FMIC next??

[SpoOLxExO]

It's not my thread, hi-jack away!

The starion unit is good for moderate upgrade over stock.

Even though the unit is bigger, and placed in the front, it has a pressure drop of 4psi!

That means if your turbo is making 15psi, the manifold only sees 11.

But still a good budget upgrade over stock if you can get the piping run.

 

[Brandon92DSM]

It's not my thread, hi-jack away!

The starion unit is good for moderate upgrade over stock.

Even though the unit is bigger, and placed in the front, it has a pressure drop of 4psi!

That means if your turbo is making 15psi, the manifold only sees 11.

But still a good budget upgrade over stock if you can get the piping run.

I dont think that is technically correct, but I get the point you're trying to make. If your intake manifold (where the boost gauge is usually tapped) sees 15 psi, then 15 psi is what pressure the turbo is making. The difference in adding a higher flowing IC and larger IC piping is that the turbo doesnt have to work as hard to maintain that same pressure, which increases its efficiency at that pressure level. (Turbo outlet temps are cooler).

 

[Malero5]

i picked up a used core that that is prett darn big. It think it was 28/12/3, or something like that. Basically its a prett darn big FMIC and it only cost 150 bucks. I pressure tested it and it didnt leak at 20 psi (I capped one end amd put 20psi worth of pressure from my air compressor). I am guessing that the piping will cost be around 80 bucks with a DIY job.

The fact is, the sidemount has huge issue with heat soak. Your not going to boost more then 3 or 4 times without your car lagging a tad. If your worried about the air flowing through a large FMIC then think of this. How far away is the sidemount from the turbo? Its really faraway. As long as you keep you piping down to 2.5 inch or a little less then you shouldnt see and noticable torque loss. Not to mention you well see much larger gains form the air becomming denser form cooling off better. My FMIC will not only some noticable amount of hoarsepower, but it will allow me the ability to run 20 pounds of boost or so on a 16g when i get it. Your next step is go get a FPR/fuel pump and you will be able to knock 18psi all day long out of your turbo. Get some better tuning and you can push it to 20. FMIC's are great. Supra sidemounts are just really good for the sleeper affect and the ability to not heatsoak at 18psi.

 

[gixrman]

I dont think that is technically correct, but I get the point you're trying to make. If your intake manifold (where the boost gauge is usually tapped) sees 15 psi, then 15 psi is what pressure the turbo is making. The difference in adding a higher flowing IC and larger IC piping is that the turbo doesnt have to work as hard to maintain that same pressure, which increases its efficiency at that pressure level. (Turbo outlet temps are cooler).

Thats not true you will see pressure drop after IC bends in the piping create pressure drop. There isn't an intercooler made that doesn't have some form of drop I don't care who makes it. I will bet you if you $$ that if you have one boost guage reading at the compressor and one at the intake there will be a difference. And your way off on your pressure theory there, pipe size has nothing to do with turbo efficiency or outlet temp.

 

[Malero5]

the bigger the area, the more air you need to fill up the pipe. Therefor you need to create more pressure to move the air at the same speed. The bigger the piping the slower the air will move in the pipe (that is why you dont need huge IC piping untill you get a much larger turbo, on a 16g iw ould never put anyhitng bigger then 2.5 inch, 2.25 would be ideal.)

 

[SpoOLxExO]

I dont think that is technically correct, but I get the point you're trying to make. If your intake manifold (where the boost gauge is usually tapped) sees 15 psi, then 15 psi is what pressure the turbo is making. The difference in adding a higher flowing IC and larger IC piping is that the turbo doesnt have to work as hard to maintain that same pressure, which increases its efficiency at that pressure level. (Turbo outlet temps are cooler).

Not quite.I know what you said is not technically correct, but I wouldn't break your balls over it!

As Gixxrman has said, pipe size has nothing to do with outlet temps and/or pressure.

The bottom line is, OBVIOUSLY get a front mount. There should be no more disscussion. Any front mount is better then the stock sidemount, period.

So run out and get one, and tell us how its coming!

 

[Brandon92DSM]

Im going to test this by hooking up my boost gauge at the turbo j-pipe instead of the TB port to see if thats true. If it is I appologize, but I dont see how we disagree that the turbo outlet temps will be affected by how much total pressure drop is seen across the intake system. (And I was thinking mostly of the IC core here, not the pipes.)

By your theory, the stock intake system might have a total pressure drop of say, 4 psi, meaning if you wanted to see 15psi at the intake, the turbo would need to be spinning fast enough to make 19psi.

If total pressure drop were now only 1.5psi, the turbo would only need to make 16.5psi to see 15psi at the intake. I think the inherent advantage of this would be obvious to any of us..the turbo's overall efficiency range is improved.

 

[BoBbOrAzE]

hey man im in a similar situation as you and im going to be purchasing an evo 16g. If your gonna do custom piping id say you should consider an evo intercooler, theres plenty of owners upgrading and selling cheap plus its a potent fmic for the 16g at least.

 

[SpoOLxExO]

Im going to test this by hooking up my boost gauge at the turbo j-pipe instead of the TB port to see if thats true. If it is I appologize, but I dont see how we disagree that the turbo outlet temps will be affected by how much total pressure drop is seen across the intake system. (And I was thinking mostly of the IC core here, not the pipes.)
By your theory, the stock intake system might have a total pressure drop of say, 4 psi, meaning if you wanted to see 15psi at the intake, the turbo would need to be spinning fast enough to make 19psi.

It's not my thread, hi-jack away!

The starion unit is good for moderate upgrade over stock.

Even though the unit is bigger, and placed in the front, it has a pressure drop of 4psi!

That means if your turbo is making 15psi, the manifold only sees 11.

But still a good budget upgrade over stock if you can get the piping run.

Here I am talking only about the Starion Front mount core. This particular core has a psi drop of 4psi. The stock system is only 1.5. Its not "My theory" its fact.

Besides I hate repeating myself, it makes me look like a schizophrenic. !

If total pressure drop were now only 1.5psi, the turbo would only need to make 16.5psi to see 15psi at the intake. I think the inherent advantage of this would be obvious to any of us..the turbo's overall efficiency range is improved.

You are on the right track, but if the stock core is already heat-soaked by 3rd gear, pressure drop has less of an impact.
And when your intercooler is heatsoaked the global efficiency of your turbo become Dramtically* decreased.


This is not a debateable issue, the bigger intercooler the better. People who cry about lag and efficiency are magazineracing.

Anyfront mounted intercooler is better than the stock sidemount, period. That is what this whole Topic is about. Thats all I'm saying.

 

[dsm-onster]

I've been viewing this thread for a while now... To the original poster, since you said, "I'm fine with any ideas", I would suggest water injection too. It's no more of a bandaid than an intercooler. If the intercooler wasn't there then you'd have to retune or you'd get knock. You'll never run out of water in the middle of a run if you check before you run. or check at every gas up. I use around 1 gallon per fillup i have a 2 gallon container. Besides for half the price of a decent FMIC you can get a really nice water/alky kit that has safety devices that let you know when you're low. Hell, i used a hobbs switch and a solenoid and have set it so that if there is no water pressure in the water line then boost my boost valve is bypassed. $50. safety.

And if you want a bigger turbo, more boost, or any combination thereof all you will need to do is add another nozzle or get a bigger nozzle. $10-20. room for growth.

 

[deusxmachina]

not to hijack your thread,but why is the starion fmic not a good one?

Simply put, "because it sucks." Just because something mounts in the front doesn't mean it's good. Some guys went backwards using that junk over a stocker.

If you're cheap, do a cheap front-mount or a Supra. I can't see bothering with anything else. Those Johnny Racecar cores are ok enough, but you can get something similar but bar and plate for a similar price if you look around and if you care. One advantage of using a Supra is that, since it's hidden, fewer people want to steal stuff off your car if you park outside.

A 14b at 17psi doesn't need an upgraded intercooler in Wisconsin except maybe during July. This week is all 90 degrees, so that gets rough on the stocker. A Supra or better is great, but other than during summer, I don't think it matters all that much around here with a 14b or even a 16g up to a point.

That was funny, by the way... the first person that said WI is a band-aid, I thought he meant Wisconsin's moderate weather. ahahahaha. ...Ok, I guess you had to be there.

Oh yeah, whoever told you that a big front-mount would be too much for a 14b, don't ask him for advice anymore.