 to 80/20, but they are native 50/50 splits. They have to be.

At a minimum, read this before posting again, please: http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/newbie-forum/410949-awd-dsm-torque-split-distribution.html
 
Seriously, stop. We don't want your guesses and you clearly have no idea how a helical works. They are all GEARED to be 50/50. They can distribute torque anywhere from 20/80 to 80/20, but they are native 50/50 splits. They have to be.

At a minimum, read this before posting again, please: http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/newbie-forum/410949-awd-dsm-torque-split-distribution.html

Stop what ?
You need to relax.

What am I guessing now? I'm stating what he advertising on the page. I did not explain how a helical differential worked take that up with the owner of SuperCarEngineering.

Looks like there is some truth to that SCE diff I didn't see it the first time but that is not a Quaife it is a new type of helical made by Torsen BY DESIGN it is actually 40/60 nominal unlike the older T2 style which are just like Quaifes 50:50 that explains SCE description.

Torsen T-3 Differential
http://www.torsen.com/files/Torsen T-3 Technical Sheet.pdf

Audi forum discussion on them
JHM info regarding the T2 and T3 torsen center diff for B6/B7 S4s and RS4

There is even a list on the Torsen website of what vehicles use this type whats interesting is I know of the Chevy TrailBlazer SS but didn't know it used one specs advertised a 33/67 Torque Splits.

I also emailed him to confirm if its a T3 type

Email reply from SuperCarEngineering said:
Yes.

Philip
Supercar Engineering, LLC
http://supercar-engineering.com
(248)342-3231

On 10/14/2011 12:32 AM, David Steele wrote:
>
> Is that SCE Torsen a T3 type ?


I've been wanting to use a 3000GT trans on a DSM for a long time I felt DSM AWD need 6th gears on highways at higher speeds they are really buzzy. In addition the 3000GT has a 3.545 rear like a DSM rear differential gears widths are 1.5 are times as wide.

The product he has for them (even the Dog BOX is a hybrid of a helical and straight cut so its pretty streetable and quiet and still cheaper than DSM dog boxes )

I think I may start to make some DSM stew here and give this a shot.
 
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[deleted] My use of the word "helical" is too restrictive. A planetary Quaife *does* qualify as a helical.
 
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I'm currently in the process of warrantying my Quaife center differential. So far it is taking forever but it seems like they will be fixing it. They only will not warranty it if the differential is taken out by other parts of the trans failing. In my case the differential was manufactured with improper tolerances on the gear teeth on the differential case.

Also of note is that Autotech no longer sells Quaife parts and their current US distributor is Motovicity in MI.

^^ Notice that your dif failed in exactly the same way I described in earlier posts?:p I went to Quaife's webpage this morning, and they state that the center for the Eclipse is now subject to their lifetime warranty. This is a change from what I read several months back. I dug a little deeper, and found discussions about Quaife recently revising their design a bit, thus curing the issue. When did you buy yours? Im wondering if they decided to go ahead and just warranty the "old" style difs for everyone else.

On another note, I see youre using a Quaife front dif as well. Would you mind telling us what rear dif you are using in conjunction with the Quaifes, how the car drives on the track, etc??:hellyeah:
 
^^ Hey, Scott, do you have a price for those cups, or were they just included in the entire price of the Dif when you got it??
No, I got the diff, cups and axles all together used from another DSMer.

Why no center VC?
Initially I did run a center VC w/ the Cusco 35:65 due to the wheel spin I'd experience with the stock front & rear diffs. But once I got the front RipGrip and rear EVO8, I decided to try w/o the VC. That's how Charles runs his Cusco and and he perfers it. See his quote from page 1 of this thread:
I run Quaife front, Cusco Tarmac centre and TRE MaxLock rear diffs. The Quaife and TRE diffs are LSDs, the Cusco is an open diff just like the stock DSM centre diff. You can add the centre VC if required, but unless it's virtually worn out it's pointless - the inner and outer shafts of the Cusco rotate at different rpms all the time, even in a straight line, so the VC will try and pull the shafts back to equal rpms, which will result in a) a 50:50 diff and b) very weird transient handling as it changes from 35:65 AWD to locked 4WD mode. I know this to be true because at one point I tried the car that way and suffered accordingly.
To-date I've only had one autox and a few track days on mine w/o the VC, so I can't really make a judgement. Perhaps I'll try throwing the VC back on mid-season next summer so I can make a valid back-to-back comparison.
 
I would love to hear what happens if you put it back. Preference is, of course, the final decider and that's none of my business, but there's the idea around that you can't run a VC on top of a 35/65 (for reasons I cannot follow) and I'd love another data point on this. I can see no reason why you can't have a VC on top of a planetary.

ps. keep in mind that I never imagined that you could get around the problems of combining helical-style LSD with planetaries by using a carrier-in, sun- and casing-out arrangement, so lack of imagination is a known problem with me.
 
I'm running the stock rear diff still. I have done a few autocross events and some track days and I have found it to work pretty well. I unfortunately don't have much input on just changing the differential as when I installed them I also put in my 2.3l with the Holset so I also added a whole lot of power and I noticed that with the Quaife front/center and stock rear I can now get throttle induced over steer. But that may be just from adding 150hp.

In general my car is pretty neutral without much understeer and I only get oversteer when getting very aggressive on the throttle while still turning.
 
Bringing this back from the dead, as I have been looking into this stuff lately and this was a really good discussion. I hear rumor that the USDM Evo RS came with a helical front differential, can this be used in a DSM trans? Has anyone attempted this?
 
All Evo Xs have a helical front. Whether it would fit a DSM (which is doubtful) is moot, since you can just buy a Quaife for the front of any DSM for less than what a Quaife for an Evo costs. About $1200 for a DSM; about $1500 for an older Evo that didn't have one as OE.
 
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