DSM LINK question

[danyz250f]

I am going to get link as soon as I sell my safc. But I was wondering if you can change the stock boost guage to read knock? Just like my chip does now. The site says you can change it to other guages but it does not list knock?

 

[FORMONTOYA]

Straight from DSMLink.........

Some digging in the archives produced this for the 2G boost gauge. I am honestly not sure if this translates directly for the 1G, but it should.

			Bottom    Center    Top
Stock                   Stock     Stock     Stock
Coolant (degrees F)      172       200       227
Battery (volts)          11.7      14.0      16.3
Front O2 (volts)         0.0       0.5       1.0
Rear O2 (volts)          0.0       0.5       1.0
LTFT (%)                -12.5      0.0      +12.5
Knock Retard (degrees)    0        11        22
TPS (volts)              0.0       2.5       5.0
Timing (degrees BTDC)     0       25.5        51
ISCPosition               0        64        128

Thomas Dorris

 

[danyz250f]

So when you get a knock number, that means it is retarding timing that number of degrees?

 

[Kevin Jewer]

With DSMlink displaying Knock Retard, yes.

 

[slipstream808]

Hmmmmm, so that isn't counts of knock but retard in degrees. Didn't know that.

 

[andymoraitis]

I was always a bit confused by that since so many Link users will say something like "I had 2 degrees of knock retard" while I'm more used to seeing a physical knock figure on the boost gauge. To translate that for a 2G, it works like this:

1-6 counts of knock: no timing retard
7 counts of knock: timing is held
10 counts of knock: 1 degree is pulled
13 counts of knock: 2 degrees are pulled, etc up to 43 maximum counts

In general, the ECU pulls one degree of timing at 10 counts and then an additional degree for every additional 3 counts. So if someone tells you they're getting 4 degrees of knock retard, that's 19 counts of knock. Please note that since the 1G timing curve is more aggressive, the ECU is more watchful of knock and will pull timing sooner than in a 2G.

On a pump gas tune, I like to find the limit for my tune (2-3 counts) and then add a bit of fuel back in to bring it to zero. Since pump gas quality can vary I really don't want to take the chance and run any knock on a consistent basis but I do like to know that my tune is still making me maximum safe power.

Hope that makes sense,

Andy

 

[FORMONTOYA]

And to add.........probably some DSMLink users don't know exactly what they're looking at in the beginning. With DSMLink (2G, not sure about 1G) you actually can have 2 knock values displayed in the log.........raw knock and knock retard.

I think on occasion some people get confused and think raw knock (knock count) is knock retard (timing being pulled). Which is NOT the case.

 

[Steve93Talon]

I was always a bit confused by that since so many Link users will say something like "I had 2 degrees of knock retard" while I'm more used to seeing a physical knock figure on the boost gauge. To translate that for a 2G, it works like this:

1-6 counts of knock: no timing retard
7 counts of knock: timing is held
10 counts of knock: 1 degree is pulled
13 counts of knock: 2 degrees are pulled, etc up to 43 maximum counts

In general, the ECU pulls one degree of timing at 10 counts and then an additional degree for every additional 3 counts. So if someone tells you they're getting 4 degrees of knock retard, that's 19 counts of knock. Please note that since the 1G timing curve is more aggressive, the ECU is more watchful of knock and will pull timing sooner than in a 2G.

Not exactly. DSMlink pulls about .3 degrees of timing for every "count" of knock, starting with the first count. I've argued with Tom and Dave that this is not how the stock ECU (at least 1G) works, posted links referring to how we've always interpreted knock retard, and yet they insist that they haven't touched the stock code in relation to how timing is pulled during knock. I've found with DSMlink that if you get ANY knock, the car starts to feel slower and I can actually feel it get slower immediately, whereas on the stock ECU I could log several counts with no difference in feel. None of the users on DSMlink forums seem to know any better.

 

[danyz250f]

Not exactly. DSMlink pulls about .3 degrees of timing for every "count" of knock, starting with the first count. I've argued with Tom and Dave that this is not how the stock ECU (at least 1G) works, posted links referring to how we've always interpreted knock retard, and yet they insist that they haven't touched the stock code in relation to how timing is pulled during knock. I've found with DSMlink that if you get ANY knock, the car starts to feel slower and I can actually feel it get slower immediately, whereas on the stock ECU I could log several counts with no difference in feel. None of the users on DSMlink forums seem to know any better.

I dont know how the stock ecu was, but with my chip I can feel 5 counts easy. I dont even have to look at the boost guage to tell. I can just feel it get slower. I think this thread has cleared up alot of confusion.

I am stoked to get link after I sell my safc.

 

[FORMONTOYA]

Not exactly. DSMlink pulls about .3 degrees of timing for every "count" of knock, starting with the first count. I've argued with Tom and Dave that this is not how the stock ECU (at least 1G) works, posted links referring to how we've always interpreted knock retard, and yet they insist that they haven't touched the stock code in relation to how timing is pulled during knock. I've found with DSMlink that if you get ANY knock, the car starts to feel slower and I can actually feel it get slower immediately, whereas on the stock ECU I could log several counts with no difference in feel. None of the users on DSMlink forums seem to know any better.

I would tend to agree.........I also believe it's not just a static "count" number, but that duration plays into it as well.

For example.....just a 2-4 counts of knock spike will show no signs in regards to timing being pulled. However, lets say 4 counts of knock that last for 1 second or so (haven't really looked hard, just know that it's longer than a spike), timing will start to be pulled.

Just something I've noticed in the logs running DSMLink.

 

[Kevin Jewer]

The ECU self-learns what level of noise is considered normal, so on a noisy motor, I would assume you could see lots of raw knock and not see any retard.