Ideal cams ??????

[STECARS]

What do experienced tuners recommend for best bottom end power ?
But also considering that I want to spool my 16g asap .

TIA

 

[Zack Huffman]

I'm not super-experienced with cams, but I think I know basically how they affect the engine. (Anyone please feel free to correct me on any of this) I think you'd get the best bottom end power with the stock cams. However, the stock cams are a restriction at higher rpms and some moderately larger cams like 264's can give you very close to the same bottom end, but with a much increased top end. I believe it's really the overlap that determines your peak torque location. More duration however will almost always mean more overlap and a higher rpm torque peak.

Personally I've been wondering about using the 256 intake cam from a 1G non-turbo (turbos had a 248 intake) with a 264 exhaust cam from an aftermarket shop. I think this would save bottom end well, but yet allow a big improvement in top end. Should have a stock-like idle too. ??

 

[andymoraitis]

I'd stick with 264's, FP1x's or Comp 100's. If you want to change the range of RPM where the cams have the greatest effect, investing in a good set of adjustable cam gears will help you dial them in to suit the motor's power range.

 

[TSIfreek]

FP 1s or comp 100s pull like a sum bi*** on my 16g

 

[STECARS]

Thanks for the quik responses guys.
But let me be a little more detailed .........

Ive been looking at crower , comp, and ffwd , etc........
My setup Is a bit different than in ,y profile cuase currently going thru some changes

So....
Stock rebuilt 7 bolt longblock
255 lph with 660's
maft and maf translator with s-acf II
fmic
etc...etc....

Believe it or not right now with the setup I have in my profile The 50 trim see's full boost (18 psi ) just a hair under 3500 rpms
but thats still not good enough
So I'm gonna put a 2g head back on for better bottom end and a 16g for fast spool.
However I figured if i mildly upgraded the cams I could spool the turbo even quicker without compromising any bottom end power . Also keep in mind I am automatic so I will rarely see 6000 rpms and 1995 so no adj. cam gears that I know of .........


This is what Ive found

Crower Cams

Manufacturer: Crower
Product: Cams
MSRP: $400.00
(MSRP is typically higher than most shop prices)
Description:
Crower billet cam cores allow for unlimited specifications, while maintaining factory 1.180" base circle. Choose from dyno proven turbo grinds. Stage 1 - Street use, emphasis on bottom end. 235 / 232, 188 / 188, .391 / .372 ...




FFWD L1

These custom cams are a "plug and play" proposition. These specs were reached in order to give you a fantastic balance between race and street use. Good bottom/mid range torque for that seat of the pants feel in between the stoplights, but still will pull in the upper registers for those high RPM jaunts to the burger joint. They exhibit a slight lope but because the duration isn't too crazy, your vacuum isn't killed either. The next notch above factory specs. Should pass your local emissions law with no problem. Best of both worlds!

INTAKE

Max Valve Lift: .379"

Duration @ .050": 185 crank degrees

Lobe Center: 82 degrees ATDC

EXHAUST

Max Valve Lift: .379"

Duration @ .050": 189 crank degrees

Lobe Center: 98 degrees BTDC

$350.00/pair (intake and exhaust)



Comp Serious Street/Race 101100


Comp 101100 Camshafts - These are SBR's coolest drop in fully streetable cam! For a long time, we didn't have anything that could compete with an HKS 264 cam. These are great streetable cams with a slightly more aggressive idle and lots of power in the 1800 to 6800 rpms range. Comp claims right on there website that the 101100 grinds will net you 20 horsepower right out of the box!




RPM operation range

1800 to 6800 Camshaft part
number

101100 Cam grind
number

DOHC Duration
advertised
Intake

251 Duration
advertised
Exhaust

250 Duration
@.050"
Intake

204
Duration
@ .050"
Exhaust

204 Valve lift
Intake

.407 Valve lift
Exhaust

.391


COMP 101100

Our Price:

$469.00



and also

The HKS 264/272 sorry I dont have the specs .

These all are the cams I'm considering
And also considering using the stock cams and just upgrading the springs or using 1g cams with upgraded spring

However the ffwd ls1 cam seems very mild and probably what I'm looking for ........
...

then the crowers then the comp100's


But what do I know .......

 

[andymoraitis]

For a 50 trim, a 272/272 combo or it's equivalent with adjustable cam gears will work fine. I'd call all the manufacturers (not the vendors who sell them) and ask them what they recommend for your combo. Either way, you'll need adjustables to get the most out of them.

Edit: If I read your last post correctly, you're going to change your 50 trim out for a 16G because spooling the 50 trim at 3500 isn't fast enough? Wow that makes no sense whatsoever to give up 13-14 lbs/min of airflow for a bit of spool. If I were you I'd leave the 50 trim and cam it to run more airflow instead of switching to smaller turbo and camming that instead.

Let me also add that too many people seem to get hung up on when a turbo spools. As long as it's not dead late, it doesn't mean a damn thing. The most important component making power (aside of tuning) is the ability to move large volumes of air. If we all drag raced at the strip from a third gear roll, I would say that spool matters but it's more important to create linear power throughout the RPM band and not simply bring the turbo on sooner. Boost is only a downshift away. Provided all things are somewhat equal, more airflow will always make more power in the absence of knock as long as A/F, timing and intake charge temps are at their optimum.

 

[STECARS]

Thanks for the quik responses guys.
But let me be a little more detailed .........

Ive been looking at crower , comp, and ffwd , etc........
My setup Is a bit different than in ,y profile cuase currently going thru some changes

So....
Stock rebuilt 7 bolt longblock
255 lph with 660's
maft and maf translator with s-acf II
fmic
etc...etc....

Believe it or not right now with the setup I have in my profile The 50 trim see's full boost (18 psi ) just a hair under 3500 rpms
but thats still not good enough
So I'm gonna put a 2g head back on for better bottom end and a 16g for fast spool.
However I figured if i mildly upgraded the cams I could spool the turbo even quicker without compromising any bottom end power . Also keep in mind I am automatic so I will rarely see 6000 rpms and 1995 so no adj. cam gears that I know of .........


Fellas keep in mind I'm automatic . Granted I have an IPT tran with all the goodies
It till not a 5sp. Alo I dont know how to get a adj. cam gear for my cas a I believe I must retain my stock intake cam gear becaue of my sensor

 

[Rick@AP]

Fellas keep in mind I'm automatic . Granted I have an IPT tran with all the goodies
It till not a 5sp. Alo I dont know how to get a adj. cam gear for my cas a I believe I must retain my stock intake cam gear becaue of my sensor

Huh? The CAS has nothing to do with whether or not you can have adjustable cam gears. All you need to do is drill and tap the cam for the sensor if the manufacturer didn't already do this.

 

[STECARS]

Huh? The CAS has nothing to do with whether or not you can have adjustable cam gears. All you need to do is drill and tap the cam for the sensor if the manufacturer didn't already do this.

there is no way to tap the 95 models as they use a cas thats working in conjunction with a trigger plate on the intake cam gear .


but If anyone knows how to retain the stock 95 cas and use adj. gears please fill me in .....

 

[daren_p]

Unless 95 is completely different, CAS is on one end of the intake cam (passenger side) and obviously the adjustable cam gears are on the timing belt side (drivers side). For I 95 I don't think you have to do anything for the CAS, its the 97-99 that you have to drill & tap the cam for the CAS, which alot of manufacturers do from the factory. Any cam you get over stock will hurt your spool, thats the nature of them. I run the FP 1X which has the duration of the FP1's, has the lift of the FP2's & adds an increased ramp rate so the amount of time the valve is at "max lift" will be longer. With these you need to run upgraded springs/reatiners. Even though the increased ramp rate is supposed to help with not losing as much spool I still lost around 100 rpms, but like Andy said, its defently worth the trade off. Spooling a 50 trim at 3500 defently isn't laggy, a 16g with cams will be basically the same. That is right where my evoIII currently spools with cams, pre cams it was 20 psi by ~3400.

 

[wishihadatalon]

a guy I know ran 2 turbo intake cams in his motor. Timing it can be a pain but he said it made way more lower end tq and it made a noticable difference on the top end too. Granted this is all hearsay but I would trust his judgement.

 

[Rick@AP]

there is no way to tap the 95 models as they use a cas thats working in conjunction with a trigger plate on the intake cam gear .


but If anyone knows how to retain the stock 95 cas and use adj. gears please fill me in .....

The cam angle sensor will work with every adj. cam sprocket I've seen so far.

 

[STECARS]

Unless 95 is completely different, CAS is on one end of the intake cam (passenger side) and obviously the adjustable cam gears are on the timing belt side (drivers side). For I 95 I don't think you have to do anything for the CAS, its the 97-99 that you have to drill & tap the cam for the CAS, which alot of manufacturers do from the factory.

my concerns are not the cams , its the adjustable cam gears


Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick@AP
Huh? The CAS has nothing to do with whether or not you can have adjustable cam gears. All you need to do is drill and tap the cam for the sensor if the manufacturer didn't already do this.



there is no way to tap the 95 models as they use a cas thats working in conjunction with a trigger plate on the intake cam gear .


but If anyone knows how to retain the stock 95 cas and use adj. gears please fill me in .....




The cas is on the driverside on 95-96 models mounted to the head and works in conjunction with a trigger plate on the intake cam gear so how do I use a adj. cam gear and keep my stock 95 cas ?

Ive no knowledge in this department

 

[prostreetdsmx1]

all you need to do is make sure to carry over the plate with the new cam gears. We have done this with Fidanza cams without issue.

 

[STECARS]

Ty Good Info



Anyone no wherre i can find info on the cams listed in regards to were there powerband is such as ......................The 100's 1800 rpms - 6800

Comp 101100 Camshafts - These are SBR's coolest drop in fully streetable cam! For a long time, we didn't have anything that could compete with an HKS 264 cam. These are great streetable cams with a slightly more aggressive idle and lots of power in the 1800 to 6800 rpms range.Comp claims right on there website that the 101100 grinds will net you 20 horsepower right out of the box!

Anyone know the powerband of the 264/272 combo ?

 

[nightspeed87]

Personally I've been wondering about using the 256 intake cam from a 1G non-turbo (turbos had a 248 intake) with a 264 exhaust cam from an aftermarket shop. I think this would save bottom end well, but yet allow a big improvement in top end. Should have a stock-like idle too. ??

See Ive heard a lot of low end to mid range torque claims from running the non turbo cams as well... ( With a little lose of top end, but if your not pushing a lot of air flow and high end power wont really matter. )
Ive contemplated the n/t cams as well, and was two inches away from being a genuie pig and trying myself. But got my hands on some decent dc cams instead ( which all they are supposeably is the best combo dsm cams in comparison to the stock cams. )

 

[allgripnoslip]

there is no way to tap the 95 models as they use a cas thats working in conjunction with a trigger plate on the intake cam gear .

http://roadraceengineering.com/1gcasin2g.htm


that will give you all the info you will need to take a 1g cas and make it work on any 2g, whether it be 95-96 or 97-99. I also have a friend on here that has done the swap and hasnt had any problems at all.(JJBrasil)