General 16G Questions

[mnetwork]

I am about to buy the EVO III 16G off of SBR and I had a question... With the 2g install kit (http://www.slowboyracing.com/more.php?id=93), the pipe that it comes with will replace the LICP? And this means I would not have to buy one? I also wanted to know how much you guys would recommend the "$100 upgrade" for the install kit and the 34mm gate... Thanks..

 

[mn95TSi]

the turbo outlets face different directions(between the t25 and mitsu) so the install kit points the outlet in the right direction to hook to the sidemount without the stock licp.

34mm is supposed to help prevent boost creep so the wastegate can let more gas around the turbine. supposed to work good if you aren't going to use an external gate.

 

[kenamond]

Since you have a large exhaust, you'll want all the wastegate help you can get. The evo3 is notorious for creep when you have a large exhaust.

If they have a porting option, you might want that (your profile doesn't list any ex. mani. mods, so if you have the turbine housing ported to a larger entrance size, you'll have to have your mani ported to match it), but they usually port it just to increase flow to the turbine and not necessarily the wastegate passage. Proper porting of the wastegate entrance within the turbine inlet portion of the housing is the way to fix or avoid creeping evo3. I'd definitely do your research on the evo3, or you may end up having to drop the turbo right after you install it to fix the creep.

Another option for dodging creep is an external wastegate, but then you have to get an O2 eliminator downpipe or somehow seal the internal gate - and you have to deal with where the dumped exhaust gas goes (feeds back into the downpipe - requires new or modified downpipe - or vents to atmosphere - LOUD).

 

[mnetwork]

I just bought a ported EVO III manifold off ebay yesterday for the turbo setup. So you reccomend porting the turbo too?

 

[kenamond]

Did it mention the size of the collector exit? If it's different (hopefully larger) than your evo3, then you have to port the smaller one to match the larger one, or you'll have a sudden change in size going out of the collector and into the turbine housing. I'm sure you could find out from SBR about the evo3, and you can probably talk to the ebay seller about the mani.

If you're going to pay for someone to do it, make sure they understand the wastegate porting issue. They may not provide an option to do the wastegate porting. I'm sure you can pay someone locally to do the port, but I'd only have them do it if they knew about turbine housing porting.

You could do it yourself, but it's not a 1 hour job and requires some tools (die grinder, burrs, dremel, bits, sandpaper). I did mine, but I did alot of research before I started. Very gratifying, but not a quicky. There's a great tech article called "How to fix boost creep by porting" or something similar if you're thinking about doing it yourself. Here is a picture of my B28 afterward (proud papa!!). Here is the before shot. Notice how much I opened up the wastegate entrance.

Hope this helps.

 

[mnetwork]

Yeah, I have a friend that used to work for an engine shop. I knows porting and polishing very well. I could have him do that to make them match.

 

[kenamond]

Go for it! Probably cost you less than having SBR port it (if your friend already has the tools), and you'd have some say in what was done and how. Just make sure your friend knows the wastegate issues.

And don't forget to mark the orientation of the turbine housing relative to the center section before you unbolt it, or things won't line up (you'll get the mani/O2 housing connected, but then the center section and compressor won't be "clocked" right, and your oil and coolant lines and LICP adapter won't line up). Scribe a line on the center section and turbine housing at the same point, then match them up when you put it back together after the port job.

 

[ShapeGSX]

People worry too much about boost creep.

 

[mnetwork]

People worry too much about boost creep.

What's your take on it??

 

[kenamond]

People worry too much about boost creep.

If you had a 3" exhaust, non-ported evo3 and creep, you'd worry about it.

Your profile shows that you have stock exhaust. The evo3 seems to only see a creep problem with large exhausts (2.5", no cat, or 3" w/ hi-flo cat). Perhaps your profile is out of date, and you actually have a 3" test pipe, no creep, and a non-ported evo3, and if this is the case, we'd love to hear about it. A less restrictive exhaust is where creep starts to become a problem.

mnetwork can do whatever he wants, but he already has a much larger exhaust than your profile indicates you have, so the comparison is not really very similar at all. It boils down to "do it right the first time."

If your profile is out of date, and you have a large exhaust, then I apologize.

 

[ShapeGSX]

If you had a 3" exhaust, non-ported evo3 and creep, you'd worry about it.

Your profile shows that you have stock exhaust. The evo3 seems to only see a creep problem with large exhausts (2.5", no cat, or 3" w/ hi-flo cat). Perhaps your profile is out of date, and you actually have a 3" test pipe, no creep, and a non-ported evo3, and if this is the case, we'd love to hear about it. A less restrictive exhaust is where creep starts to become a problem.

I have a 3" downpipe, 3" testpipe, and 3" exhaust. No creep.

My Evo III 16G wastegate is not ported. I have an Evo III exhaust manifold and the sealing ring that goes between the manifold and the turbo. Both the manifold and the Evo III have been port matched to the sealing ring. This may help eliminate creep by reducing exhaust turbulence.

I also have HKS 264I/272E cams, and they may help reduce creep by increasing intake flow.

Larger wastegate flappers reduce the ability to run high boost with small turbos like the 16Gs.

And since the wastegate actuator has such a small throw, the larger flapper that people put in is still in the way of the exhaust as it exits the wastegate hole. In fact, the larger flapper is a larger obstruction for the exhaust to have to flow around.

 

[mnetwork]

How bad does the larger flap affect this...

I have a 3" downpipe, 3" testpipe, and 3" exhaust. No creep.

My Evo III 16G wastegate is not ported. I have an Evo III exhaust manifold and the sealing ring that goes between the manifold and the turbo. Both the manifold and the Evo III have been port matched to the sealing ring. This may help eliminate creep by reducing exhaust turbulence.

I also have HKS 264I/272E cams, and they may help reduce creep by increasing intake flow.

Larger wastegate flappers reduce the ability to run high boost with small turbos like the 16Gs.

And since the wastegate actuator has such a small throw, the larger flapper that people put in is still in the way of the exhaust as it exits the wastegate hole. In fact, the larger flapper is a larger obstruction for the exhaust to have to flow around.